OT: Poker as a temporary/summer job, advice needed

[mlagoo]

Hi guys,

I was looking forward to this summer, and had a few questions.

First off, a bit of background: I'm currently a little bit into my first year of law school. It occurs to me that after I graduate from law school, I'm going to get a job at some firm, start grinding out 60-70 hours a week, and am never again (until I'm an old fart) going to have a long period of time to just travel and sort of "find myself."

I've been fortunate enough to have the opportunity to travel around Europe a fair bit. However, I've never had the opportunity to travel around this country. And I think I'd like to do so.

So I was thinking I'd like to get a 30-day rail pass and freakin see the States. And I thought what many people before me have likely thought. -- I've got a laptop, so I can make money from anywhere playing poker on the internet.

You're probably bored already, so I'll get to the questions:

Probably most important question: I've only played about 700 SNGs, at the $11/$22 level. My ROI is a very underwhelming 15%. I acknowledge the fact that I definitely have leaks. The question is: Can I believe that I'm a winning player to the extent that I could use it as a job for a month, bearing in mind that, if things really get ugly (and I get desperate), my parents can absolutely bail me out and get me a plane ticket back?

Is there any way to take rail around the US in a railcar that has wireless internet access as you travel? I've looked and not found any.

Has anyone done something like this before? If so, did you enjoy it? What things should I expect, etc.?

Another important question: Assuming I wanted to play the $22s as I traveled, what would be a proper bankroll, bearing in mind I could only 4-table and bearing in mind I would be cashing out intermittently to pay for stuff?

To any law students/attorneys out there: Am I making a big fuss out of nothing? Will I have plenty of time to travel before I become an old grump?


I can't think of any other questions off the top of my head. I might as I (hopefully) get a couple responses here.

[Manque]

Seriously, never give up a chance to travel. You never know when you'll get the oppuntunity again. If you're confident in the 15% roi, work out if that is enough money and you'll play enough games. If that is the case you have to go for it. Good Luck

[KingDan]

What's your bankroll?

20 or more buyin downswings happen. Personally, I would reccommend keeping enough extra $$ to buy my own ticket home, if need be.


If you haven't already, give bonuswhoring a try. Can even travel while you do it.

[mlagoo]

[ QUOTE ]
What's your bankroll?

20 or more buyin downswings happen. Personally, I would reccommend keeping enough extra $$ to buy my own ticket home, if need be.


If you haven't already, give bonuswhoring a try. Can even travel while you do it.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well my bankroll is kind of fluid because I frequently (and recently) cash(ed) out. If you're asking how much I'm up playing poker, it's around $2,000. Right now I have no money in my PP account -- I have a few bucks on Stars and Noble that I use to screw around on the weekends when I have free time. Law school is pretty demanding.

However, one of the questions in this thread is what sort of bankroll would be required. So I guess you are just begging the question =) I'm asking what my bankroll is (or should be) also.

[KingDan]

Just for the 22s, I would play with a minimum of 1000.

In addition you are gonna want to have some money you can access during the trip.

[mlagoo]

About to go to sleep. Gonna bump this in the morning for the day crew. I hope to hear from a couple of people who may have done this sort of thing, even if they didn't necessarily travel whilst doing it. But especially from anyone who has travelled.

I appreciate the two of you who already took the time to give advice =)

[Karak567]

If I relied on poker to put food in my mouth and transportation under my feet everyday I'd probably die.

Some can do it.

I can't.

[Howard Treesong]

You're very likely to have a chance to travel: one terrific spot is after you graduate and before you start working. I don't know where you're in law school or what your general career plans are, but I was able to take about six months between the last day of the bar exam and my first day of permanent work. But your idea is a good one. Almost nobody cares what you do after your 1L summer; it's your 2L summer that matters. By the way (as if you don't know this already), 1L grades matter a great deal.

A couple of other thoughts: a judicial clerkship after law school gives you another break point, and some people I know have used that as an excuse to travel. Also, very few people stay at one firm or one job for their entire legal career, and that can provide a good opportunity as well.

I can't answer wireless questions. I'm an old grump whose technical preferences remain antedeluvian.

[The Don]

Here is some advice that I think will help...

I decided to play pro poker this summer and my parents, in turn, decided to cut me off completely. I had about $1k in monthly expenses back in July when I started (note: my parents live in Jersey and I live and go to school in Baltimore). I had 3k to my name to start out my career and I spend half that on a new computer setup so I could 8 table. My ROI was 11% in 1200 11s and 18% in 600 22s before I started my 'pro' career. I spent a ton of time improving my game and after August I was $8k richer (about $42/hour) 8 tabling the 22s and 33s. I ended up spending about $2k per month because I like to live a lavish lifestyle /images/graemlins/smile.gif ...The freedom was great... I am really looking foward to doing the same thing you plan on.

[Scuba Chuck]

Here's my advice. Have a nice backup plan of taking out a loan for your one month of needed money. If you're going to law school, I'm certain you'll be able to pay it off someday.

And if you don't need the loan, great.

[mlagoo]

Rumpity Bump.


Thanks for all the advice last night guys. I think, bearing in mind what Howard said, I'll likely try to get an amazing job for this summer -- apply to a few real reaches for internships -- and, if I don't get any of them, it's poker on the go for me.


Is anyone concerned that after only 700 11s/22s, I'm not actually a winning player? This is a concern of mine. I mean, I feel like a winning player, and I feel like I understand all the concepts/strategies we talk about on here. On the other hand, I still have a pretty pitiful sample size, so I'm really just going on hope that I'm applying them correctly =).

Thanks again for the advice.

[Ixnert]

With 700 under your belt, and a 15% ROI, you're very likely a winning player (close to 99%, if your 1/2/3 distribution is even). For answering that specific question, you don't need all that large of a sample (unless your ROI is close to zero).

As far as bankroll, $1000 will give you a sub-1% risk of ruin at the 22s if you don't withdraw. What I'd do if I were you is take $1000 of poker bankroll plus enough to take a relatively austere trip if you were to never play a hand. Then you can upgrade your plans on the fly according to your results -- if you're flexible, there's a lot you can do on the spur of the moment, as long as you're not looking to get into Broadway shows and the like. And if you decide you'd rather just enjoy the scenery, you have that option too.

Can't help you as far as wireless on the road, though; looked into that myself and never really found a satisfactory option if you're not going to be on/near interstates all the time.

[pooh74]

[ QUOTE ]
Here's my advice. Have a nice backup plan of taking out a loan for your one month of needed money. If you're going to law school, I'm certain you'll be able to pay it off someday.

And if you don't need the loan, great.

[/ QUOTE ]

yep...what scuba said. Peace of mind is everything.

I started playing SNGs right after lawschool. I still play 20 hrs a week while working my job (i have a low hour job). I make less at poker overall, but there have been some months where my winnings have matched my take home and I blew it on travel and expenses etc...

Life doesnt end post grad...that is up to you and only you can decide where your priorities lie.

[pooh74]

[ QUOTE ]
Rumpity Bump.


Thanks for all the advice last night guys. I think, bearing in mind what Howard said, I'll likely try to get an amazing job for this summer -- apply to a few real reaches for internships -- and, if I don't get any of them, it's poker on the go for me.


Is anyone concerned that after only 700 11s/22s, I'm not actually a winning player? This is a concern of mine. I mean, I feel like a winning player, and I feel like I understand all the concepts/strategies we talk about on here. On the other hand, I still have a pretty pitiful sample size, so I'm really just going on hope that I'm applying them correctly =).

Thanks again for the advice.

[/ QUOTE ]

The problem is, on a summer trip, you cant count on making your expenses right away. you might be down after 200! or more! you need backup. make some of it before you go...

[davehwm]

I'm a travelling man, myself. In all honesty, if I was playing poker ever day or two on the train and relying on that to get me to my next destination, I'd never be able to 'find myself'. All I would be doing is worry about my next set. If you think you can handle it, then I suppose you should go for it.

As for whether you're a winning player, others can comment on that. I haven't even kept track of ROI for the past 6 months, personally. Also, you have quite a bit of time to get some more under your belt to get a better feel for where you stand.

Good luck.

[stupidsucker]

One of these days I am going to write a post "So you want to go pro"

I can explain all of the pitfalls you are likely to encounter as a professional poker player.

Here is a tip: knowing how to play winning poker is only about 50% of the job.

I recomend having lots and lots of $$$$ before doing anything like this.

Hey mlagoo
This is somewhat of a tough call for u. I finished my first year of law school last spring, and played poker and traveled all summer. It is true that u can get away with not working your 1L summer but every overachiever I know at least did an unpaid internship at a prosecutors office or something.

You may not be giving up a lot by not working, but there most assuredly is at least a little lost opportunity cost(resume, connections, etc)

I think you should get better at poker during the rest of this school year, and if u can beat the 55's for at least 10 percent and have at least a 5k bankroll then go for it.

[mlagoo]

[ QUOTE ]
I think you should get better at poker during the rest of this school year

[/ QUOTE ]

Well this is sort of the problem. It's possible that I'll have time in the spring, but right now, I really don't feel like I have time to play. Anytime I'm not doing schoolwork, I really feel like I should be hanging out with friends and stuff, which doesn't leave me with a lot of time for poker on the side.


I'm hoping the spring will be a little easier.

[Ogre]

post about the travel plans and stuff in OOT

[pokerlaw]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I think you should get better at poker during the rest of this school year

[/ QUOTE ]

Well this is sort of the problem. It's possible that I'll have time in the spring, but right now, I really don't feel like I have time to play. Anytime I'm not doing schoolwork, I really feel like I should be hanging out with friends and stuff, which doesn't leave me with a lot of time for poker on the side.


I'm hoping the spring will be a little easier.

[/ QUOTE ]

At least for me, law school got harder 1st year spring (my torts and contracts classes were full-year w/ finals in the spring - not to mention the 96 hour footnoting-fest that was the writing competition, thank you ritalin).

Are you plannin on doing anything legal during the summer? while grades are MUCH more important that the job you get, I would advise that you get something to put on your resume to talk about during the interviews before school starts. That said, traveling sounds like a great idea. Get a loan for expenses in case your luck is bad - then, if you win, you can pay it off w/ your spoils.

oh, you'll have enough time to travel after the bar, during x-mas breaks, spring breaks, or just make a few 4-5 day weekends during 3rd year (may i suggest South beach? fun times).

[Guthrie]

If you buy a railpass you already have a ticket home.

Im surprised to hear how time consuming law school is for u and pokerlaw. I try to manage my time really effectively and not sleep a lot, so i have been able to play over 40 hours a week of poker so far this sememster.
My grades have to have suffered to some extent because of this, however