Rate my Play

$10+$1 NL SNG on party last night. I played the hand very different from how I normally do. I want to know what you all think.

5 players left. I'm chipleader with ~2300.


UTG: Villain 2230
MP: Hero 2300
Button: Has about 1570
SB: Has 1100
BB: Has 800

Blinds at 75/150 and they increase next hand.

I'm dealt 66. My read on UTG is that he's a novice. I saw him slowroll some guy earlier with the nut boat so he's a jerk, and probably fairly new to this game so he's not good. I've also seen him limp UTG several times.

UTG limps for 150. I raise to 400. Button folds, SB folds, BB folds, UTG takes a while then calls.

Pot: 1025. Flop comes 7 5 3 rainbow. He bets 300. I immediately put him on two overs and I raise to 900 (leaving me with about 1000). He calls fairly quickly. This doesn't change my read, though.

Turn pot is 2825 and the turn is another 7, pairing the board. He checks. I push in for my last 1K or so. He thinks for about 8 seconds and calls all-in. (I'm returned 70 chips).

Thoughts, comments... like I said, I usually play my mid PP's more tight-aggressive than this, but I was not worried about getting outplayed by Villain in this case, and was also hoping for one of the shorter stacks to move in on me with KT or A8 or whatever.

[Hornacek]

I would have folded preflop.

[Tuben]

I like it.

[kevkev60614]

I don't mind playing PP from mid position 5 handed, but I'm a lot less aggressive with them.

It's been my experience that $11 donks who bet into the pf raiser on the flop almost always have something.

But if you're really confident in your read on the flop, why not push? I don't like raising almost half my stack.

[unfrgvn]

I don't mind the play. Personally, I would have checked behind on the turn, because I can never imagine what they can call the preflop raise with, plus call the flop raise with, that I can beat here. I'm often wrong and find they are calling with KQ, A3, back door flush. If he called your all in with only overcards and you got rivered, then this is just a bad beat post. /images/graemlins/smirk.gif
If he had A7, which seems to me to be the only hand he should have that matches the betting, then you got unlucky. River a 4.

I do not really care for this. You said villain limps utg often, so I wouldnt put it past him to have a 7 such as A7. If he is bad like you say, he would have probably reraised with any 2 broadway cards. I would have folded preflop, he is too close to you in chips, I would not want to get involved in a big pot with a small pocket pair. In your case though, you reraise preflop, he calls. I would have just called him on the flop beings you are getting 4-1 with medium pair, and once that next 7 came I would have check/folded. It was obvious you were not shaking this kid, and he could very well have a 7. Also by doing this, you have 1k in chips which is enough to work with

[downtown]

[ QUOTE ]
$10+$1 NL SNG on party last night. I played the hand very different from how I normally do. I want to know what you all think.

5 players left. I'm chipleader with ~2300.


UTG: Villain 2230
MP: Hero 2300
Button: Has about 1570
SB: Has 1100
BB: Has 800

Blinds at 75/150 and they increase next hand.

I'm dealt 66. My read on UTG is that he's a novice. I saw him slowroll some guy earlier with the nut boat so he's a jerk, and probably fairly new to this game so he's not good. I've also seen him limp UTG several times.

UTG limps for 150. I raise to 400. Button folds, SB folds, BB folds, UTG takes a while then calls.

Pot: 1025. Flop comes 7 5 3 rainbow. He bets 300. I immediately put him on two overs and I raise to 900 (leaving me with about 1000). He calls fairly quickly. This doesn't change my read, though.

Turn pot is 2825 and the turn is another 7, pairing the board. He checks. I push in for my last 1K or so. He thinks for about 8 seconds and calls all-in. (I'm returned 70 chips).

Thoughts, comments... like I said, I usually play my mid PP's more tight-aggressive than this, but I was not worried about getting outplayed by Villain in this case, and was also hoping for one of the shorter stacks to move in on me with KT or A8 or whatever.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't like any part of how you played this hand at all.

1) You're not really the chip leader over the villain, he can effectively bust you.

2) You're making reads of his specific holdings when you should be putting your opponent on a range of hands. Why are you so heavily discounting A7, K7, 33, 55, and 88-JJ??? There's no way to know you're ahead. I agree that there is a good chance you're ahead, but you can't just come across like you know for sure. You're essentially guessing here, which is why I hate playing 66 here in this way. Unless it's your neighbor and you can see in his window across the street, or you have the software that scans your opponents cards, of course.

3) "and was also hoping for one of the shorter stacks to move in on me with KT or A8 or whatever." This doesn't make any sense... why did you pop it to t400 then? This is an argument for limping, and a poor one at that.

I would limp and play for set value vs. the other big stack. You're right that this is a favorable flop for you, but I would proceed with more caution and use the information that my opponent's flop call of a raise (which would now take less of your stack since you didn't raise PF) gave me without ignoring it and just saying "he's not good" and "he must be on overs."

(Edited for clairty.)

[splashpot]

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Personally, I would have checked behind on the turn, because I can never imagine what they can call the preflop raise with, plus call the flop raise with, that I can beat here.

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He put the guy on overcards. It's definately bad to give overcards a free card here.

[unfrgvn]

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Personally, I would have checked behind on the turn, because I can never imagine what they can call the preflop raise with, plus call the flop raise with, that I can beat here.

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He put the guy on overcards. It's definately bad to give overcards a free card here.

[/ QUOTE ]

Agreed, what I meant to say is because I would never call both of the raises with just overcards, I almost always give my opponent credit for more than over cards. I meant this as more a slap at my own play than his.

I'm glad to see such a disparity in advice. That was kind of what I was hoping for. I thought there were several ways to play this hand and it took me a long time to decide my play PF. I chose this play which was ultra-LAG for my standards, but it felt right.

Result: Villain held AK and rivered an A. Ok, big deal. It happens. I should be glad he played it this way. (He played it horribly IMO, far worse than any of my plays I believe). I should be glad to get an all-in call on the river as a 6-to-1 favorite.

However, now my dilemma is that I'm left with 70 chips. That's it.

So my follow-up question is this: Did I overplay my 66 here? And by overplay I mean doing anything more expensive than limp/folding if I miss the flop? Usually this is my play when Im the chipleader this close to the bubble, and the only other player who can damage me is already in the pot.

My initial thought was that "That was stupid, why did I do that?" But then I thought, "I had a read, thought I could outplay villain...did, and lost. Oh well. I don't want to back into first place, I want to come in through the front door."

So I went to bed with this dilemma...was this poor tournament strategy?? If this was a cash game I wouldn't care. But was I stupid to play 66 in my position? Or should I follow my instincts here?

By the way, was my flop-raise to 800 enough to get two overcards to fold? I thought it was...and by the way, no i was not playing my gutshot in this hand. I realize I had one, but I was going on the premise that my 2nd pair was good.

[jedi]

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But if you're really confident in your read on the flop, why not push? I don't like raising almost half my stack.

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[unfrgvn]

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Result: Villain held AK and rivered an A. Ok, big deal. It happens. I should be glad he played it this way. (He played it horribly IMO, far worse than any of my plays I believe). I should be glad to get an all-in call on the river as a 6-to-1 favorite.



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That is a horribly played AK. Of course one of the strengths of AK is we can play it aggressivly and make small pairs fold. I guess he had you on overcards like a worse ace or KQ. Or he just thought his AK was so pretty he should call every bet. It appears you aren't gonna get him to fold no matter what you do. I suppose the best chance was to push on the flop, but he surely would have read that for a bluff?

[pooh74]

I think its sometimes hard to seperate our "feelings" about a player from the way way we play them. There is a lot of overlap between a "read" and just a "grudge". If I am one of two large stacks at the table, I try to avoid deep HU matches with the other with mediocre holdings.

I really feel this play was driven more by "dislike" than by what you thought was smart play. By that I mean, your play was fine given your read, but your choosing of this confrontation was bad. Thats alright, I do it often as well...but it gets me in trouble.

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By that I mean, your play was fine given your read, but your choosing of this confrontation was bad. Thats alright, I do it often as well...but it gets me in trouble.

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Yeah, I almost wish I wasn't paying close attention so that I wouldn't have noticed how bad of a player he was. My normal play here is probably limp and fold on the flop if unimproved.

Anyway, I think Im tired of the $10's. The $5's have crisper play than the $10's. But I'm overly bankrolled for even the 22s so I'll probably just start playing those now.

I hope people at the 22s know to fold to a large flop raise from a preflop aggressor with an unimproved AK. If not then I think I'll just start playing poker for fun, and not for money.

[splashpot]

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I hope people at the 22s know to fold to a large flop raise from a preflop aggressor with an unimproved AK.

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I play the $22s. I sure as hell hope this doesn't stop.

[downtown]

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I hope people at the 22s know to fold to a large flop raise from a preflop aggressor with an unimproved AK. If not then I think I'll just start playing poker for fun, and not for money.

[/ QUOTE ]

Make sure to let us all know how playing for fun goes.

[se2schul]

You and villain are co-chip leaders. You guys can really do damage to eachother. If one of the co-chip leaders enters a pot, the other needs pretty good cards to play in the hand or needs to know that the other big stack is capable of folding decent holding if put all in. Keep this in mind.

So, you're holding 66 - a marginal hand at best. This is a hand you could bully the smaller stacks with, or make the co-chip leader fold IF HE'S GOOD. By your own admission, the other big stack isn't a good player and probably doesn't know when it's correct to fold. You actually need a hand to play against a bad player that won't fold when it's correct to do so.

This might've been good play at a higher buyin against a more knowledgable opponent, but I think it stinks at a $11 against a donk.

BTW, I think "overcards" are too narrow of a range to put him on.

[lorinda]

If you're genuinely happy with your read, you should push while you still have six outs if you are wrong.

You don't want a Jack to come and then the Villain to bet at you, that would be too unpleasant.

Take the nice pot now.

Lori