Quick game selection question

[RockLobster]

Hi All--

When choosing a table, I used to primarily pay attention to the players / flop. I love to see >35%. Someone (thank you) let me know that you should also be looking for at least 6 BB's for the average pot, which makes a lot of sense. Strangely enough, I often see games that are high in one area, and low in the other (I expected these to go hand-in-hand). Therefore...


Comments encouraged.

[JTG51]

I'd take the loose table. I figure the average pot size isn't as important as the relative looseness of the players. Thats because when I have a hand bets are going to go in on every street. If there are a couple of loose calling stations, the average pots I'm in are going to be bigger than the overall average pot.

Put another way, a table with lots of players seeing the flop but small pots probably means there are lots of free cards being given. I won't be giving any free cards when I have a hand so the average pot I win will probably be bigger than the average pot.

[Al_Capone_Junior]

In general, the looser game with smaller pots is going to be easier to beat than a tighter one with bigger pots. This is of course assuming that the tighter game is not being played by a maniac who's running over the table, scaring everyone out.

One thing here, I think the stats on games can be misleading at times. I'm not sure how, or how often they are calculated, but I often times see them change quite quickly. They're OK for a general guideline, I mean 10% is not desireable, but the difference between 27% and 35% may only reflect very recent play. Also, one or two large pots could cause the average to go up in a game that's not really generating very big pots.

al

[RockLobster]

Hey Al--

I'd certainly be curious about exactly how these stats are calculated, good point. I'll e-mail Paradise Support and see what they say...

[RockLobster]

[RockLobster]

As of this writing, there have been 60 views of this thread, but only 7 votes! I guess I'm just a sucker for polls, I can't fathom reading something and then not taking the time to quickly click an opinion...

[Kurn, son of Mogh]

Table one looks like there's virtually zero pre-flop raising, or is extrememly tight-passive post-flop. I'd worry that playing an normal aggressive game, I'd make the pots go down at table 1. Table 2 looks like I might be able to better manipulate how many opponents I get post-flop and get an easier read on hands. I'd take #2.

[Homer]

I'll take the first one and "I don't think it's close". The first table is loose preflop, but tight postflop. This means that people are seeing the flop with crap and giving up easily if they don't catch. Therefore, you should be able to steal a ton of pots. The second table is fairly tight preflop and aggressive postflop, not a combination that I like.

Note that this will generally be the case and there could be exceptions. For example, it could be that the second table is tight with the exception of one or two players, with the good players taking turns pounding the loosies.

-- Homer

[mrbaseball]

It doesn't matter so I'll take the one where I can sit down first.

Online games change too rapidly. Those stats are pretty much 100% meaningless as the nature of the game has probably already changed before you even sit down.

Here is a challenge. Sit down at any 2/4 table at Paradise and play for 30 minutes. When you first sit down write the name of each player in each seat. Then compare this to the names in each seat after you have been there 30 minutes. Usually a significant portion of the table will have turned over. Sit there for an hour and the odds are no one from when you sat down is still there.

The table stats are old news of no significance and just getting older. They should have no influence on which game you play in.

[biggambler]

If you have smaller pots, but more peole are in the pot that is a nice passive game.

[RockLobster]

OK, you're pretty much right. BUT let's assume that the stats mean something... which would you choose?

[DaBartman]

Choice #1 appears to be a passive game with not much pre-flop raising. In general, this is the game I would prefer unless the passiveness extends to a lot of the players chasing to the river (River Lotto). When I hold a hand in this game, all streets are getting bet, ergo - larger pots. The draw back is I find it much more difficult to know where I'm at in the hand. A lot of the time these type of players will play 86o & KTo the same with a flop of K82. If I'm leading into them it goes bet, call to the river, else if I have position it goes check, bet, call. What the hell do I do with QQ? If I'm first and never get raised, how do I know where I'm at? I seem to do best (and am the most comfortable) in a somewhat tight, passive game. I almost always know where I'm at. I suppose I'm saying I HATE the large fluctuations that can accompony game #1.

PS Those fluctuations occur when I'm not holding cards, the situation is marginal and I usually am unable to save the bets I would normally save in a tighter game. Marginal situations are the great majority of pots. Aw screw it! Give me a wild agressive game with a maniac or two, maybe I'm hold some big through tickets and take 9 racks out of the game!

[RockLobster]

Actually, I found this in the Paradise help files...

The Player (Plrs) column indicates the number of players currently seated at each poker table.

The Average Pot (Avg Pot) column indicates the average pot size over the past 20 hands.

The Players per Flop (Plrs/Flp) column indicates the percentage of players, based on the average of the last 20 hands, that "see the flop".

The Waiting List (Wait) column displays how many players are waiting for that particular poker table. If you are currently waiting for that table it will also show you your position on the waiting list.

The Hands per Hour (H/hr) column displays the number of games dealt the past 60 minutes at that particular poker table.

[Bob T.]

Right, if they are loose and passive, I am where I want to be.

[RockLobster]

Hi All--

Thanks for everyone's comments.

The voting was very close originally. As of the time of this writing there are 20 votes, and Table 1 (looser pre-flop) has a > 2-1 edge. When posting this poll I didn't even think it would be that close.

[Fmonti]

I would take the better percentage in most instances..In the 2nd example a good percentage of that $26.00 pot is your money...