Flopped 2 pair (PP 11)

[Huckle]

Total number of players : 4
Seat 1: BigRob123 ( $1495 )
Seat 2: ocomeon ( $2210 )
Seat 5: upsman1000 ( $1695 )
Seat 9: lez_chips ( $2600 )
Trny:16316271 Level:6
Blinds(100/200)
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to ocomeon [ K/images/graemlins/spade.gif 2/images/graemlins/heart.gif ]
upsman1000 folds.
lez_chips calls [200].
BigRob123 calls [100].
ocomeon checks.

Thought of pushing first, but I put bigstack on a weak ace or a stronger king than mine (he'd been betting all kinds of pairs), so he'd probably call anyway.

** Dealing Flop ** [ K/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 7/images/graemlins/club.gif, 2/images/graemlins/club.gif ]
BigRob123 checks.
ocomeon bets [300].
lez_chips raises [1000].

Ok so he's got a king, with a better kicker than me. I can't do anything besides push here, right?


If he'd have shown his hand, K /images/graemlins/club.gif J /images/graemlins/club.gif I've suddenly only got 45% but still have to call because of pot odds?

[nuclear500]

I think you have to push. If he catches he catches.

When he doesn't, he'll shoot himself for limping and scream and holler that you're a fish for flopping a better hand.

[downtown]

[ QUOTE ]
I can't do anything besides push here, right?

[/ QUOTE ]

Right. I always like to push with the best hand. Even though in this case it seems to have turned out that you didn't in fact have the best hand, there is no way you would be able to figure this out, based on the action to this point. Shove those chips in.

[zambonidrivr]

looks like someone may have been getting cute with aces. i push this after the flop. in an earlier level, this is an easy fold

[schwza]

[ QUOTE ]
looks like someone may have been getting cute with aces. i push this after the flop. in an earlier level, this is an easy fold

[/ QUOTE ]

looks like someone is getting cute with AA, so we're way ahead, so in an earlier level it's a fold?

[playtitleist]

[ QUOTE ]
in an earlier level, this is an easy fold

[/ QUOTE ]

how is this an easy fold at an earlier level? I think you are ahead about 90% of the time.

[zambonidrivr]

yes, as in an earlier level you have a great deal of fold equity left. i believe hero has less than 10x bb here? no?

[zambonidrivr]

2 pair is very beatable. and when the blinds are not worth much, I don't mind laying this down. Especially in a limped multiway pot. I can see my opinion is now being well recieved, but I honstely like to have a better idea where i am at prior to the flop (yes i know you were bb here). In this case, I am pushing all the way given my chip/blind positoin. Earlier in a tourney, I am in check, calling small bets, and fold mode... unless i am first to open or have made a stonger hand.

[schwza]

[ QUOTE ]
yes, as in an earlier level you have a great deal of fold equity left. i believe hero has less than 10x bb here? no?

[/ QUOTE ]

ok, you have FE if you fold, but you are ~75% to win the pot against AA if you get the chips in. that's WAYYYYY too much of an edge to pass up. it's not like as long as you have 10x or more you can just create chips at will.

[zambonidrivr]

i see what your saying. i am not certain you are up against AA here. but it did smell funny preflop, and the reraise is acting like it. the problem for me is that you have no idea where you are at preflop and those are situations i would rather stay away form early. at this point in the tourney, you are not getting away from 2 pair. period. you must shove. early on levels 1-4, i get away depending on my stack and other table conditions.

jk

I tend to think the same way as you, except I believe this is definitely not a hand you should fold even early in the tournament. 2 pair is only very beatable in a multiway pot, a 2 pair in an uncoordinated board with only 1 other person is very strong. Treat it like a HU, except a more narrow hand range. I wouldn't take any chances for someone drawing out to a flush and shove all my chips in here at any stage in the tournament.