Play or pass?

[Bob T.]

You walk into the cardroom, and the only seat currently available is in a 4-8 game. There are huge stacks all over the table, you take the seat, and while you are waiting for the blinds, you discover, that you have entered the 'LAND OF GAMBOL!' . 4 of the players in this game, are playing every hand capped, on every street, blind. It will cost you $120 or 15 big bets to see the river, but the pot will be a minimum of $600 when it is shown down.

Are you going to play, or wait for another game? If you do play, how much money do you want to have in front of you, and how much do you want in your pocket? What hands are you going to play?

[Vehn]

Pass

[slavic]

This sounds more like a PP .5/1 game.

[pufferfish]

Me answering this question is like a first grader taking the SAT’s, but I’ll give it a shot.

Are you going to play, or wait for another game?

I would wait because I don’t play 4-8. .:-).

If you do play, how much money do you want to have in front of you, and how much do you want in your pocket?

About 100 BB in front of me and enough in my pocket to play the game I came for.

What hands are you going to play?

With four players going to the river on every hand I think all pairs, all suited Aces, suited face cards, and suited connectors (not sure how low).

If I have it right that the pot will be offering at least 5:1 then I’d want to see any 4 out hand through? So, add unsuited face cards and some unsuited connectors (not sure how low)?

pf

[bernie]

been there, done that. needed a costco size bottle of maalox when i was done.

im not a big fan of these types of tables. i usually switch.

2 ways of playing them. S&M have a chapter devoted to it. and Abdul has some other thoughts on it. both are very valid. it's a matter of how much variance you want in your roll as to which hands or how tight youll play.

ill find ya some maalox.

b

[Louie Landale]

This is a $16/$32 game with $2/$4 blinds with must bet and no raising. Seems to be 6 way action to the river. Besides the palty bonds, the only real difference between this game and a very weak-loose game is that YOU never get a free card.

Play selectively in position, fold if you don't flop anything, otherwise go to the river. Really, you only have to call one bet each round.

- Louie

[RockLobster]

Gulp. I'll sit through one orbit (very likely not playing a single hand), then get up. It would be too easy to blow through my allotted 50 BB's with a couple of bad hands.

[Bob T.]

This is a $16/$32 game with $2/$4 blinds with must bet and no raising. Seems to be 6 way action to the river.

Actually, 20/40, because it had a 5 bet cap.

Play selectively in position, fold if you don't flop anything, otherwise go to the river. Really, you only have to call one bet each round.


I don't think position matters in this game, you know what the action on each street is going to be.

I was thinking that you would play about the best 5% of the hands, and plan on going to the river with them. AA, KK, QQ, JJ, AK, AQ, and AJsuited, and AT suited.

[Ed S.]

I would play it. .

Be selective and get in when the geting is good. Save bets where applicable. You may lose 3-4-5 pots but that one pot will more than make up for it.

I usually sit down when I do play 4-8 with $250, but thats just me. I don't have any other money to play with. Thats what I buy-in and have all those nice looking white chips sitting in front of me.


Ed S.

[Bob T.]

I usually sit down when I do play 4-8 with $250, but thats just me. I don't have any other money to play with.

That is the exact problem with this game. It costs $120 to see the river. You have to win one of your first two hands, or your done. FWIW, I wasn't in this game, but two of my friends were. One Lost about $450, the other one won about $1200. Both are pretty big swings, if you were going to go and play 4-8.

[Louie Landale]

But you gain a lot of information when the selective players are in. If its just you and the maniacs 2nd pair is pretty good, but you can dump it when the tight player calls on the flop. So position isn't as important, but it still matters.

- Louie

[Ed Miller]

Oh my dear lord you play! Are you kidding me? You wait for big pairs and AK then call all bets to the end.

[Ed Miller]

Ya.. fair enough... if I were on a 4-8 bankroll and interested in playing 4-8, then I might skip the game. Being that my regular game is now around 15-30, I would 10x prefer to play in this crazy 4-8 game than my standard 15-30 game.

[Bob T.]

Right, I would have played, if I could have pried someone out of a seat, but I thought that the problem is one that some people might be faced with someday, and they might want to think about their choices before it comes up.

[anatta]

In wild games, where you can expect 7 way action and its always capped, I have always liked this strategy ever since I read it here about 6 months ago...

Play any pocket pair and any suited ace from any position, fold everything else. If you flop a set, overpair, or flush draw, cap, if not, fold.

With 4 wild ones, you may not always get the mult-way action for this to work. In that case, I would fold the A9s and 88s, but add AKo, AQo, probably KQs too.

[jaydoggie]

there's games like that frequently in the 2/4 up there bob /forums/images/icons/smile.gif

personally i hate to get involved with them because im a poor newb. /forums/images/icons/smile.gif

[bernie]

i agree, position always matters.

you never know when they may slow down. and id much rather be acting last when they do. so then i can see how they react before i have to.

b

[bernie]

this is an interesting point. and youre dead on about it.

i think much of it lies in the fact that if this were how 4-8 games always played, youd need a much bigger bankroll to sustain the swings than you do a normal 4-8 game. much bigger than the standard 300BB. my normal buy in wouldnt cover this type of game, longrun-wise.

bankroll consideration is very important in playing these types of games alot. though they are fun to try for a session or so.

b

[bernie]

would you be so enthusiastic if this were your 15-30 game?

doubt it. but i think this was posted before your response above.

b

[SoBeDude]

I was thinking that you would play about the best 5% of the hands, and plan on going to the river with them. AA, KK, QQ, JJ, AK, AQ, and AJsuited, and AT suited.

I'm asking because I don't know and I'm curious. It seems to me that with a bunch of ppl calling to the river, TP/TK isn't going to win many hands. It seems like the big suiteds might be a better way to go. Cards like JTs QJs, T9s for example (and of course AK and KQs).

They have the chance to make a big hand which will pay off big when they hit.

Just my thoughts

-Scott

[Allan]

I agree that in comparison to a 4-8 bankroll you'd have to have a large one, but if you're thinking about this game like it's 16-32 or 20-40 then I think it can be relatively small. Smaller than 300bb for sure.


Allan

[bernie]

i was talking about a bankroll if your playing in these games often. no, youre not buying in for 300BB. but your main bankroll, not sessionroll, will need to be much larger to sustain the swings of this type of game.

$2400 isnt much of a bankroll in a 20-40 game. it's more than enough for a session, but not to really play as an operating roll.

for 20-40 id like to have about $12,000 behind me. which isnt saying i wont play that limit without it. id take a shot at it at times. but i wouldnt be playing it regularly

b

[Allan]

Bob,

I think in this scenario you wouldn't be playing enough hands if you only played the ones you've listed. Think of it this way: if you were getting 6 way action to the river and it was a one bet cap on each street what hands would you play?

If you are really thinking of the game as a larger structure with smaller blinds and it really is being capped each round then that 1 bet cap on each street is in effect. All those bets going in are just giving the illusion of action.

Allan

There was a thread started about online raise or fold structure that I'll try and dig up. Although it didn't generate that huge of a discussion it is certainly pertinent to this thread.

[Allan]

This thread is from a while back and never really got that big of a discussion started. The small info there relates to this thread though.

Dynasty's raise or fold structure post (http://www.twoplustwo.com/forums/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=smallholdem&Number=177339& Forum=smallholdem&Words=Strategy%20advice%20for%20 true%20poker&Match=Entire%20Phrase&Searchpage=0&Li mit=25&Old=1year&Main=177339&Search=true#Post17733 9)

Allan