Table Talk

[Carnite]

Ok, let me set the scene, and then I'll get into the particulars:

A $100 max $.5-$1 table, decent action (biggest stack was $1200+) but decent players too.

I'm on about $220 for the following hand:

In late position (about 3 before the button) I'm dealt 2 3 4 5 single suited. I throw in a raise to three dollars (it's a typical raise for me, and I make it often so as not to be pinned on a given range of hands).

6 players see the flop, 3 in front of me, 2 behind.

Flop comes A 2 4, with 2 diamonds (not my suit), giving me nut straight and a 4 out boat redraw.

Checked around to me and I bet pot (somewhere in the mid twentys). Cutoff folds and then Button reraises pot (in the vicinity of $90. It's folded back around to me except for the player directly to my right who goes all in for his last $15.

The button is a decent player, who has shown decent hands against me. We have almost identical stacks.

At this point, who folds this hand? At these levels, how much fear of redraws do you have.

Who advocates A) Folding B)Calling or C)Pushing?


Ok, adding a little bit more information. *Before* the action had even got to me, the button declared "daimond redraw" and took no hesitation in raising my original bet. I had no character reads - he hadn't been saying much before this. Does this move change anyone's opinion, if so, in which direction and why?

After a bit of discussion I'll post how it went down.

I don't think I could fold in this situation. You're likely ahead and only in real trouble if the button has a made straight and is freerolling for a flush.

I'd be tempted to call. You would leave yourself about $100 (if my math is correct) to bet if no diamond comes. In that scenario it seems unlikely that the button would have correct pot odds to call if he is only on a flush draw. Sometimes having money to fire on the turn is valuable to get others to fold. If a diamond comes on the turn you would have a tough decision, in particular with no character read on the button.

I probably would not push without better information on the button. If I had a decent read on the button and he frequently raised with marginal hands, I would push without hesitation regardless of his chat.

[Cooker]

I did a look at 2 dimes, and you have about 0.46 EV in this pot assuming he does have the nut straight with a diamond redraw, and that won't change much on the turn if it is a blank (you go to about .45 EV). I wouldn't fold getting 2 to 1 here, but I would flat call to save the rest if a diamond comes on the turn. I would call any non-diamond on the turn, I think that puts you all in which is fine since you will have odds to call. If you fill up on the turn, you might want to get tricky and check to get him to move in.

[fisherman112]

you have the nuts with a redraw, folding is very weak.

i like calling and pushing a non-diamond turn. if you boat up, check. if a diamond hits, whine a lot and go from there.

[jj_frap]

On this board, I'm very wary of somebody holding A4xx or even AAxx. Be careful.

[dogsballs]

why would he say "diamond redraw", unless he actually had a set or two bigger pair than you? He's maybe trying to talk himself into getting some scare cards.

It doesn't really make sense to tell the truth if he has the made hand with redraw - unless he doesn't want to win your money.

[Carnite]

Well, I pushed him, felt like had had to be spinning sh*t and trying to push a non-made hand. In reality he had made the str8, with a 6 high str8 redraw and 9 high flush redraw. In retrospect I like a call on the flop, push on a non-scare card turn. It was a non-scare card turn and then an extra 4 on the river to give me the whole $450ish pot.

The button whined on about that one for a while, but I still can't figure what he was trying to do and why he bit*hed on at me about not folding.