Why Me?

I was visiting my sister last night for our annual "Six Feet Under" watch a whole season in one day marathon.
During one of the episodes a man's wife slips in the shower and is fatally injured. At the funeral home he says "why is god doing this to me?"

A little perspective. My sister and I were both baptized, confirmed, and attended Catholic schools. We have both been atheists for many years. (if not from the first moments when we could rationally think for ourselves)

So I ask her why this man thinks that god's will was to have that woman die on that particular day in that particular way. She tells me that she thinks that people are just weak and are comforted by the fact that there is some "reason" why things occur, even if those things are very unpleasant.

At the risk of sounding arrogant, I think in some ways I have a unique perspective on this issue. I am a first generation Canadian, raised by immigrants from a devoutly Catholic eastern European country, grew up watching American TV and movies, have visited eastern and western Europe several times, and watch way too much CNN.

From my observation perch, one of the things that confuses me is why such a large proportion of Americans claim to believe in god. It just seems counterintuitive to me. I can understand why the majority of my relatives in eastern Europe believe in god. When your country has been through so much hardship, years and years of wars, communism, etc, the church and belief in god can be very comforting. It strikes me as a mentality where people can survive daily hardships knowing that justice will be served in the end.

However, when I compare statistics between western Europe and the US, I am very puzzled. It seems like Christianity is on the rise in the US, and on the decline in western European countries. I guess the "believer" would say that more and more Americans are seeing the light, and that western Europeans are sliding further and further into the abyss of a decadent life style.

When even "believers" admit there is no proof one way or the other, it seems strange to me that "In god we trust" can be used as some kind of statement of fact, and the president says "god bless America" at the end of a speech. I find it insulting when Canadian politicians mention god in their speeches, have photo-ops attending church on Sunday, and I'm saddened by the fact that public figures who are atheist and/or agnostic mostly keep their thoughts to themselves.

[Trantor]

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However, when I compare statistics between western Europe and the US, I am very puzzled. It seems like Christianity is on the rise in the US, and on the decline in western European countries. I guess the "believer" would say that more and more Americans are seeing the light, and that western Europeans are sliding further and further into the abyss of a decadent life style.

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Western Europe will be the last light to go out if those to the West and East of us continue their slide towards a New Dark Age.

Those who see US's increasing politisation of Christian fundamentalism should realise it is happening not because these people are "more moral", it is because it is just that, politics, and this is just a tool the US right is using to gain more power. Having a President who hears God talking to him must be a "God send" if you will pardon the use of the cliche to the power brokers in this scenario!

I've often wondered if cretins like Rumsfeld and Cheney actually "believe" in god, or it is all just based on a desire to stick it in the rear of the members of the left that they so despise.
I suspect that Dubya is just trying to please daddy, but the others I'm not so sure about.

[Piers]

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However, when I compare statistics between western Europe and the US, I am very puzzled. It seems like Christianity is on the rise in the US, and on the decline in western European countries.

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I suspect it is a critical mass effect. Once the proportion of the area with a particular religious belief gets high enough its inconvenient to have any other belief.

Western European is more diverse religiously than large parts American.

/images/graemlins/smile.gif

http://www.landoverbaptist.org/sermons/votebush.html

[Bigdaddydvo]

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Western Europe will be the last light to go out if those to the West and East of us continue their slide towards a New Dark Age.

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New dark age is a little strong, wouldn't you say? Please provide some of the wide spread examples of how the Christian evangilization of America is suppressing freedom of thought, as I'm hard pressed to come up with any.

[ QUOTE ]

Those who see US's increasing politisation of Christian fundamentalism should realise it is happening not because these people are "more moral", it is because it is just that, politics, and this is just a tool the US right is using to gain more power. Having a President who hears God talking to him must be a "God send" if you will pardon the use of the cliche to the power brokers in this scenario!


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You're so right, politics is the exclusive motivation for people discovering faith. I'm sure it has nothing to do with prayer, scripture reading, personal reflection, or other methods of self discovery.

[bocablkr]

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From my observation perch, one of the things that confuses me is why such a large proportion of Americans claim to believe in god.

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Thankfully, that does not appear to be true on this forum. A lot more even distribution of theist and non-theist. Don't know what that says about poker players in general when compared to the overall population but perhaps they are more reasoned. Western Europe is far more enlightened that the US.

[Bigdaddydvo]

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Western Europe is far more enlightened that the US.

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I'm curious as to the reasoning you use to support this idea.
Does it have anything to do with Western Europe having negative population growth, unbearable taxation, high unemployment, large tarriffs that restrict trade, and an overall underwhelming economic performance?

If so, I agree with you completely.

[bocablkr]

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Western Europe is far more enlightened that the US.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm curious as to the reasoning you use to support this idea.
Does it have anything to do with Western Europe having negative population growth, unbearable taxation, high unemployment, large tarriffs that restrict trade, and an overall underwhelming economic performance?

If so, I agree with you completely.

[/ QUOTE ]

Enlightened does not usually refer to economic policies. By the way, I am all for negative population growth and underwhelming economic performance (compared to us). Who needs another China or India growth problem or another United States economy wasting our planet's resources. If the taxation is so unbearable why aren't they all flocking over here. Our immigration problem is not from Europe. I have met very few people who have visited Western Europe who did not say they were more enlightened that us. Have you?

[Bigdaddydvo]

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Western Europe is far more enlightened that the US.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm curious as to the reasoning you use to support this idea.
Does it have anything to do with Western Europe having negative population growth, unbearable taxation, high unemployment, large tarriffs that restrict trade, and an overall underwhelming economic performance?

If so, I agree with you completely.

[/ QUOTE ]

Enlightened does not usually refer to economic policies. By the way, I am all for negative population growth and underwhelming economic performance (compared to us). Who needs another China or India growth problem or another United States economy wasting our planet's resources. If the taxation is so unbearable why aren't they all flocking over here. Our immigration problem is not from Europe. I have met very few people who have visited Western Europe who did not say they were more enlightened that us. Have you?

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Are you a Socialist?

[bocablkr]

No - only when it comes to health care. But that does not mean I want every country to be the 'great' capitalistic society that we are. The world would be an awful place.

[purnell]

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Western Europe is far more enlightened that the US.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm curious as to the reasoning you use to support this idea.
Does it have anything to do with Western Europe having negative population growth, unbearable taxation, high unemployment, large tarriffs that restrict trade, and an overall underwhelming economic performance?

If so, I agree with you completely.

[/ QUOTE ]

Enlightened does not usually refer to economic policies. By the way, I am all for negative population growth and underwhelming economic performance (compared to us). Who needs another China or India growth problem or another United States economy wasting our planet's resources. If the taxation is so unbearable why aren't they all flocking over here. Our immigration problem is not from Europe. I have met very few people who have visited Western Europe who did not say they were more enlightened that us. Have you?

[/ QUOTE ]

Are you a Socialist?

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/images/graemlins/shocked.gif What if he said yes? Should we send a SWAT team?

[malorum]

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it seems strange to me that "In god we trust" can be used as some kind of statement of fact, and the president says "god bless America" at the end of a speech.

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Strange?? It goes hand in hand with all that going to war.

"Gott mit uns" should be written in our hearts and on our belt buckle.

[Bigdaddydvo]

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Western Europe is far more enlightened that the US.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm curious as to the reasoning you use to support this idea.
Does it have anything to do with Western Europe having negative population growth, unbearable taxation, high unemployment, large tarriffs that restrict trade, and an overall underwhelming economic performance?

If so, I agree with you completely.

[/ QUOTE ]

Enlightened does not usually refer to economic policies. By the way, I am all for negative population growth and underwhelming economic performance (compared to us). Who needs another China or India growth problem or another United States economy wasting our planet's resources. If the taxation is so unbearable why aren't they all flocking over here. Our immigration problem is not from Europe. I have met very few people who have visited Western Europe who did not say they were more enlightened that us. Have you?

[/ QUOTE ]

Are you a Socialist?

[/ QUOTE ]

/images/graemlins/shocked.gif What if he said yes? Should we send a SWAT team?

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No, I just find it remarkable that some people still subscribe to a completely debunked economic system.