Weird 10/20 hand

[dark_horse]

Live 10/20 game, 7 handed. It's loose, but I have no read on the player I'm in with, other than he didn't play many hands and I was only at the table for about 45 minutes when this came up. My initial read was that he was a solid player.

He limps from early/middle, and I raise from middle/late with QQ. BB calls, limper calls. Flop comes ace high and two small cards, rainbow, very disconnected board.

Limper bets, I raise, BB folds, limper 3bets, I flash my queens and fold.
He looks down at his hole cards, raises his eyebrows, and mucks his cards.

"Did I have the best hand?" I asked.
"Yes."

I didn't believe him, thinking he said it to set up a future play, only because his play wouldn't make any sense if he didn't have me beat unless he was a maniac. But then less than 10 minutes later he gets up and cashes out and leaves. Not sure if he was intending to leave when he said that, but if he was, he must have been honest as there's no point in lying unless he plans on seeing me there in the future (I'm not a regular at this place).

Was my line ok? I can't call down to the river on this dry board, especially with the BB yet to act, and no good read on villian.

p.s. Is this a post better suited for the B&M forum?

[driverseati]

In hindsight, if you knew he was cashing out, then you could conceivably call him down if you knew him really well. However, given the circumstances, you can't call that down on that board, especially since he limps utg. If I was in your spot, it screams at me A-K, A-Q, or at least A-J at the very minimum, although I would doubt A-J, and tend to lean more toward the A-Q or A-K side of it or even a set, if there's a middle card on board.

I think you played it right given the information you had.

[dark_horse]

Not sure if he was UTG. The players in that game aren't open-limping with AK or AQ from early position, and maybe not even AJ. He probably had a weak ace and was screwing with me, or hit some random two pair, hit his ace with his kicker, or a set. I talked about this with a friend of mine who frequents this game, and told me that I'd be surprised to see that people are screwing around a lot, trying to move you off a hand that you're representing. Personally, if I'm going to bluff, I'm not going to do it there. But I'm not crazy and different people play for different reasons.

[Alex/Mugaaz]

[ QUOTE ]
Not sure if he was UTG. The players in that game aren't open-limping with AK or AQ from early position, and maybe not even AJ. He probably had a weak ace and was screwing with me, or hit some random two pair, hit his ace with his kicker, or a set. I talked about this with a friend of mine who frequents this game, and told me that I'd be surprised to see that people are screwing around a lot, trying to move you off a hand that you're representing. Personally, if I'm going to bluff, I'm not going to do it there. But I'm not crazy and different people play for different reasons.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think he was full of it.

[goofball]

Meh. He bet 3bet you, the PF raiser, on an A high flop? He likely has you beat. If you want to get to showdown here jsut call call call.

[SNOWBALL138]

This is a tough hand. Its hard to put the 3 bettor on anything you can beat. Even if he has a flush draw, thats not exactly music to your ears with 2 cards to come. You have 2 players showing strength on an ace high board after you showed strength before and on the flop. I fold. Also, the pot isn't that big.
Its pretty expensive to keep people honest w/ no reads in a shorthanded pot.

[stillbr]

Your flop raise makes no sense. Either fold to his bet, or call, call, call.

[dopp16]

the flop raise makes plenty of sense---If someone shows preflop aggression and say I hold something like 99, and the board is A high shorthanded, I will usually check raise the flop hoping for him to lay down a higher PP. That is pretty standard in a tight game, If you get three-bet its a fold

[stillbr]

[ QUOTE ]
the flop raise makes plenty of sense---If someone shows preflop aggression and say I hold something like 99, and the board is A high shorthanded, I will usually check raise the flop hoping for him to lay down a higher PP. That is pretty standard in a tight game, If you get three-bet its a fold

[/ QUOTE ]

Having say 99 is a totally different situation then having QQ. Do you see why? What is it that you are trying to accomplishing by raising QQ here?????? Think about it before you respond.

[HajiShirazu]

Raising the flop is just bad. You either want him to keep betting, or he has a hand that beats yours and will never fold. If he is a super aggro, then raise and call down a 3 bet. But the worst part of this hand is showing after you fold. Raising the flop here and folding to a 3-bet is horrible for your table image anyway, but to show that you can fold legitimate hands just because there are scare cards on the board is just the type of thing that is going to make bad players play well against you.

[dark_horse]

[ QUOTE ]
Raising the flop is just bad. You either want him to keep betting, or he has a hand that beats yours and will never fold. If he is a super aggro, then raise and call down a 3 bet.

[/ QUOTE ]

If he's super aggressive and I know that, I'm definitely either raising/calling down, or just calling down. But as I said, I had no reads.

Call down with the BB yet to act to the limper's bet? I'm either folding or raising. If it were heads up I might just call down. Perhaps calling and waiting to see what the BB did would have been fine as well, and if BB folds, I can call down from there. But if I raised and BB calls (or raises), I know I'm done. But again, with no reads, it's a risky/weak play to just call here, as you have no idea where you stand in this 3way pot. I'd rather raise with the ace showing in a 3way pot. In a WA/WB situation, I'm calling down only heads up. I was the PFR after someone limped. I must have a decend hand.

A lot of players like to donk the flop to test their 2nd pair or middle pair or whatever, and fold to your raise or slow down. I can't be sure he has an ace when he bets out like that. In fact, if he did have the ace, and I was the PFR, I think he's more likely to check and let me bet, BB call, and he can raise, or just call down if he has an ace with a bad kicker (if he's that kind of player).

I'd rather raise and fold to a 3bet on this dry board, spending one BB, than call down and spend 2.5BB when I'm not likely good. If he's bluffing me there, more power to him as an unknown. Showing my hand was a big mistake; I agree with you there.

[soweak.]

You should raise to get the BB to fold hands that beat you, like weak aces. Folding to a flop 3-bet is a mistake because you're getting about 10:1 to continue to the turn. Folding the turn UI is maybe the best course given your lack of reads and a general loose sense of the table.

[dark_horse]

[ QUOTE ]
You should raise to get the BB to fold hands that beat you, like weak aces. Folding to a flop 3-bet is a mistake because you're getting about 10:1 to continue to the turn. Folding the turn UI is maybe the best course given your lack of reads and a general loose sense of the table.

[/ QUOTE ]

What implied odds do I have with the 10:1 am I trying to hit on the turn to make a call profitable? Perhaps the only reason I see calling here is for table image damage control. I'm 22:1 to hit my set, and if I turn a gutshot, I have nowhere near the odds to see the river.

edit: i'm on drugs, it's impossible to turn a gutshot here.