can I fold please?

I'm still trying to learn the art of folding and get it wrong a lot - do you think I did the right thing here?

hero on button with AA
3 limpers call, hero raises, blinds and limpers call. (12SB's)
Flop: Qh 9s 2h
SB bets, BB calls, MP raises, MP1 calls, hero calls?, BB folds, SB calls. (10.5 BB's)

Turn: 8c SB bets, MP raises, MP1 reraises, hero folds...

did I do ok? looks like 2 pair, set or straight to me.

I'll probably get flamed for not raising the flop, but my logic is this: raising will do little to protect my hand since I am in late pos. The flop is looking a little bit too co-ordinated for my liking, so I'd like to wait to see hopefully a safe turn card before raising when I'll also be able to extract maximum value.

[crunchy1]

Not raising the flop here is fine on this board against multiple opponents. I fold any one-pair holding when it's 3-bets cold to me on the turn.

NH.

[brettbrettr]

Raise the flop, yo.

[brettbrettr]

Hmm...Lets chat.

I think not raising the flop is a mistake, particularly if you have the A /images/graemlins/heart.gif. This raise is for value. It may even protect you hand if the SB reraises.

edit: oh wait, there's a bet and a raise. Er, I'd still 3-bet it. SB could have a draw and the raiser may only have top pair. Pump it, especially if you have the ace of hearts.

[Petteri]

Against typical players you must 3-bet flop. Calling is bad mistake and can lead into difficulties like here. Board contains draws and you have to find out were you stand.

Also turn decision is easier if you have shown aggression on flop. If you do not 3-bet flop you virtually ask other players to bet you out. After you showed aggression on flop you can fold if you face too much heat.

[BigEndian]

I'll post a comment on the hand when my eyes stop bleeding.

- Jim

I'd fold the turn too, for what it's worth. Folds don't come much easier really. Unless you have three complete maniacs to you right!

[Fat Nicky]

I would probably 3-bet the flop, but I don't think waiting for a safe turn is so bad. This is probably something I need to start doing more.

Calling 3-cold on the turn with one pair doesn't seem like a good idea, ever.

3-bet the flop. Turn will play better. If there's still a bet and a raise before it gets to you on the turn, you can think about folding (though consider you have decent counterfeiting outs against two pair.)

[Fat Nicky]

[ QUOTE ]
(though consider you have decent counterfeiting outs against two pair.)


[/ QUOTE ]

i think we're behind either a set of a straight a lot more often than 2-pair here.

[felix83]

I think assuming you can counterfeit here loses money long term. I would 3 bet the flop and if it's capped, you can safely fold the turn if anything other than an A falls. (or a H if you have the Ah)

Thanks for confirming the no-brainer fold. I just need be 100% sure I'm doing the right thing in these common situations.

I agree the flop raise has big merits for the reasons given, however SSH has a chapter regarding waiting for the turn to raise. Do you not think think this could be one of those cases?
It looks like there could be a flush and straight drawing, so there are ~15 outs that can really hurt us. Our equity would be a lot bigger if we wait for the turn and a safe card hits wouldn't it?

[The Legend]

The waiting for the turn line requires several things. First, big pot. You have this. Second, your raise cannot protect your hand very well. You more or less have this. Third, a significant portion of the deck can destroy the strength of your holding on the turn. Now , the board is coordinated. But you have the highest possible pair, from which no overcards can come. You are not vulnerable to half the deck.

So, I say value re-raise the flop. Other than that, nh.

[ QUOTE ]
The waiting for the turn line requires several things. First, big pot. You have this. Second, your raise cannot protect your hand very well. You more or less have this. Third, a significant portion of the deck can destroy the strength of your holding on the turn. Now , the board is coordinated. But you have the highest possible pair, from which no overcards can come. You are not vulnerable to half the deck.

So, I say value re-raise the flop. Other than that, nh.

[/ QUOTE ]

Roger that. My understanding of poker improves with each hand I post /images/graemlins/laugh.gif thanks!

[waffle]

[ QUOTE ]
But you have the highest possible pair, from which no overcards can come.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not too thrilled about: any heart, K, 8, J, or T. (Well, I might have the A/images/graemlins/heart.gif. Then a heart wouldn't be so bad.)