QQ

[2PAUL2]

villain is 29/9/4 over 200 hands and seems one of the more solid players ive encountered at 100nl 6 max.

i really hate calling down like this but dont see any other way to play it that i particularly like.

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ BB (6 max, 6 handed) pokerhand.org hand converter (http://www.pokerhand.org)

Hero ($283.35)
MP ($100.70)
CO ($162.50)
Button ($46.19)
SB ($124.03)
BB ($54.69)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with Q/images/graemlins/spade.gif, Q/images/graemlins/heart.gif. SB posts a blind of $0.50.
<font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to $4</font>, <font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, SB (poster) calls $3.50, BB calls $3.

Flop: ($12) T/images/graemlins/heart.gif, J/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 8/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets $10</font>, BB folds, Hero calls $10.

Turn: ($32) T/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets $20</font>, Hero calls $20.

River: ($72) 8/images/graemlins/diamond.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets $30</font>, Hero calls $30.

Final Pot: $132

anyone raise flop?
as played anyone fold turn or river?
if villain pushes river does anyone call? i had decided on turn that i wasnt folding to a blank river

thanks

paul

[xorbie]

How to play this hand depends entirely on whether he's more likely to have AJ here than 67/images/graemlins/heart.gif.

[awarunn]

I say raise the flop. I'm guessing AJ after seeing the whole hand but as xorbie said, it would be nice to know if he's the type to play 67s off the BB to a raise and then bet the draw. But with only those stats to go with I would guess AJ and raise the flop, take control and bet as long as there isn't much resistance.

[2PAUL2]

AJ

Raise the flop and define your hand. If he's on middle pair and a solid player, he'll probably let it go. If not, you know what's going to happen. Spend $30 now and possibly save the $50 you're going to spend in the showdown.

[The_Bends]

AJ or a set IMO. Raise the flop and find you saving the money later. If you raise the flop either

He folds, fine
He calls, worrying but if he checks the turn you can fire again/check behind depending on how often you think he's on the draw
He checks and leads the turn, ok, you fold the turn becuase its almost certainly a set
He reraises, you run away quickly with your one pair

[2PAUL2]

to all those saying raise this guy definitely folds KJ and possibly AJ if i raise the flop. he is also cpable of moving in with something like A /images/graemlins/heart.gifK /images/graemlins/heart.gif. does that change anything.

thanks

paul

Anyone is capable of moving in with AKh on that flop. You're stupid if you don't holding overcards and a royal draw.

[Gugel]

JT suited is a real possibility here. You definetly want to reraise the flop to around 30 and go from there.

[soah]

I may raise the turn to $60 and fold unimproved to further action if I think I'm ahead.

[2PAUL2]

you would fold getting 4/1?

i would like this line if his stack was deeper an i could fold to a turn push.

as to his actual stack size i think the consesus saying raise the flop are probably right.

paul

[Sifmole]

[ QUOTE ]
I may raise the turn to $60 and fold unimproved to further action if I think I'm ahead.

[/ QUOTE ]

So your line is to lose just as much but not get a showdown?

How much does it mitigate the situation that YOU know there is no way he could have the royal b/c you hold the Q /images/graemlins/heart.gif?

My answer - none.

Can we play heads up?

[2PAUL2]

i read this board alot an challenging soah to a heads up match would not be +ev. im pretty sure he got confused with stack sizes as hes one of the best posters on here.

paul

[soah]

[ QUOTE ]
you would fold getting 4/1?

i would like this line if his stack was deeper an i could fold to a turn push.

as to his actual stack size i think the consesus saying raise the flop are probably right.

paul

[/ QUOTE ]

If you raise the flop he folds hands that are way behind and continues with hands that either beat you or have outs against you. The pot will be huge and you will have no idea what cards you want to see on the turn and river. If a heart comes will you push the turn? What about a queen? If you check the turn, do you call him on the river? You have no idea which cards make his hand. Or maybe he had you on the flop... you don't know. And it will likely cost you your stack to find the answer.

If you raise the turn and he pushes then you can fold. He certainly has you beaten and your gutshot may not even be clean. So you give up a two outer if you're behind, but you force him off of a five-outer if you're ahead or you charge him more to draw at some sort of straight/flush combo draw. If you're usually ahead in this spot then it seems you get the best end of the deal. Although this is not factoring in the times that he may bet again on the river with the worst hand. But do you really want to call a big bet on the end? It's actually bad for you if he'll bet these hands again, because that would make his bluffing percentage fairly close to optimal according to game theory (the majority of hands firing the third barrel can beat an overpair). That is not a profitable situation for you.

[soah]

[ QUOTE ]
i read this board alot an challenging soah to a heads up match would not be +ev. im pretty sure he got confused with stack sizes as hes one of the best posters on here.

paul

[/ QUOTE ]

My line may work better if he were deeper, but after he bets the turn he still has $90 left... I'm assuming he is not going to shove that in the pot just for the hell of it? Getting 4:1 to call may sound good, but how often do you expect to win if he puses there? His stats look a lot like mine and if I pushed there I'd have the best hand more than 90% of the time and a straight flush draw the rest of the time. Now if your read on him says he is likely to push with a worse hand and you cannot fold to him, then sure, just call him down... but from your description of him I've assumed that if all his money goes in the pot on the turn, he can beat a pair.

[2PAUL2]

[ QUOTE ]
If you raise the flop he folds hands that are way behind and continues with hands that either beat you or have outs against you

[/ QUOTE ]

this was my thinking. it just seems like i might as well have 72o if i raise flop.

[ QUOTE ]
If you raise the turn and he pushes then you can fold. He certainly has you beaten and your gutshot may not even be clean.

[/ QUOTE ]

i think uve sold me on raising the turn. its just it would suck to fold for 50 in a 190 pot.

[ QUOTE ]
Although this is not factoring in the times that he may bet again on the river with the worst hand.

[/ QUOTE ]

if he calls a raise on the turn i am dead against this player. he would drop draws an all made hands i beat so river would be easy fold.

thanks

paul

[2PAUL2]

[ QUOTE ]
My line may work better if he were deeper, but after he bets the turn he still has $90 left... I'm assuming he is not going to shove that in the pot just for the hell of it? Getting 4:1 to call may sound good, but how often do you expect to win if he puses there? His stats look a lot like mine and if I pushed there I'd have the best hand more than 90% of the time and a straight flush draw the rest of the time. Now if your read on him says he is likely to push with a worse hand and you cannot fold to him, then sure, just call him down... but from your description of him I've assumed that if all his money goes in the pot on the turn, he can beat a pair.


[/ QUOTE ]

thanks this makes sense

paul

[KowCiller]

[ QUOTE ]
Can we play heads up?

[/ QUOTE ]

You would get obliterated

[2PAUL2]

he had AJ if anyones interested

thanks

paul