Mr. Feeney... Book Recommendations

[manhattanight]

Hi John and everyone else. I'm new today to these forums and fairly new to the game. I was wondering if everyone (especially the pros) could give me a good list of books, starting with good "foundation builders" so that I can become a decent Hold 'Em player. So far I've read (don't laugh):

Poker for Dummies
Hold 'Em Excellence, From Beginner to Winner
Super System by Doyle Brunson (I'm just reading the Hold 'Em section)

Where should I go from here? After reading a prior post, I read the excerpts on Amazon from the Feeney book Inside the Poker Mind and it looks awesome... just don't know if I should be building up to it or if I can read it right off the bat. What do you all think?

Also, I've tried my best to play by the book at the 2-4 tables at Foxwoods and at the Taj (and the 3-6 there) but I keep losing really good starting hands to, pardon my french, peckerheads who catch a card on the turn and/or the river. Am I just an idiot or something?

[Inthacup]

Am I just an idiot or something?

I'm sure the "for dummies" series has many good volumes, but I can't imagine the poker book is going to help you very much. For low limit games I'd recommend:

Winning Low Limit Hold Em by Lee Jones(who posts here occasionally)
Hold Em Poker by David Sklansky
Inside the Poker Mind- This book is great for the mental aspects of the game, but won't apply to you very much with strategy. It's aimed at mid limit players(10-20 and up)
Theory of Poker by David Sklansky

Super System isn't going to help you THAT much in limit games. It's blind structure is outdated, but the NL stuff is still very good.

[Al_Capone_Junior]

OK. You're way confused.

Haven't read poker for dummies. If it was that good, it would probably have been talked about on this forum more than this being the first time I have heard of its existence. I wondered when those "for dummies" people would tackle poker.

Hold'em excellence is certainly not high on my list of books I'd recommend for beginners.

Brunson's book is great for 7CS. The general principles are pretty good, except for a few points, which I'll skip here. But limit hold'em is played with a completely different structure now than it was when the book was written. Same with high/low stud. Therefore those sections of the book are obsolete. It's a great "historical" book for advanced players, and is filled with great info. But it's not for beginners, it will just leave you terribly confused. Save it for much later in your poker education.

Here's my list of books for you to read, more or less ordered in priority:

Hold'em poker, by Sklansky
Theory of poker, by Sklansky
Gambling theory and other topics, by Malmuth.
Hold'em poker for advanced players, 21st century edition, by Sklansky and Malmuth
Psychology of poker, by Schoonmaker
Inside the poker mind, by Feeney

Other honorable mentions are Lee Jones' Winning low limit hold'em, and Sklansky, Malmuth, and Zee's 7CS for advanced players, 21st century edition. Any of the books on this site are going to be good, but you needed a list of starters.

You'll need to read these books more than once, especially theory of poker, which you'll need to read about a bzillion times. Hopefully they will undo your confusion.

Heck, just the first one should be enough for you to beat the 2-4 in AC, as long as you're not playing against a bunch of total rocks. But with what you've read so far, it's no wonder you're losing.

al

[RockLobster]

You'll need to read these books more than once, especially theory of poker, which you'll need to read about a bzillion times.

In karate, you can quickly judge a black belt by how worn out his belt is (the whiter, the better... and this takes 10's of years to achieve). In poker, you're judged on how worn out the covers of your TOP and HPFAP are. It's no joke.

[ArchAngel71857]

I am new to the game too, and your approach to poker must be different than anything else you've ever studied. I started with Theory of Poker. Then I read Fundamnetals of Poker by Malmuth to get a good BASIC BASIC BASIC understanding of what I should be doing every game. Next I read Hold Em Poker, and Winning Low Limit Hold Em and am halfway through the Feeney book. But along the way I had to reread many sections of Theory of Poker and the others. Rereading these books will be very important. So once you are finished with a book, play for a while and then go back and reread. you will be surprised at how much you missed and how much is clearer.


-AA

[Al_Capone_Junior]

As a person who's had four years of karate, in two disciplines, plus two years of wrestling, plus many years of playing and studying poker...

You're absolutely right.

My theory of poker book, and my gambling theory book are so worn out, I was thinking about bitching about the book binding quality, just to try and get another free copy. But if asked in court how many times they have been read... well..............

al

[John Feeney]

manhattanight,

The lists others are providing all look quite reasonable. You do need to learn the stuff in books like mine, Mason's and David's books of essays, and other books. But in time you'll probably find that TOP and HPFAP become your primary references, with other books read and reread supplementally, as applicable.

A couple of notes on my book: I don't really think you should dive into it yet. Though some of its essays are accessible to the beginning player, on the whole it's aimed more at a somewhat experienced player who's seriously studied a number of the other books. I don't think beginning players can really appreciate a lot of its content. (For instance the "Subtle Losses of Judgement" essays just won't mean anything to an inexperienced player.) Also, when you do read it, go over it carefully. For better or worse, I wrote it in a way which I think necessitates that. Good luck.

[jmuteam8]

I am also a new player, and I have reviewed exerts from all of these books, which book is the best for general guidelines on how to proceed according to your first two cards---'by the book'

thanks

[rayrns]

That would depend on the limit of the game. But most of the starting hand recommendations are a preliminary quideline only. And the game structure (passive - aggressive etc) will dictate what you will use.

[jmuteam8]

Understood, but ther must be somewher that states the pecking order of the first two cards Pair aces, pair kings...Ace king same suit... 2-7 off suit.

Does anybody know wher to find such a list??


Thank you very much

[manhattanight]

Thanks very much to everyone for helping me on this endeavour. I've ordered Sklansky's Hold 'Em and Theory of Poker -- I'm really looking forward to TOP which I see everyone refers to (sounds like divine scripture or something). And hopefully after studying these I won't get my ass whooped as much, if at all.