The "M" word??? Help settle a bet.

[tpir90036]

OK. So last night I was at dinner with some college friends and a few other people. I don't remember exactly what we were talking about... but I ended up using the word "mulatto" to describe someone. One of my friends got all nervous and offended and told me that word is just as bad as the "n" word and that I should be ashamed of myself.

No one else at the table knew one way or the other. Neither the dictionary.com entry (http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=mulatto) nor the wikipedia entry (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mulatto) makes any mention of prejudice or malice. Did I miss a memo?

-tpir

Edit: There is a small mention of the term being possibly offensive in the wikipedia article.

[FouTight]

wow.

just wow.

I always though it was "Milano"... named such for the nature of these cookies...

http://www.pepperidgefarm.com/images/indulgent_treats/cookies_top_milano.jpg

[-Skeme-]

http://www.pbs.org/pov/borders/2004/images/air_hybrid_p2_videopic.jpg

[B Dids]

I am aware that some people don't like the term, it isn't universally offensive. Nowhere near "the n word" at all.

[swede123]

Once in a conversation with a friend, I mentioned the word mulatto (which my white ass doesn't consider offensive) and my friend did not know what it was. After explaining what it meant she said "Oh, you mean a swirl." So, compared to my friend's expression mulatto is very P.C.

P.S. No offense intended, apologies if I upset anyone with this silly story.

Swede

[StevieG]

People are overly sensitive in the U.S. I'm not surprised this term offended someone, despite the fact it is inoffensive.

There is nothing racist in the etymology of the word
"niggardly" either, but that did not help this guy. (http://www.adversity.net/special/niggardly.htm)

[HopeydaFish]

From Dictionary.com:

"The terms mulatto, quadroon, and octoroon originated with the racial policies of European colonizers in the Americas, especially the Spanish. Because civil rights and responsibilities were based directly on the degree of European blood that a person had, such classifications were highly elaborated, and minor distinctions in ancestry were carefully recorded. While these terms have highly precise definitions, in actual practice they were often used based on impressions of skin color rather than definite knowledge of ancestry."

So yes, the word is up there with the 'n' word in terms of its potential to offend people. Anytime you use words that were used primarily by slave-traders, you can get yourself into hot water.

[Patrick del Poker Grande]

[ QUOTE ]
wow.

just wow.

I always though it was "Milano"... named such for the nature of these cookies...

http://www.pepperidgefarm.com/images/indulgent_treats/cookies_top_milano.jpg

[/ QUOTE ]
You mean:
http://oseb79.free.fr/images/Stars/Alyssa%20milano%2012.JPG

[DMBFan23]

[ QUOTE ]
People are overly sensitive in the U.S. I'm not surprised this term offended someone, despite the fact it is inoffensive.

There is nothing racist in the etymology of the word
"niggardly" either, but that did not help this guy. (http://www.adversity.net/special/niggardly.htm)

[/ QUOTE ]

yeah that,s really retarded, but he might have wanted to think about that one first.

[billyjex]

this one white dude in my frat used to have curly hair like a black guy and we called him mulatto.

[sfer]

Jewess is the best antiquated word along these lines.

[Soul Daddy]

My ex completely wigged on me one night when I used this term. My reaction was similar to yours, I'm sure. I was pretty sure she was crazy. It turns out she was somewhat correct, if a bit dramatic. If you think of the origin, it's easy to see why it is offensive.

Actually, she was kind of crazy too.

[HopeydaFish]

[ QUOTE ]
Jewess is the best antiquated word along these lines.

[/ QUOTE ]

I was talking to my father awhile ago about my parents' recent vacation to Jamaica. He was telling me how an NFL player was staying at the resort at the same time with his wife. My mother overheard the conversation and called out from the other room "She was very pretty...but I can't remember, was she white or a negress?"

[Jersey Nick]

[ QUOTE ]
I ended up using the word "mulatto" to describe someone. One of my friends got all nervous and offended and told me that word is just as bad as the "n" word and that I should be ashamed of myself.

[/ QUOTE ]
The safe term according to my cousin (whose mom is Italian and dad is Black) is "mixed race".

[CrazyEyez]

[ QUOTE ]
http://www.pbs.org/pov/borders/2004/images/air_hybrid_p2_videopic.jpg

[/ QUOTE ]
Beautifully done.

[kyro]

I've been taught in a textbook what a mulatto is. No textbook told me to call blacks "n-words."

[sfer]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Jewess is the best antiquated word along these lines.

[/ QUOTE ]

I was talking to my father awhile ago about my parents' recent vacation to Jamaica. He was telling me how an NFL player was staying at the resort at the same time with his wife. My mother overheard the conversation and called out from the other room "She was very pretty...but I can't remember, was she white or a negress?"

[/ QUOTE ]

You win.

[bwana devil]

[ QUOTE ]
dictionary.com entry (http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=mulatto) nor the wikipedia entry (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mulatto) makes any mention of prejudice or malice.
-tpir

Edit: There is a small mention of the term being possibly offensive in the wikipedia article.

[/ QUOTE ]

no it doesnt say it is possibly offensive. it says it is offensive to some english speakers.

one of the flaws in people’s reasoning on this board is to try an defend their viewpoint by using dictionary definitions to back their logic. definitions are so rigid that they don’t take into account the actual connotations that the word takes on. huge pet peeve of mine.

mulatto in the English language is an antiquated term and if you don’t want to sound like your grandparents and you don’t want to risk needlessly offending anyone, try a more contemporary term.

[asofel]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
dictionary.com entry (http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=mulatto) nor the wikipedia entry (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mulatto) makes any mention of prejudice or malice.
-tpir

Edit: There is a small mention of the term being possibly offensive in the wikipedia article.

[/ QUOTE ]

no it doesnt say it is possibly offensive. it says it is offensive to some english speakers.

one of the flaws in people’s reasoning on this board is to try an defend their viewpoint by using dictionary definitions to back their logic. definitions are so rigid that they don’t take into account the actual connotations that the word takes on. huge pet peeve of mine.

mulatto in the English language is an antiquated term and if you don’t want to sound like your grandparents and you don’t want to risk needlessly offending anyone, try a more contemporary term.

[/ QUOTE ]

what would that term be? I'm feeling pretty ignorant as I didn't realize the connotations of 'mulatto'.

[kyro]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
dictionary.com entry (http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=mulatto) nor the wikipedia entry (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mulatto) makes any mention of prejudice or malice.
-tpir

Edit: There is a small mention of the term being possibly offensive in the wikipedia article.

[/ QUOTE ]

no it doesnt say it is possibly offensive. it says it is offensive to some english speakers.

one of the flaws in people’s reasoning on this board is to try an defend their viewpoint by using dictionary definitions to back their logic. definitions are so rigid that they don’t take into account the actual connotations that the word takes on. huge pet peeve of mine.

mulatto in the English language is an antiquated term and if you don’t want to sound like your grandparents and you don’t want to risk needlessly offending anyone, try a more contemporary term.

[/ QUOTE ]

what would that term be? I'm feeling pretty ignorant as I didn't realize the connotations of 'mulatto'.

[/ QUOTE ]

I believe the PC term is Caucafrican.

[bwana devil]

[ QUOTE ]
what would that term be? I'm feeling pretty ignorant as I didn't realize the connotations of 'mulatto'.

[/ QUOTE ]

biracial or interracial i think would do the trick. im sure there are others.

[asofel]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
what would that term be? I'm feeling pretty ignorant as I didn't realize the connotations of 'mulatto'.

[/ QUOTE ]

biracial or interracial i think would do the trick. im sure there are others.

[/ QUOTE ]

ok cool, that's what i'd tend to use anyway.

[housenuts]

your friends sounds like a bunch of pinko communists

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=mulatto

[drewjustdrew]

what about cafe au lait?

[maryfield48]

[ QUOTE ]
People are overly sensitive in the U.S. I'm not surprised this term offended someone, despite the fact it is inoffensive.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm curious. What does the word "inoffensive" mean to you?

[bravos1]

[ QUOTE ]
what about cafe au lait?

[/ QUOTE ]

Oreo???

People go way to far with this IMO

[stabn]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
what would that term be? I'm feeling pretty ignorant as I didn't realize the connotations of 'mulatto'.

[/ QUOTE ]

biracial or interracial i think would do the trick. im sure there are others.

[/ QUOTE ]

Neither of these is as specific as mulatto.

[sexdrugsmoney]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
http://www.pbs.org/pov/borders/2004/images/air_hybrid_p2_videopic.jpg

[/ QUOTE ]
Beautifully done.

[/ QUOTE ]

Great post. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

And yeah - mulatto can only be used in 3 situations:

1) When singing Nirvana's "Smells like Teen Spirit"
2) When discussing cross-mixing of animals like some birds.
3) When discussing the Spanish policy of "cleaning the blood" within Latin America. (hence why the term takes offence)

[bwana devil]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
what would that term be? I'm feeling pretty ignorant as I didn't realize the connotations of 'mulatto'.

[/ QUOTE ]

biracial or interracial i think would do the trick. im sure there are others.

[/ QUOTE ]

Neither of these is as specific as mulatto.

[/ QUOTE ]

i agree.

[daryn]

http://www.cohsoft.com.au/nature/gallery/z/zebra.jpg

[HopeydaFish]

I remember reading about a study where they asked both white people and black people to describe a zebra. The white people described the zebra as being "white with black stripes", while the black people described the zebra as being "black with white stripes".

[sexdrugsmoney]

[ QUOTE ]
I remember reading about a study where they asked both white people and black people to describe a zebra. The white people described the zebra as being "white with black stripes", while the black people described the zebra as being "black with white stripes".

[/ QUOTE ]

Clearly the black people were wrong and trying to claim something that is not theirs.

Like Colin Powell. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[HopeydaFish]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I remember reading about a study where they asked both white people and black people to describe a zebra. The white people described the zebra as being "white with black stripes", while the black people described the zebra as being "black with white stripes".

[/ QUOTE ]

Clearly the black people were wrong and trying to claim something that is not theirs.

Like Colin Powell. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Or Tiger Woods! /images/graemlins/laugh.gif

[Ulysses]

Yeah, a lot of people find it offensive. I think it is great. I think it is even cooler to know words like "octaroon" and "mulattress."

I believe the PC words are biracial, mixed race, etc.

As a generic non-race-specific term, I like "halfie." I also like "half-breed" but again, some are less fond of that term.

[TheMainEvent]

[ QUOTE ]
I remember reading about a study where they asked both white people and black people to describe a zebra. The white people described the zebra as being "white with black stripes", while the black people described the zebra as being "black with white stripes".

[/ QUOTE ]

Interesting, but if all zebras are similar to the one in the picture posted, the ones who say "black with white stripes" are clearly wrong.

[HopeydaFish]

[ QUOTE ]

Interesting, but if all zebras are similar to the one in the picture posted, the ones who say "black with white stripes" are clearly black.

[/ QUOTE ]

FYP

[dtbog]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
http://www.pbs.org/pov/borders/2004/images/air_hybrid_p2_videopic.jpg

[/ QUOTE ]
Beautifully done.

[/ QUOTE ]

[Blarg]

If you're white, you're supposed to be either ashamed or ready to be no matter what you do, so don't sweat it. There will always be someone waiting to yank your chain or freak you out that you might have made some kind of terrible mis-step.

Your "friend" sucks. It's your intent that matters. If it wasn't offensive, your friend was a jackass to either be nervous or offended, much less tell you that you should be ashamed of yourself.

I repeat, your "friend" sucks.

[Blarg]

[ QUOTE ]
From Dictionary.com:

"The terms mulatto, quadroon, and octoroon originated with the racial policies of European colonizers in the Americas, especially the Spanish. Because civil rights and responsibilities were based directly on the degree of European blood that a person had, such classifications were highly elaborated, and minor distinctions in ancestry were carefully recorded. While these terms have highly precise definitions, in actual practice they were often used based on impressions of skin color rather than definite knowledge of ancestry."

So yes, the word is up there with the 'n' word in terms of its potential to offend people. Anytime you use words that were used primarily by slave-traders, you can get yourself into hot water.

[/ QUOTE ]

Big logical leap here.

You are presuming that these words were never used by the people themselves, and/or that they were taken as insults by those people.

Your quote doesn't even address either of these questions, so therefore it is neither determinative regarding this discussion nor even particularly pertinent to it.

[Blarg]

[ QUOTE ]
People are overly sensitive in the U.S. I'm not surprised this term offended someone, despite the fact it is inoffensive.

There is nothing racist in the etymology of the word
"niggardly" either, but that did not help this guy. (http://www.adversity.net/special/niggardly.htm)

[/ QUOTE ]

I remember that. Poor guy lost his job for using a perfectly ordinary word with no negative etymology whatsoever.

Ignorance and pettiness once again reign triumphant, even at the cost of an innocent person's career.

Sickening.

[Duke]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
what would that term be? I'm feeling pretty ignorant as I didn't realize the connotations of 'mulatto'.

[/ QUOTE ]

biracial or interracial i think would do the trick. im sure there are others.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is not specific enough. Once you're forced to use a word that is so nondescript as to leave a ton of margin for miscommunication, there is no longer any point using a word to describe it at all.

Newspeak sucks.

~D

[The Goober]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
what would that term be? I'm feeling pretty ignorant as I didn't realize the connotations of 'mulatto'.

[/ QUOTE ]

biracial or interracial i think would do the trick. im sure there are others.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is not specific enough. Once you're forced to use a word that is so nondescript as to leave a ton of margin for miscommunication, there is no longer any point using a word to describe it at all.

Newspeak sucks.

~D

[/ QUOTE ]

What about describing people as "asian" instead of the old-school "oriental"? I mean, asian covers lots of indians, russians, and others that we don't usually consider "asian"...

[Richie Rich]

[ QUOTE ]
http://www.pbs.org/pov/borders/2004/images/air_hybrid_p2_videopic.jpg

[/ QUOTE ]
Well done, which is somewhat surprising considering you're a teenage prick.

[phixxx]

keke

[Ulysses]

[ QUOTE ]
told me that word is just as bad as the "n" word and that I should be ashamed of myself.

[/ QUOTE ]

I did not address this in my initial response. It is not in the same ballpark. It is more analgous to using the word "oriental" where nowadays PC people typically use "asian" "slant" or "slope."

[jstnrgrs]

The "M" word is molestered.

[MCS]

[ QUOTE ]
this one white dude in my frat used to have curly hair like a black guy and we called him mulatto.

[/ QUOTE ]

And if you can't trust frat guys to be sensitive about stuff like this, who CAN you trust?

I thought guys in frats didn't like it when you called them frats. The fraternity/frat/country/c--t line. Maybe it's just some of the guys I knew.

[-Skeme-]

[ QUOTE ]
Well done, which is somewhat surprising considering you're a teenage prick.

[/ QUOTE ]

As long as I can actually understand pot odds, I'm good.

[Aloysius]

Jewess = easily the best / possibly offensive antiquated ethnic term, not even close.

I recently dated a Jewess - referred to her as such - the fact that she found it amusing did not prevent me from breaking up with her, but it helped prolong the relationship an extra few weeks.

[rocketlaunch]

I have a friend who is a mulatto. I say that because that's the exact term she uses to describe herself. (And not in the same way some black people will use "n".)

[tpir90036]

[ QUOTE ]
I've been taught in a textbook what a mulatto is. No textbook told me to call blacks "n-words."

[/ QUOTE ]
This was my argument at the table. There was some bad argument that followed with shaky premises such as "people wanted evolution out of books back in the day so schools can not be trusted."

[tpir90036]

[ QUOTE ]
It is more analgous to using the word "oriental" where nowadays PC people typically use "asian" "slant" or "slope."

[/ QUOTE ]
I used this analogy too!!! Minus the "slant" and "slope" part obviously. My opponent was trying to classify all these terms binary style though... so it was either correct or not.

[MCS]

[ QUOTE ]
There was some bad argument that followed with shaky premises such as "people wanted evolution out of books back in the day so schools can not be trusted."

[/ QUOTE ]

Dude, in my county, people want evolution out TODAY.

It's a disgrace.

[goofball]

[ QUOTE ]
http://www.cohsoft.com.au/nature/gallery/z/zebra.jpg

[/ QUOTE ]


Sometimes you just think ramdom things are really funny.