55 Hand

PP $10 daily tournament, 120 players left out of field of 1800+. My stack size is 11700. Ten handed, I have 55 in 3rd position. Usually this is a fold for me, but the table was a tighter than usual one. I had not been active recently. A few orbits ago, i showed AA and 88 after i raised pf in LP.

I rose to 2500, folded to bb (17k), who calls. Flop comes T-A-6 rainbow. He checks practically before the flop comes out. I check.

Turn is an Ace, he bets 3000 after 3 seconds. Pot size was 5500. I have 9.2k left and raise mininum to 6k. He comes over the top of me.

After he makes the bet of 3k, do you put him on an ace? He bet awfully quick. I felt my opponent was perceptive and he would've layed down something like KT or something like 99. I think most of the time, i fold, but he checked scared on the flop and bet strangely on the turn. My gut told me to raise. Do you make this turn raise? Should I have folded? Should I have called the turn? If i called the turn, what should i do if he bets the river, i.e. up to how much would you call?

[dmk]

bet the flop

don't minraise the turn. its absolutely pointless. if you think you're ahead, push. don't do this minraise 2/3 my stack so i can fold the other 1/3 if i have to crap.

there's no way he's folding a T after you check the flop and the turn pairs the A. you are less likely to have an A now, especially after you fail to bet the flop.

when you're playing this hand, think of what you'd like to have had on the flop. AK? ok, what do you do w/ AK on the flop here? probably bet 3k-4k? so bet it. if you get raised you can fold. he may have folded a T on the flop, there's no way he is on the turn now.

given your flop check, you have to fold the turn.

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when you're playing this hand, think of what you'd like to have had on the flop. AK? ok, what do you do w/ AK on the flop here? probably bet 3k-4k? so bet it. if you get raised you can fold. he may have folded a T on the flop, there's no way he is on the turn now.


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Again, I figured him to be a perceptive opponent. Against a perceptive opponent, if i bet 3k on flop or jam on the turn, as you suggested, it really wouldn't look much like AK at all. If I hold AK on that flop, a bet of 3 or 4k is a clear mistake, I check behind on that flop, hoping he'll bluff/bet a weaker hand on the turn. If I had trips on the turn, i wouldn't jam, i'd raise the min, so he'd call. From his POV, when I raise to 6k, he's pretty sure all of my 9k is going in. I would've probably checked JJ-KK on this flop too, these are possible holdings that i would've played this same way.

[dmk]

it doesn't matter how perceptive someone is. they're not folding a T on the turn. period.

If I held TK against a pf raiser from EP whose only recently showed hands were 88 and AA in LP, I would lay down to a raise to 6k on a board of T-A-6-A, no flush possibilities, i'd have to think i'm beat. Incidentally, he had an ace (which I think he played very well). And, IMO, your responses are somewhat rude. I don't know if that's your intent, but if you're going to provide such responses, i'd prefer if you didn't post.

[dmk]

the intent isn't to be rude, i'm just trying to be as concise and convincing as possible, because you don't seem to be grasping some basic principles.

your commentary isn't matching up anywhere. if he is the type of player that is going to lay down KT given the action so far, then he's the type of player that wouldn't have even called the raise PF. on top of that, he also would have folded to your bet on the flop.

now, if this is the case, you absolutely 100% have to bet on the flop. this allows you to fold to his check/raise or shutdown on the turn if he calls. instead, you have committed yourself (and again, a minraise is horrible here, you should simply be pushing if you're going to raise) against someone that you identified as only calling w/ an A. also, these types of players aren't likely to bluff off chips, so again, why raise the turn?

i just hope you can take 3 things from this:
1) you have to bet this flop
2) the turn minraise is horrible
3) he is not folding a T on the turn. ever. and if you are villian, and you fold a T w/ that same exact action, you need to re-evaluate your game.

you posted the hand looking for advice, but instead you're arguing for every aspect of your play. open up your mind a little bit. also, if blinds were 6/12, you should probably fold or push. the raise to 25 is way too awkward given your stack.

I concede. KT should not even be in his calling range if my assumption was correct. I felt the turn raise was awful.

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you don't seem to be grasping some basic principles.

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Charming. /images/graemlins/crazy.gif

[ghostface]

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when you're playing this hand, think of what you'd like to have had on the flop. AK? ok, what do you do w/ AK on the flop here? probably bet 3k-4k? so bet it. if you get raised you can fold. he may have folded a T on the flop, there's no way he is on the turn now.


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Again, I figured him to be a perceptive opponent. Against a perceptive opponent, if i bet 3k on flop or jam on the turn, as you suggested, it really wouldn't look much like AK at all. If I hold AK on that flop, a bet of 3 or 4k is a clear mistake, I check behind on that flop, hoping he'll bluff/bet a weaker hand on the turn. If I had trips on the turn, i wouldn't jam, i'd raise the min, so he'd call. From his POV, when I raise to 6k, he's pretty sure all of my 9k is going in. I would've probably checked JJ-KK on this flop too, these are possible holdings that i would've played this same way.

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No.

[nath]

Yeah I don't agree with any of OP's line or reasoning.
How will a flop bet not look like AK? Is the table so trappy that people slowplaying top pair is the norm, not the exception?

You seem to be inventing an intricate chain of logic that BB might follow in order to justify a nonsensical, ineffective line.

My line is probably to open push preflop, although you didn't even tell us what blinds/antes were so I can't really say. It's not sound tournament strategy to give away your stack little by little.