Messianic Jews

[BoxTree]

[Gamblor]

n/m

[BoxTree]

[ QUOTE ]
n/m

[/ QUOTE ]

Jews for Jesus are NOT the same as Messianic Jews.

[daryn]

well, give a definition, or stop being a polltard.

in fact do both

[censored]?

[BoxTree]

Basically, a Messianic Jew follows all of the same customs, traditions, and observances as an Orthodox Jew. But they believe that Jesus is the Messiah. To my knowledge, the only difference between an Orthodox Jewish service and a Messianic Jewish service is that the latter concludes with a reading from Apostles. Crosses, crucifixes, etc. would never be found in a Messianic Jewish temple.

[samjjones]

[ QUOTE ]
Basically, a Messianic Jew follows all of the same customs, traditions, and observances as an Orthodox Jew. But they believe that Jesus is the Messiah. To my knowledge, the only difference between an Orthodox Jewish service and a Messianic Jewish service is that the latter concludes with a reading from Apostles. Crosses, crucifixes, etc. would never be found in a Messianic Jewish temple.

[/ QUOTE ]
I may be wrong, but if you accept Jesus is the Messiah, you are by definition "Christian". No matter what customs you practice.

[daryn]

[ QUOTE ]
Basically, a Messianic Jew follows all of the same customs, traditions, and observances as an Orthodox Jew. But they believe that Jesus is the Messiah. To my knowledge, the only difference between an Orthodox Jewish service and a Messianic Jewish service is that the latter concludes with a reading from Apostles. Crosses, crucifixes, etc. would never be found in a Messianic Jewish temple.

[/ QUOTE ]

so basically what gamblor conveyed to me in three words?

the important thing, do they look as ridiculous? with the curly sideburns and whatnot?

[IndieMatty]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Basically, a Messianic Jew follows all of the same customs, traditions, and observances as an Orthodox Jew. But they believe that Jesus is the Messiah. To my knowledge, the only difference between an Orthodox Jewish service and a Messianic Jewish service is that the latter concludes with a reading from Apostles. Crosses, crucifixes, etc. would never be found in a Messianic Jewish temple.

[/ QUOTE ]

so basically what gamblor conveyed to me in three words?

the important thing, do they look as ridiculous? with the curly sideburns and whatnot?

[/ QUOTE ]

Not at all.

[miajag81]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Basically, a Messianic Jew follows all of the same customs, traditions, and observances as an Orthodox Jew. But they believe that Jesus is the Messiah. To my knowledge, the only difference between an Orthodox Jewish service and a Messianic Jewish service is that the latter concludes with a reading from Apostles. Crosses, crucifixes, etc. would never be found in a Messianic Jewish temple.

[/ QUOTE ]
I may be wrong, but if you accept Jesus is the Messiah, you are by definition "Christian". No matter what customs you practice.

[/ QUOTE ]

Exactly.

[MrMon]

One could make the arguement that the Lubavitchers are Messianic Jews, although this is not a traditional argument. They just have a different Messiah.

[Indiana]

What's a hassidic (spelling?) jew? Funny how most non-jewish americans know so little about jews.

Indy

how is messianic different from jews for Jesus?

[Amid Cent]

[ QUOTE ]
What's a hassidic (spelling?) jew?

[/ QUOTE ]

Hasidic Jews are just one branch of the most Orthodox of Jews. They are the ones you usually see wearing all black outfits (hence, they are sometimes called the "Black-hats".)

[Indiana]

Ah, I see. How many sects of jewish is there? I hope not as many as denominations of christianity.

Indy

[Gamblor]

As in, Jews for Jesus is one of the more popular churches of the Messianic Jew movement.

The Messianic Jews are not Religious Jews. They are, though, ethnic Jews who believe Christ is lord and saviour blah blah blah.

They're entitled, but I just call them Christians who were born Jewish. Sad.

[Gamblor]

there are certainly as many, but they're less formal distinctions. An Orthodox synagogue and a Reform synagogue will have, to a large degree, the same service. The difference is mostly in the degree to which they follow the laws.

Messianic Jews are not really jews to most "jewish" jews.

[MrTrik]

[ QUOTE ]

The Messianic Jews are not Religious Jews. They are, though, ethnic Jews who believe Christ is lord and saviour blah blah blah.


[/ QUOTE ]

If this makes any sense whatsoever, I missed it.

[Blarg]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
What's a hassidic (spelling?) jew?

[/ QUOTE ]

Hasidic Jews are just one branch of the most Orthodox of Jews. They are the ones you usually see wearing all black outfits (hence, they are sometimes called the "Black-hats".)

[/ QUOTE ]

The ones who cross the street when they see you coming, and cross back after you've passed.

[tonypaladino]

One time me and my friend got hammered, and drover through Boro Park (heavily hassidic jewish neighboorhood) spashing water on the hassics and screaming "the power of christ compells you". I'm not proud, it wasn't my idea, but it seemed like a good one after several irish carbombs.

Sorry to hijack.

[TheBlueMonster]

[ QUOTE ]
One could make the arguement that the Lubavitchers are Messianic Jews, although this is not a traditional argument. They just have a different Messiah.

[/ QUOTE ]
I've heard that argument before and I can see some truth to it. But the big difference is they don't worship "The Rebbe" but rather think of him as a messiah.

[TheBlueMonster]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
What's a hassidic (spelling?) jew?

[/ QUOTE ]

Hasidic Jews are just one branch of the most Orthodox of Jews. They are the ones you usually see wearing all black outfits (hence, they are sometimes called the "Black-hats".)

[/ QUOTE ]

The ones who cross the street when they see you coming, and cross back after you've passed.

[/ QUOTE ]
Well I certainly have never seen this happen. Where do you get this?

[TheBlueMonster]

[ QUOTE ]
One time me and my friend got hammered, and drover through Boro Park (heavily hassidic jewish neighboorhood) spashing water on the hassics and screaming "the power of christ compells you". I'm not proud, it wasn't my idea, but it seemed like a good one after several irish carbombs.


[/ QUOTE ]
You are aware that pretty much qualifies as a hate crime?
I have a sense of humor about most things, but not this. /images/graemlins/frown.gif

[TheMainEvent]

[ QUOTE ]
how is messianic different from jews for Jesus?

[/ QUOTE ]

Well they don't have such a silly name for one

[Leo99]

hate crime? It's a crime to splash water on someone?

That should be in a movie. It's pretty funny.

I got a phone call from someone saying they represented the Messianic Jews. My caller ID read Jews for Jesus.

Is there such a thing as Christians for Muhammad?

[TheBlueMonster]

[ QUOTE ]
hate crime? It's a crime to splash water on someone?

That should be in a movie. It's pretty funny.

I got a phone call from someone saying they represented the Messianic Jews. My caller ID read Jews for Jesus.

Is there such a thing as Christians for Muhammad?

[/ QUOTE ]
I could see you getting arrested for assault. The law doesn't f-around when it comes to things that could be construed as hate crimes. Especially in NY.

And the Christians for Muhamed comment was great.

[Blarg]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
What's a hassidic (spelling?) jew?

[/ QUOTE ]

Hasidic Jews are just one branch of the most Orthodox of Jews. They are the ones you usually see wearing all black outfits (hence, they are sometimes called the "Black-hats".)

[/ QUOTE ]

The ones who cross the street when they see you coming, and cross back after you've passed.

[/ QUOTE ]
Well I certainly have never seen this happen. Where do you get this?

[/ QUOTE ]

Encino, a neighborhood in the Valley in L.A. Heavily Jewish, and I've seen it dozens of times, as I used to visit friends there a couple times a week for many years. Also similar behavior, like seeing them step away from selecting fruits and vegetables in the supermarket whenever someone else comes up. And I've gotten sour looks out of them, too, as if I'm unclean or something. And I'm a real Clark Kent looking guy, too, quiet and well-groomed, so it's not like I look threatening in any way, or even so much as loud. Other friends have noticed the same thing, as well as dirty aned disgusted looks from them, and we've gotten a few chuckles together, too, seeing them cross the street as soon as they see a non-Hassidim walking down the same sidewalk, then crossing back again. Seriously, we're real mild-mannered, polite young guys(or we were, back when my friends lived there); kinda sad how people isolate themselves that way.

[TheBlueMonster]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
What's a hassidic (spelling?) jew?

[/ QUOTE ]

Hasidic Jews are just one branch of the most Orthodox of Jews. They are the ones you usually see wearing all black outfits (hence, they are sometimes called the "Black-hats".)

[/ QUOTE ]

The ones who cross the street when they see you coming, and cross back after you've passed.

[/ QUOTE ]
Well I certainly have never seen this happen. Where do you get this?

[/ QUOTE ]

Encino, a neighborhood in the Valley in L.A. Heavily Jewish, and I've seen it dozens of times, as I used to visit friends there a couple times a week for many years. Also similar behavior, like seeing them step away from selecting fruits and vegetables in the supermarket whenever someone else comes up. And I've gotten sour looks out of them, too, as if I'm unclean or something. And I'm a real Clark Kent looking guy, too, quiet and well-groomed, so it's not like I look threatening in any way, or even so much as loud. Other friends have noticed the same thing, as well as dirty aned disgusted looks from them, and we've gotten a few chuckles together, too, seeing them cross the street as soon as they see a non-Hassidim walking down the same sidewalk, then crossing back again. Seriously, we're real mild-mannered, polite young guys(or we were, back when my friends lived there); kinda sad how people isolate themselves that way.

[/ QUOTE ]
well this makes me slightly ashamed of my religion.
BUT... there might be other circumstances. If it was a woman at the grocery store moving away from you then it might be because they aren't allowed to touch men that aren't there husband. But if it's men at the supermarket then they're just acting like asses.

[jstnrgrs]

From my perspective (i.e. a Christian's prespective), there is no reason that a person cannot be both jewish and christian, and this is how I think of messianic Jews.

For those of you who don't know, Jesus, and all of his apostles were Jewish, and they never renounced their Judiasm. So, I guess, they would have been messianic jews.

[TheBlueMonster]

[ QUOTE ]
From my perspective (i.e. a Christian's prespective), there is no reason that a person cannot be both jewish and christian, and this is how I think of messianic Jews.

For those of you who don't know, Jesus, and all of his apostles were Jewish, and they never renounced their Judiasm. So, I guess, they would have been messianic jews.

[/ QUOTE ]
yeah, but from everyone else's perspective you can't be two religions at once. Again, there are no Christians for Muhammed or Muslims for Buddha.

[Blarg]

It's the latter. I wasn't even including women.

To be fair, though, although I criticize this behavior and bring it up, I know it's not exclusive to anyone. The reason I bring it up is that it's so sad that it's common among everyone, especially those who have been historically repressed and so, most of all, should be the ones who know better. But they don't. They just enact their own versions of the same bad behavior and thought patterns. It's sad that nobody ever seems to learn any lessons at all, and the bad always seems to be handed down through the generations. It seems that there's just no way out sometimes, as everyone hoards their hatred as if it were a special, unique prize and inheritance.

It's a shame that ethnicity is so often treated not just as a fact of life, and an often unremarkable and not particularly relevant fact of life, but as an excuse for bad behavior and ill will toward "outsiders." In that way, bridges just keep being severed instead of made, and the desire to think less of others and treat them worse because of the accidents of birth just becomes more deeply ingrained in society every day, man by man, moral capitulation by moral capitulation.

[craig r]

[ QUOTE ]
Again, there are no Christians for Muhammed or Muslims for Buddha

[/ QUOTE ]

But, there are Jews that are Buddhist and practicing Jews (in the U.S., Jews make up the largest % of American Buddhists). And there are Christians (practicing) that practice some forms of Buddhism. Obviuosly, Judaism is much more conducive to Buddhism.

craig

[TheBlueMonster]

[ QUOTE ]
It's the latter. I wasn't even including women.

To be fair, though, although I criticize this behavior and bring it up, I know it's not exclusive to anyone. The reason I bring it up is that it's so sad that it's common among everyone, especially those who have been historically repressed and so, most of all, should be the ones who know better. But they don't. They just enact their own versions of the same bad behavior and thought patterns. It's sad that nobody ever seems to learn any lessons at all, and the bad always seems to be handed down through the generations. It seems that there's just no way out sometimes, as everyone hoards their hatred as if it were a special, unique prize and inheritance.

It's a shame that ethnicity is so often treated not just as a fact of life, and an often unremarkable and not particularly relevant fact of life, but as an excuse for bad behavior and ill will toward "outsiders." In that way, bridges just keep being severed instead of made, and the desire to think less of others and treat them worse because of the accidents of birth just becomes more deeply ingrained in society every day, man by man, moral capitulation by moral capitulation.

[/ QUOTE ]
excellent post. There are restrictions in Judaism on doing things that reflect badly on the religion. So as righteous as the people you encountered might feel they are, they're doing a great dis-service to the religion. It really bothers me when people do stuff that might somehow reflect badly on me. /images/graemlins/frown.gif

[TheBlueMonster]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Again, there are no Christians for Muhammed or Muslims for Buddha

[/ QUOTE ]

But, there are Jews that are Buddhist and practicing Jews (in the U.S., Jews make up the largest % of American Buddhists). And there are Christians (practicing) that practice some forms of Buddhism. Obviuosly, Judaism is much more conducive to Buddhism.

craig

[/ QUOTE ]
yeah, the Buddhism was a bad example because I also know Jews that are Buddhists. I shoulda said Falon Gong or something like that. /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

[jdl22]

[ QUOTE ]

there are certainly as many, but they're less formal distinctions. An Orthodox synagogue and a Reform synagogue will have, to a large degree, the same service. The difference is mostly in the degree to which they follow the laws.

Messianic Jews are not really jews to most "jewish" jews.

[/ QUOTE ]

Wait, you're Jewish?

[Blarg]

I was very impressed with that tradition, I don't know how many sects of Jews it is common among, that every year you apologize to those to whom you feel you've done wrong, and, if I recall correctly, ask for their forgiveness.

I used to work for an incredible arsehole of a boss who was Jewish, and at one point he said, hey, this is my religious duty and I believe in it, and I want to tell you that I'm sorry for the crummy things I did and said last year. I think he asked for my forgiveness, but don't remember, but he probably did, and if he did, I'm sure I did forgive him.

It was quite a humbling thing for someone in a position of great authority to do, and I found myself admiring him for it, even though he was still an arsehole. Hey, most of us are not perfect, but most of us don't even try to be any better. This guy at least was trying, and I respected him a lot more for that after he did it than I did before. I had never expected something like that out of him, and in life you generally probably don't expect anyone to admit they're wrong about anything, much less hope or ask to be forgiven. I wish this was a custom that everybody stuck to in every religion, or even secularly. It probably would do a hell of a lot of good for every soul on earth, whether you're the one apologizing or being apologized too. I'm glad in my own way for what he did for me, which was making it possible to carry less tension and anger around in my own heart.

[imported_anacardo]

[ QUOTE ]
It's the latter. I wasn't even including women.

To be fair, though, although I criticize this behavior and bring it up, I know it's not exclusive to anyone. The reason I bring it up is that it's so sad that it's common among everyone, especially those who have been historically repressed and so, most of all, should be the ones who know better. But they don't. They just enact their own versions of the same bad behavior and thought patterns. It's sad that nobody ever seems to learn any lessons at all, and the bad always seems to be handed down through the generations. It seems that there's just no way out sometimes, as everyone hoards their hatred as if it were a special, unique prize and inheritance.

It's a shame that ethnicity is so often treated not just as a fact of life, and an often unremarkable and not particularly relevant fact of life, but as an excuse for bad behavior and ill will toward "outsiders." In that way, bridges just keep being severed instead of made, and the desire to think less of others and treat them worse because of the accidents of birth just becomes more deeply ingrained in society every day, man by man, moral capitulation by moral capitulation.

[/ QUOTE ]

Please stop injecting sad doses of clarity into my rollicking good times. It sorta takes the edge off. /images/graemlins/frown.gif

[MarkSummers]

Not jewish. I'm actually in a very boring class called "messiah and messianism in judaism and christianity" but this one is pretty dumb. Jews believe the messiah has not yet come and christians believe it already has come.

[Blarg]

LOL, sorry. Didn't mean to stomp your buzz heheh

[TheBlueMonster]

[ QUOTE ]
I was very impressed with that tradition, I don't know how many sects of Jews it is common among, that every year you apologize to those to whom you feel you've done wrong, and, if I recall correctly, ask for their forgiveness.


[/ QUOTE ]
Actually every Jew is supposed to do it in the week leading up to Yom Kippur. Even though you're praying to God for forgiveness, tradition states that God won't forgive you until your fellow man does. Kinda nice....

[TheBlueMonster]

[ QUOTE ]
Jews believe the messiah has not yet come and christians believe it already has come.

[/ QUOTE ]
And that is all there's to it.

[Blarg]

Yeah. It's too bad, out of all the Jews I've met, he's the only one who ever did it. And that it's so rare that I never even heard of it being done, to or by anyone, until that very day. And I've never seen or heard of it being done by anyone since.