View Full Version : Locked in a Cage
WackityWhiz
10-06-2005, 12:27 AM
Soooo, what do you think would happen if doctors were to take a child right after it was born and put it in a dark room for 21 years. They would obviously feed the child until it was old enough to eat food that was placed in front of it.
Lets say the room was 20 ft X 20 ft... what do you think would happen when they let it out at 21 years of age? Do you think it would be hard to it to learn a language?
etc etc... ima go pass out now /images/graemlins/tongue.gif
WackityWhiz
10-06-2005, 12:30 AM
fwiw i'm not low
meleader2
10-06-2005, 12:30 AM
[ QUOTE ]
Soooo, what do you think would happen if doctors were to take a child right after it was born and put it in a dark room for 21 years. They would obviously feed the child until it was old enough to eat food that was placed in front of it.
Lets say the room was 20 ft X 20 ft... what do you think would happen when they let it out at 21 years of age? Do you think it would be hard to it to learn a language?
etc etc... ima go pass out now /images/graemlins/tongue.gif
[/ QUOTE ]
from a biological POV the child would be blind. children's toys aren't bright colors for no reason. the eyes need to be stimulated to make connections, one of the main reason's females have greater ability to make color distinctions than males do. and no, language would be impossible, humans can only learn a main language for a certain time frame. the window is only until 5 or 6 years old.
Joshssj4
10-06-2005, 12:31 AM
These studies have already been done. It's related to feral children. You can find various sites on this all over.
It wouldn't be hard to learn a language, it would be virtually impossible.
bravos1
10-06-2005, 12:32 AM
[ QUOTE ]
Soooo, what do you think would happen if doctors were to take a child right after it was born and put it in a dark room for 21 years. They would obviously feed the child until it was old enough to eat food that was placed in front of it.
Lets say the room was 20 ft X 20 ft... what do you think would happen when they let it out at 21 years of age? Do you think it would be hard to it to learn a language?
etc etc... ima go pass out now /images/graemlins/tongue.gif
[/ QUOTE ]
Language would be the least of your concerns.. first, if the room was dark, his eyes would be f'd up in the light.. there would be social skills. Even a dog would have better social skills. Piss and crap everywhere... you wouldn't even be able to approach him without him freaking out... etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc.
Los Feliz Slim
10-06-2005, 12:33 AM
I watched something about this on the History Channel about two weeks ago. Some poor girl was locked in a cage by her father for the first 12 years of her life, that's the closest they know to this example.
I would come out pissed off
Except that you wouldn't know how to be pissed off
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... what do you think would happen when they let it out at 21 years of age?
[/ QUOTE ]
Hump stuff?
Cunning Linguist
10-06-2005, 12:35 AM
Kid would die without proper nurturing.
Sponger15SB
10-06-2005, 12:36 AM
[ QUOTE ]
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... what do you think would happen when they let it out at 21 years of age?
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Hump stuff?
[/ QUOTE ]
Eh, they've probably be jacking off all day for years.
Joshssj4
10-06-2005, 12:40 AM
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Kid would die without proper nurturing.
[/ QUOTE ]
No they wouldn't.
PoBoy321
10-06-2005, 12:42 AM
How's www.FeralChildren.com for ya? (http://www.feralchildren.com)
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Kid would die without proper nurturing.
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No they wouldn't.
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Actually he's right...infants die without regular human touch.
2+2 wannabe
10-06-2005, 12:50 AM
haven't you watched encino man? first it will be awkward, but inevitably hilarity and pauly shore will ensue
Joshssj4
10-06-2005, 12:53 AM
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Kid would die without proper nurturing.
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No they wouldn't.
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Actually he's right...infants die without regular human touch.
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In the OP, he said that they would feed the baby until it could eat on it's own. Which would account for partial nurturing. I just googled it and couldn't find any absolute results saying that ALL babies die without constant human touch. I also found proof that an infant could make it on it's own\, without human touch. His name was Tarzan. <a href="www.disney.com" target="_blank">Feral Child Tarzan</a>
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haven't you watched encino man? first it will be awkward, but inevitably hilarity and pauly shore will ensue
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OMG, I saw that movie!
jstnrgrs
10-06-2005, 01:14 AM
[ QUOTE ]
How's www.FeralChildren.com for ya? (http://www.feralchildren.com)
[/ QUOTE ]
So it turns out that the test that the OP sugested has actually been done before (more or less)
link (http://www.feralchildren.com/en/showchild.php?ch=genie)
The thing I found most interesting was:
[ QUOTE ]
Over the next couple of years, some scientists concluded that Genie was not mentally retarded, even though she was still unable to master language. She was brilliant at nonverbal communication. Sometimes she would be so frustrated at not being able to say what she wanted that she would grab a pencil and paper and in a few strokes, illustrate fairly complex ideas and even feelings. She scored the highest recorded score ever on tests that measure a person's ability to make sense out of chaos and to see patterns. Her abilities to understand and to think logically were also strong. She had a perfect score on an adult-level test that measured spatial abilities. One test required that she use a set of colored sticks to recreate a complicated structure from memory. She was not only able to build the structure perfectly, she built it with sticks of the exact same color as the first structure! Despite all this, Genie remained unable to master the basics of language.
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2+2 wannabe
10-06-2005, 01:21 AM
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haven't you watched encino man? first it will be awkward, but inevitably hilarity and pauly shore will ensue
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OMG, I saw that movie!
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I thought it was pretty good, even with pauly
send_the_msg
10-06-2005, 01:37 AM
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
How's www.FeralChildren.com for ya? (http://www.feralchildren.com)
[/ QUOTE ]
So it turns out that the test that the OP sugested has actually been done before (more or less)
link (http://www.feralchildren.com/en/showchild.php?ch=genie)
The thing I found most interesting was:
[ QUOTE ]
Over the next couple of years, some scientists concluded that Genie was not mentally retarded, even though she was still unable to master language. She was brilliant at nonverbal communication. Sometimes she would be so frustrated at not being able to say what she wanted that she would grab a pencil and paper and in a few strokes, illustrate fairly complex ideas and even feelings. She scored the highest recorded score ever on tests that measure a person's ability to make sense out of chaos and to see patterns. Her abilities to understand and to think logically were also strong. She had a perfect score on an adult-level test that measured spatial abilities. One test required that she use a set of colored sticks to recreate a complicated structure from memory. She was not only able to build the structure perfectly, she built it with sticks of the exact same color as the first structure! Despite all this, Genie remained unable to master the basics of language.
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yeah i saw something on tv about that girl. weird [censored]
peachy
10-06-2005, 01:49 AM
it would be nearly non functional and less than an animal. Humans need physical contact and support (like studies done with baby monkeys with no mother vs artifical mother). Without this contact they turn out deranged and flat out crazy. Early stages are when they are most seceptable to development (languages, feelings, emotions) - its when our neurons make most of our pathways and are engrained with repetative learning - without that it would be very difficult for someone of 10 years old let alone 20+ years old to learn and function.
It would have no concept of people, things, the world, emotions, very little thoughts - the stimulus overload alone when let out would be enough to make them crazy...also thier sexual orientation would be beyond messed up - causing acting out - overall this "animal" would lash out in fear and confusion - i wouldnt even consider it a "human being" at this point
thats IF it even made it to this age....
i could go on and on but im playing poker and doing HW /images/graemlins/laugh.gif
Cancer Merchant
10-06-2005, 02:04 AM
http://www.theplaza.ca/moview/Pics/Films/1983/Trading_Places/pic2.jpg
Our usual wager?
PoBoy321
10-06-2005, 02:10 AM
[ QUOTE ]
http://www.theplaza.ca/moview/Pics/Films/1983/Trading_Places/pic2.jpg
Our usual wager?
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nh
peachy
10-06-2005, 02:11 AM
[ QUOTE ]
http://www.theplaza.ca/moview/Pics/Films/1983/Trading_Places/pic2.jpg
Our usual wager?
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hahahaha nice
The child dies for some reason that I dont recall. I think some lord or king tried this experiment in medieval times.
WackityWhiz
10-06-2005, 10:46 AM
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
How's www.FeralChildren.com for ya? (http://www.feralchildren.com)
[/ QUOTE ]
So it turns out that the test that the OP sugested has actually been done before (more or less)
link (http://www.feralchildren.com/en/showchild.php?ch=genie)
The thing I found most interesting was:
[ QUOTE ]
Over the next couple of years, some scientists concluded that Genie was not mentally retarded, even though she was still unable to master language. She was brilliant at nonverbal communication. Sometimes she would be so frustrated at not being able to say what she wanted that she would grab a pencil and paper and in a few strokes, illustrate fairly complex ideas and even feelings. She scored the highest recorded score ever on tests that measure a person's ability to make sense out of chaos and to see patterns. Her abilities to understand and to think logically were also strong. She had a perfect score on an adult-level test that measured spatial abilities. One test required that she use a set of colored sticks to recreate a complicated structure from memory. She was not only able to build the structure perfectly, she built it with sticks of the exact same color as the first structure! Despite all this, Genie remained unable to master the basics of language.
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Thanks for the links!
astroglide
10-06-2005, 11:43 AM
[ QUOTE ]
She scored the highest recorded score ever on tests that measure a person's ability to make sense out of chaos and to see patterns.
[/ QUOTE ]
calling bullshit on this. i don't believe the "can't learn a language" assertion either, but the quoted statement is really over-the-top.
Sephus
10-06-2005, 01:20 PM
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i don't believe the "can't learn a language" assertion
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actually it would be MUCH more surprising if she COULD learn a language. in fact, it would be unprecedented.
astroglide
10-06-2005, 01:22 PM
what kind of a sample size are we talking about here? how can it be determined that they're not crazy/retarded?
Sephus
10-06-2005, 01:42 PM
[ QUOTE ]
what kind of a sample size are we talking about here? how can it be determined that they're not crazy/retarded?
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we know that our ability to learn a language drops drastically around the ages of 4-6, which is why if you start learning a new language when you're like fifteen you will never have quite the competence of a native speaker.
the theory is that the part of your brain that processes language sort of "freezes up" at that age. so it's been assumed that if you deprive an otherwise healthy child of any access to language until that age, they will never learn to really speak at all. obviously this is very rare, but in every case where children were abused to the extent that they never learned to speak (by isolation), as far as i know none of them has ever been able to learn.
even though their brains are just messed up in general from the abuse (or maybe they were abused because they were retarded), some of them end up being competent in other ways. since none of them ever really learn to speak, and theory of language acquisition is consistent with that, it's supposed to confirm the theory that says it's impossible for them.
i minored in linguistics and took classes about language acquisition where we looked at this.
peachy
10-06-2005, 03:01 PM
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
How's www.FeralChildren.com for ya? (http://www.feralchildren.com)
[/ QUOTE ]
So it turns out that the test that the OP sugested has actually been done before (more or less)
link (http://www.feralchildren.com/en/showchild.php?ch=genie)
The thing I found most interesting was:
[ QUOTE ]
Over the next couple of years, some scientists concluded that Genie was not mentally retarded, even though she was still unable to master language. She was brilliant at nonverbal communication. Sometimes she would be so frustrated at not being able to say what she wanted that she would grab a pencil and paper and in a few strokes, illustrate fairly complex ideas and even feelings. She scored the highest recorded score ever on tests that measure a person's ability to make sense out of chaos and to see patterns. Her abilities to understand and to think logically were also strong. She had a perfect score on an adult-level test that measured spatial abilities. One test required that she use a set of colored sticks to recreate a complicated structure from memory. She was not only able to build the structure perfectly, she built it with sticks of the exact same color as the first structure! Despite all this, Genie remained unable to master the basics of language.
[/ QUOTE ]
[/ QUOTE ]
Thanks for the links!
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any test/experiments like this today would be impossible in most countries - ruled unethical - thus why they have done it alot with baby monkeys!
lu_hawk
10-06-2005, 03:06 PM
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
She scored the highest recorded score ever on tests that measure a person's ability to make sense out of chaos and to see patterns.
[/ QUOTE ]
calling bullshit on this. i don't believe the "can't learn a language" assertion either, but the quoted statement is really over-the-top.
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The claim of scoring the highest ever on that test is over the top but it is well documented that a persons ability to learn a language peaks at about 5 or 6 years of age. After that it declines forever. So it seems reasonable that if whatever mental circuits required to learn a language were left completely unused until a person got into their 20's then that person might never be able to learn a language.
Sephus
10-06-2005, 03:24 PM
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
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She scored the highest recorded score ever on tests that measure a person's ability to make sense out of chaos and to see patterns.
[/ QUOTE ]
calling bullshit on this. i don't believe the "can't learn a language" assertion either, but the quoted statement is really over-the-top.
[/ QUOTE ]
The claim of scoring the highest ever on that test is over the top but it is well documented that a persons ability to learn a language peaks at about 5 or 6 years of age. After that it declines forever. So it seems reasonable that if whatever mental circuits required to learn a language were left completely unused until a person got into their 20's then that person might never be able to learn a language.
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lol, really???
offTopic
10-06-2005, 04:10 PM
[ QUOTE ]
Soooo, what do you think would happen if doctors were to take a child right after it was born and put it in a dark room for 21 years. They would obviously feed the child until it was old enough to eat food that was placed in front of it.
[/ QUOTE ]
Veal Substitute
junkmail3
10-06-2005, 05:12 PM
[ QUOTE ]
what do you think would happen when they let it out at 21 years of age?
[/ QUOTE ]
He would probably go on a bar tour with his feeder buddies.
jstnrgrs
10-06-2005, 11:03 PM
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
She scored the highest recorded score ever on tests that measure a person's ability to make sense out of chaos and to see patterns.
[/ QUOTE ]
calling bullshit on this. i don't believe the "can't learn a language" assertion either, but the quoted statement is really over-the-top.
[/ QUOTE ]
The claim of scoring the highest ever on that test is over the top but it is well documented that a persons ability to learn a language peaks at about 5 or 6 years of age. After that it declines forever. So it seems reasonable that if whatever mental circuits required to learn a language were left completely unused until a person got into their 20's then that person might never be able to learn a language.
[/ QUOTE ]
I'm no expert, but it seems to me that if the part of the brian that is normally used for language is deprived of language, then that part of the brain might end up being used for something else. So, it is not that unreasonable to think that she might have had exceptional abilities in other areas.
jstnrgrs
10-06-2005, 11:05 PM
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
How's www.FeralChildren.com for ya? (http://www.feralchildren.com)
[/ QUOTE ]
So it turns out that the test that the OP sugested has actually been done before (more or less)
link (http://www.feralchildren.com/en/showchild.php?ch=genie)
The thing I found most interesting was:
[ QUOTE ]
Over the next couple of years, some scientists concluded that Genie was not mentally retarded, even though she was still unable to master language. She was brilliant at nonverbal communication. Sometimes she would be so frustrated at not being able to say what she wanted that she would grab a pencil and paper and in a few strokes, illustrate fairly complex ideas and even feelings. She scored the highest recorded score ever on tests that measure a person's ability to make sense out of chaos and to see patterns. Her abilities to understand and to think logically were also strong. She had a perfect score on an adult-level test that measured spatial abilities. One test required that she use a set of colored sticks to recreate a complicated structure from memory. She was not only able to build the structure perfectly, she built it with sticks of the exact same color as the first structure! Despite all this, Genie remained unable to master the basics of language.
[/ QUOTE ]
[/ QUOTE ]
Thanks for the links!
[/ QUOTE ]
any test/experiments like this today would be impossible in most countries - ruled unethical - thus why they have done it alot with baby monkeys!
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I hope that you realize that this wasn't designed as a scientific experiment. It was a case of horrible abuse that, as a side effect, led to some scientific research.
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