I played a really big pot with ace high

[ansky451]

Party NL400. Villain has been sort of active, but hasnt shown herself to be crazy or anything like that.

Folds to me in the SB (a little over 400 in my stack) I raise to 12, with AQo (black) BB calls.

flop (24): 2 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif 3 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif 3 /images/graemlins/heart.gif. I bet 16 she calls.

Turn (56) 7 /images/graemlins/spade.gif. I check, she bets 40 I call.

river (136) 9 /images/graemlins/spade.gif I check she bets 100 I call.


Thoughts?

[hectorjelly]

Wrong Forum

[Garland]

[ QUOTE ]
but hasnt shown herself

[/ QUOTE ]

How do you know it's a her?

[ QUOTE ]
but hasnt shown herself to be crazy or anything like that.

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]

flop (24): 2 3 3 . I bet 16 she calls.

Turn (56) 7 . I check, she bets 40 I call.

river (136) 9 I check she bets 100 I call.

[/ QUOTE ]

Why are you playing a big pot with A high against someone you said doesn't get out of line?

[ QUOTE ]
Thoughts?

[/ QUOTE ]

Why isn't this in the small stakes forum? That is unless you both have $800 or something, but you didn't mention that.

Garland

[DonButtons]

[ QUOTE ]
Party NL400. Villain has been sort of active, but hasnt shown herself to be crazy or anything like that.

Folds to me in the SB (a little over 400 in my stack) I raise to 12, with AQo (black) BB calls.

flop (24): 2 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif 3 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif 3 /images/graemlins/heart.gif. I bet 16 she calls.

Turn (56) 7 /images/graemlins/spade.gif. I check, she bets 40 I call.

river (136) 9 /images/graemlins/spade.gif I check she bets 100 I call.


Thoughts?

[/ QUOTE ]

Preflop, raise more, I like raising the pot, or sticking to a standard 15 open raise in nl 400...no reason to raise less when out of position to induce a call by the big blind...

Flop ok

Turn, shutdown...check/fold, hope for free showdown

In nl 400 this seems the wrong way to go to beat the game...just cause you won this time, doesn't mean its profitable, and if people see you make borderline calls, they can make your life harsh.

[captZEEbo1]

I like it.

This is fine

[ansky451]

Sorry didn't know which forum to go to, im a stupid MTTer.

[hectorjelly]

I used to be one of those too. I like how you played it and I call the river as well if Id called the turn. I usually fold the turn though.

[captZEEbo1]

I guess I'll add why I like it...a lot people call this flop with VERY little (even 2 just overs) since they think you didn't hit it. If they did have SOME sort of draw, nothing hit, except something like 9x/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, but there's a reasonable chance they don't value bet that much on river.

[ansky451]

Oh, and if it changes anything, this was 6 max.

[Lucky]

[ QUOTE ]
I guess I'll add why I like it...a lot people call this flop with VERY little (even 2 just overs) since they think you didn't hit it. If they did have SOME sort of draw, nothing hit, except something like 9x/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, but there's a reasonable chance they don't value bet that much on river.

[/ QUOTE ]

While this may be the play in the bigger games in which you play, its not the thing to do in NL 2/4 IMHO. I think poster is beaten every time in this passive game. People dont really make moves here. You just play solid cards and bust donks.

[captZEEbo1]

[ QUOTE ]
While this may be the play in the bigger games in which you play, its not the thing to do in NL 2/4 IMHO. I think poster is beaten every time in this passive game. People dont really make moves here. You just play solid cards and bust donks.

[/ QUOTE ]are you saying he has trips or boat 100% of the time here? In which case you'd advocate folding AA here?

[ansky451]

My thoughts on the hand...

Preflop his range is practically any 2 decent cards. Then on the flop, well, it didn't improve very many hands, but he really could have called with A high, Kigh even, or just 2 random cards with the intention of pushing me off my (likely) ace high on a later street. I thought flush draw might raise, but also could just be peeling one to see what I do on the turn before putting in a semi bluff.

So the turn is a fairly meaningless card. When I check, I feel like he is betting no matter what here, and only the weakest of players wouldnt take a stab here if their hand lacked showdown value (flush draw, 45, king high even). So I called with the intention of reevaluating on the river.

The river was the offsuit 9, which completed no draws whatsoever, and then she bet 100. I thought with a mediocre hand (just a pair) she would check behind and hope for a free showdown, so I sort of ruled out 9x or 7x. I figured it was either a stone bluff, ie missed diamonds, 54 etc, or a monster- trips, FH etc.

Where is my logic flawed?

[captZEEbo1]

[ QUOTE ]
Where is my logic flawed?

[/ QUOTE ]
it's not, I agree with you almost all the way around. Trip 3s value bets (but more unlikely given preflop raise) and 7s probably shows down...
one thing you didn't mention is that if he didn't reraise with a pocket pair 77+ he'd likely value bet it on river (except MAYBE 88).

[AceHiStation]

I got excited, I thought you played a big pot with AceHi(me) ... not AceHigh...

...I like the hand though

[AdamBragar]

It's really cool when you win this hand. But wouldn't it suck if you lost to 3x, 22, 77, 99-AA or AKd. I'd give up on the turn here because there's such a wide range of hands beating you and very few people reraise preflop when it's folded around to the SB.

[ansky451]

She tabled 5 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif8 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif and MHIG

To the people who said fold, I'd like to hear why you think my analysis is wrong...

I posted this because even though i was right this time, I think she has a hand enough times for this to be an incorrect call sometimes. I'm more concerned with my thought process than the actual hand she had.

[MTBlue]

Effective odds. You are hand is certainly good here a certain percentage of the time but you ended up paying 140 to win 196. So the villain has to be firing a two barrel stone called bluff 40% of time. Not a likely a scenario. Don't get me wrong I'm made a some sick call downs with A high but its not my default play. In general you need position and a tell to make this a good play. OOP this is just chip spewing. If you really think you have the best hand raise all-in on the end. Villain is hard pressed to call without KK+ and it folds 70% of the hands that beat you and value bet this river.