Creating meaning in my life

[mason55]

Ok, this isn't like a QLC post here. I'm not depressed or anything. But here's my story.

I'm 22, living alone in DC. I have a good job, as in, it pays the bills. I'm a programmer for the DoD. Now, let me tell you, it's not a very fulfilling job. Bascially, I help the military kill as many people as possible. I am very good at what I do, but I can't see myself being a programmer forever. I'm planning to go back to school (law or finance maybe, if I'm going to be miserable then I might as well make a lot of money), but until then I would like to do something else that will provide me with fulfillment (and maybe help meet some cute girls?)

I don't know, what do other people do besides work and play TV? I work out after work, go out drinking with my friends, play poker and video games, all that jazz.

Give me some suggestions.

PS: Flame away /images/graemlins/cool.gif

[SpearsBritney]

rock star

[Michael Davis]

You don't deserve a flaming. There isn't anything you can do to give meaning to your life, because there is no meaning. You can't even escape this through suicide so you should just accept it.

-Michael

[mason55]

[ QUOTE ]
rock star

[/ QUOTE ]

yeah... i've been partying like a rock star for the last 5 straight years. i'm pretty sure that's causing some of my problems.

[kurosh]

What makes you happy? Do that.

I like to improve myself. I like to learn things in general and specific topics excite me a lot. There are certain people I enjoy being around a lot and that's pretty much it.

[Patrick del Poker Grande]

How're your reflexes? I suggest you train to be a cage fighter.

[mason55]

[ QUOTE ]
How're your reflexes? I suggest you train to be a cage fighter.

[/ QUOTE ]

I played goalie for 10 years. I have awesome reflexes. More info please?

[mason55]

[ QUOTE ]
You don't deserve a flaming. There isn't anything you can do to give meaning to your life, because there is no meaning. You can't even escape this through suicide so you should just accept it.

-Michael

[/ QUOTE ]

Oh yeah... I guess I could lay off the existentialist literature. That kind of put me in a funk.

[mmmmmbrother]

make a dame kesi dilla

[mason55]

[ QUOTE ]
What makes you happy? Do that.

I like to improve myself. I like to learn things in general and specific topics excite me a lot. There are certain people I enjoy being around a lot and that's pretty much it.

[/ QUOTE ]

I love learning. The problem is I know all this stuff and feel like it's a waste cause I never get to apply it to anything.

Maybe I'll try out for Jeopardy.

I'm a very goal oriented person and I just don't have any short term goals. I think that's my problem.

[mason55]

[ QUOTE ]
make a dame kesi dilla

[/ QUOTE ]

/images/graemlins/confused.gif

[ucfryan]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
make a dame kesi dilla

[/ QUOTE ]

/images/graemlins/confused.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Quesadilla obviously.

What are your interests?

[mason55]

[ QUOTE ]
What are your interests?

[/ QUOTE ]

Learning. Sleeping. Drinking.

The occasional acid flashback.

[Shajen]

I've said it before and I'll say it again: perfect spot for the "crop duster"

/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Hey man, you should seriously list your interests and stuff, I'm sure the collective brain power of OOT can come up with some ideas for you.

[Cancer Merchant]

Be happy, the people your job liquidates don't get to ask this question.

[mason55]

I'm tired of my interests, I want new ones.

[Patrick del Poker Grande]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
How're your reflexes? I suggest you train to be a cage fighter.

[/ QUOTE ]

I played goalie for 10 years. I have awesome reflexes. More info please?

[/ QUOTE ]
What kind of goalie? Were you any good?

[Supersetoy]

How much money do you have?

Save up, quit your job and go travel the world. Don't come back until you "miss home".

Volunteer in your area? Join a recreational sports team? I'm feeling the same way you are...I think a lot of early 20s/recent college grads feel this way.

In fact, I just asked a friend of mine who is currently in grad school: "If I am bored of my life, should I stop it?"

Here is the answer I received: "If it pleases you, yes."

[mason55]

[ QUOTE ]

What kind of goalie? Were you any good?

[/ QUOTE ]

Ice hockey. Played varsity in high school for 2 years. I was decent but never had any chance to do anything with it.

[theben]

go out and drink more. become less ugly

[shant]

Learn Flash. Your programming skills will transfer over into Actionscripting. The pay is great, you get to work on cool projects, and you can tell cute girls you're a designer. I'm not sure I know of any design firms in DC though, you'd probably have to move to LA or NY or SF.

[lem45216]

Learn an instrument, like the bass guitar (i would say guitar, but as a bassist myself, i am 100% biased) chicks love guitars and basses, plus you could form a band, and maybe oneday become famous. And to become really good would obviously require dedication and work etc = fullfilment in your life.

[Patrick del Poker Grande]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

What kind of goalie? Were you any good?

[/ QUOTE ]

Ice hockey. Played varsity in high school for 2 years. I was decent but never had any chance to do anything with it.

[/ QUOTE ]
Where did you play? This would be meaningful if you were in Minnesota, Michigan UP, or Canada, but if it's something like Madison WI, then I'm sorry it doesn't count.

[mason55]

[ QUOTE ]
Learn Flash. Your programming skills will transfer over into Actionscripting. The pay is great, you get to work on cool projects, and you can tell cute girls you're a designer. I'm not sure I know of any design firms in DC though, you'd probably have to move to LA or NY or SF.

[/ QUOTE ]

I know actionscript very well. I have zero design skills. And I hate DC so leaving here wouldn't be a problem.

[mason55]

[ QUOTE ]

Where did you play? This would be meaningful if you were in Minnesota, Michigan UP, or Canada, but if it's something like Madison WI, then I'm sorry it doesn't count.

[/ QUOTE ]

Trust me it doesn't count.

(go buckeyes)

[Patrick del Poker Grande]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

Where did you play? This would be meaningful if you were in Minnesota, Michigan UP, or Canada, but if it's something like Madison WI, then I'm sorry it doesn't count.

[/ QUOTE ]

Trust me it doesn't count.

(go buckeyes)

[/ QUOTE ]
Oh yeah. Well... I am still kind of desperate to find a decent goalie. Want to move to Denver and start a team? There's lots of tech jobs here and it's supposedly one of the best cities in the nation for 20-something singles.

[shant]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Learn Flash. Your programming skills will transfer over into Actionscripting. The pay is great, you get to work on cool projects, and you can tell cute girls you're a designer. I'm not sure I know of any design firms in DC though, you'd probably have to move to LA or NY or SF.

[/ QUOTE ]

I know actionscript very well. I have zero design skills. And I hate DC so leaving here wouldn't be a problem.

[/ QUOTE ]
Having zero design skills is not really a problem because if you can code games or actionscript heavy stuff you can get jobs out here freelance as an Actioscripter. They have designers to design stuff. If you're interested at all, let me know because I can give your info to people when they ask me if I know any good Actionscripters. The problem is they usually want people to be here in LA, or in NY or SF. I know more Flash people in LA than anywhere.

[DeezNuts]

A girl that I dated and am still good friends with moved to Wash D.C. started working at the DoD as an analyst of some sort.

From what I hear, the DoD is not overrun by cute girls. Get out of Wash D.C. and move to a city with better climate and women before you get stuck.

DN

[jba]

[ QUOTE ]
Learn Flash. Your programming skills will transfer over into Actionscripting. The pay is great

[/ QUOTE ]

can you throw out a number? also can you give a number for C#/java programmers with similar experience level in your area as well?

just curious

[mslif]

[ QUOTE ]
it's supposedly one of the best cities in the nation for 20-something singles.

[/ QUOTE ]

false advertising. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[ebaudry]

When I was 26 (a year ago), I came to the realization that the only thing that you can possibly ever accomplish in life is to be happy. It's the best thing you can do for you and its a tremendous gift to everyone around you when you are doing everything you can to feel happy and good about yourself.

It can be very difficult to figure out what makes you happy, but I would suggest removing from your life sources of "manufactured desires" meaning basically not watching TV (or at the very least not watching commercials), taking control over how you react to the various imposed media around, meditating would be a great idea (but most people are too lazy... its a vast understatement to say the rewards outweigh the "cost" of energy). Removing yourself from those imposed wants is the "easiest" way to free up your conciousness. Then your mind will see much more clearly what you personally want, and will be able to better tune out the things that companies, parents, governments, cultures etc are telling you that you should want.

I left the finance field so i can't really suggest going that route. No bombs going on, but the way you can mess with people using money is pretty atrocious too.

I'd try to meet new people as much as possible. If you think about it most (all?) of the opportunities that come into your life are through other people. Also that shared community is one of the keys towards avoiding depression.

Philosophically speaking, I would recommend to try and realize that you don't need anything outside yourself to be happy. You don't need good work, you don't need nice stuff, you don't need to live somewhere expensive. You just need whatever it takes to make yourself happy and at peace. And with a little effort you will find that what you want is completely under your control. The desires that make you feel unhappy or ill-at-ease right now can be unlearned/reprogrammed if you are willing to try. It takes a long time to undo "mental habits", but the potential reward is so valuable that making "lot of money" seems like a waste of time. If you find that you enjoy making money, then by all means go for it. But almost everyone who sets great wealth as their goal, ends up really wondering why at some point later in life. Some because they realize how difficult and far away "a lot of money" can be, and some because they get as much money as they ever wanted and find it doesn't provide for them at all what they anticipated. For most people it is a severe burden.

Anyway if you want to philosophilize at some point, pm me or something.

If you enjoy reading (or listening to books on CD), then you might check out "The Power of Now" by Eckhart Tolle. He was the first writer that I personally found to discuss conciousness and presence and how to use them to transform your life into a joyous experience, bringing great relief to all the "problems" that our overly-active little monkey brains are capable of providing. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

Best o' luck

[JaBlue]

Become a Big Brother for or a mentor or whatever they call it there for some poor DC kid that could use even your help and guidance

[mason55]

[ QUOTE ]
Become a Big Brother for or a mentor or whatever they call it there for some poor DC kid that could use even your help and guidance

[/ QUOTE ]

I have actually already looked into it. They require a one year commitment and I'm not sure if I'm going to be here a year.

[shant]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Learn Flash. Your programming skills will transfer over into Actionscripting. The pay is great

[/ QUOTE ]

can you throw out a number? also can you give a number for C#/java programmers with similar experience level in your area as well?

just curious

[/ QUOTE ]
I do Flash animation/scripting/building of sites, so it's easier for me to get work with a broader skill set, but the guys that I know that do straight Actionscripting like building modules inside sites or stand-alone games make anywhere from 65-100/hr freelance, and if they're fulltime it's usually around 70-85k salary.

[arod15]

bang mauliks mother he is form the area and you can be like everyone else.

[ethan]

[ QUOTE ]
How much money do you have?

Save up, quit your job and go travel the world. Don't come back until you "miss home".


[/ QUOTE ]

Go to Nepal. It seems to have worked well for Bruiser.

Another option would be saving up until you can buy this (http://www.vladi-private-islands.de/sales_islands/sites/01_sombra1.html).

[ptmusic]

Do some career assessments (MBTI, Johnson O'Connor, Birkman Method, CareerLeader...). Hire a career coach. Read "What Color Is Your Parachute?" by Bolles.

I've been going through the same thing for over a year now. My journey has brought me back to school for the first time in over 15 years - I'm going to graduate Business School. I'm seeking advice and learning about myself.

Good luck.

-ptmusic

[ebaudry]

Someone asked me a little about how I apply the ideas I mentioned in my last post. I thought I would share my reply here in case its of interest to anyone else.

_________

I'm really glad that you got something out of my post, I wondered at the time if anyone would care, but decided it would be good for me to write it anyway.

Putting those concepts into practice is (for me at least) very difficult. It requires rejecting most of my youth's patterns and especially being very mindful about where my beliefs and habits come from. I have been realizing over the past few years how so much of my assumptions about how the world works and how people relate to each other are based upon sit-coms, marketing directed at fueling my desires, and just general unconciousness where I have taken as "fact" my observations of some key few relationships (mother-father, me-father, me-mother, siblings, significant others).

Those patterns and habits are it turns out are largely focused towards keeping me entrenched in whatever situation I find myself, whether good or bad. Simply my behaviors are very often based around avoiding change, minimizing perceived risk, taking the easy path, and so on.

I have been making huge "sacrifices" to pursue my new vision of peace and happiness not derived from material wealth. You may be finding the same things as I did: My v.expensive house didn't make me happy, neither did my BMW, or eating out at nice restaurants and taking expensive trips. I feel naive admitting it now, but I truly believed that each of those things were going to make me happier. I believed (mostly from my Dad and from Finance Profs) that once I had a lot of money everything else would fall in line. The reality was very different. I would liken my experience to a tolerance. It was taking more and more money to "get my fix" ($50 used to be a lot of money, then $500, then $5,000, you get the idea), and I had access to basically as much money as I wanted.

So I decided to re-evaluate everything in my life based on the idea: What would I create in my life if I believed I had the ability to put anything I want in it? So my now ex-wife and I started working on the issues that plagued our relationship and realized that we would be better off and happier with other people (me with another conciousness-minded person, her with a different yuppy, so to speak). I gave her our house, sold my car, quit my job and went about trying to live a better, more peaceful life with less money.

So now I try to think of myself as not so different from a monkey (in opposition to the dominant paradigm that acts as if the planet, all animals and plants are here for our personal amusement). I differ from a monkey primarily in the level of conciousness I display, and frankly I'm a bit jealous of the monkeys since my brain keeps me a little too busy for my taste. That shift in the way I interact with the world adds a lot of humor and easy-going-ness to my life since all us human-monkeys act in such ridiculous ways (myself included). Before I do anything, or start any new project, I try to think about what part of me wants to do it, and if its in line with my happiness goals. So work-wise, I realized that there is no activity, no matter how interesting or fulfilling, that I can do happily for 40+ hrs per week. I can't even do the things I love for that long for any significant length of time. So I decided to try out the 'what would you do with your time if you won the lotto' idea. The answer for me is shockingly simple (once the t.v./marketing derived desires are set aside): I want to sleep as much as I want, at whatever times I want. I want to spend a lot of my time with friends and making new ones. I want to spend a lot of time reading and learning, but on my own pace, sometimes spending all day doing that, sometimes going for weeks without. I want to partake of hobbies that I enjoy, like poker, pot, hanging out, philosophizing, walking around, mtn. biking, etc. I want to give back to my family a little bit to feel like I am balanced towards them. I want to help my 24 y.o. sister enter the "adult world". And I want to help do my part to keep western civilization from poisoning the planet to such an extent that I can't go outside or drink water anymore

Then on the practical side, I need some money to pay rent, car insurance, food and so on. So I tried to figure out how to make money doing what I wanted to do anyway. This is really a very key concept. The result of it is that I never feel like I have to work. The idea of work is actually starting to be a little fuzzy in my head. That said, I do a lot, and many others would call it working, but is it really? I would do those things whether or not there was money in it, and I do it whenever I want. True there is a lot less money being made now than before (about 25k/yr or less, vs. 100k/yr or more before), but along with these shifts, I have really started to care less about the material side of things. I still have a car, party a lot, go on trips and so on, but I now view my car as transportation rather than as a toy, I party in cheaper ways (more pot, less bars), and my trips are cartrips to SF or wherever instead of flying to France or Amsterdam.

So the money these days comes from activities that fit into the above wants. I want to help my family so I do handyman work at my sister's house and act as a financial planner for my dad. I love games, especially poker, so I read everything I could find on how to make money doing that and am currently trying. (4-tabling $20+2 STT for $500-$2000/month). I want to help the environment so I started a non-profit called Sustainable Home Improvement in order to help homeowners make environmentally sound decisions when they remodel or upgrade their homes. Basically I try to keep my activites varied so I don't get bored (which my overly active brain likes to do if I spend too much time "working"). I end up playing poker about 20hrs/wk, helping my dad 1-2hrs/week, fixing my sisters place 1-2hrs/wk, sleeping 8-10hrs/night, and doing about 1 hour a week of trivial to-do list type stuff. If I needed more money, I would start examining other habits or interests I have and perhaps try to write something, tutor some kids in Algebra, or make a porn website, or anything else that seems neat anyway that might make some money.

There are some things that I am irreversibly giving up though, and I just have to be ok with that. I won't ever be able to buy a house on my own in L.A.. Not really a problem since I see moving to Portland or Vancouver at some point, but still its a "loss". I also am eliminating at least 90% of the dating pool since traditional values are still running strong there. I won't be taking care of a housewife, or sending my kids to a private college, but I don't beleive in "taking care" of other people financially, and think the tuition spent on school is many fold more expensive than its value. I have learned way more from my own reading time than I did in the classroom.

The net result though is a simple and peaceful life. I don't have to worry anymore about what my best available balance transfer credit card offer is. I don't worry what others think about me b/c I don't rely on them for a job, social structure, or anything else. And anyway, most people I know think I'm a little crazy for most of my beliefs. But they also knew me 2-years ago when I was a married yuppy trying to take over the company I worked for.

Anyway, I probably left out a lot, but hopefully I drew the broad strokes. Life is incredibly short and I won't spend it doing what others think is best for me. It's difficult at times (especially around LA) not feeling like people value the same things as I do, but its a small price to pay for my freedom.

-Eric

[Piz0wn0reD!!!!!!]

how do you play tv?

[1800GAMBLER]

Great post.

[ebaudry]

Oh man, this is rich. I just got an email from my old college advisor (and econ. teacher) asking me to speak on a panel at Pitzer College to graduating seniors of the economics dept.. I will be with 2 or 3 other alumni who have all been asked to discuss what their path has been following graduation and how their economics training plays into it. Needless to say I RSVPd immediately /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[captZEEbo1]

vn post. Just out of curiosity, do you think you'll be this way the rest of your life, or do you see yourself going back to the corporate world again someday?

[ebaudry]

"vn post. Just out of curiosity, do you think you'll be this way the rest of your life, or do you see yourself going back to the corporate world again someday? "

That is a mighty difficult question. I suppose the simple and honest answer is: I don't know. My instincts tell me the shift is permanent. Certainly specific aspects will flex if or when I decide to have a family, or perhaps as rising health care costs require either more money or a decreased comfort level.

The principle that I would refer to as a general response would be: I will always do what I perceive to be in my best interests. Given my particular life experiences, parents, educations, and so on, I presently believe that happiness and peace are the best things for me to create in my life. I also believe that I have the ability (read: am learning the ability) to manifest in my life those circumstances and choices that offer me maximized peace and happiness, when I consciously make the effort.

The challenge for me, and I would imagine for most people, is to maintain that level of energy and focus that is required to manifest good situations in my life. In my particular case, given my particular likes and wants, I need to go out to parks, events, and parties regularly in order to keep meeting new people. This takes quite a bit of energy, and the return on my investment is often spaced out quite far (5-10+ outings to find truly meaningful friendships, variance is a bitch) so I have to maintain a level of faith that my continuous effort pays off. Similar to "the long-run" in poker, I stay focused on the goals of peace and happiness and then at any given moment try to make little choices that lead in that direction instead of away from it. It is often very easy to tell which decision leads towards my goals and which lead away, the difficulty lies in maintaining enough presence to care enough about getting what I want. Lazyness can be the largest impediment to this, often because my mind plays tricks on me, like "you don't need to brush your teeth tonight, you have been really good about it recently". Weird "logic" that sometimes does manage to persuade me. So my big goals of peace and happiness yield a meta-goal: Each time a small choice arises, leading either towards or away from the big goals, try to choose the option that I will be happy and peaceful towards /images/graemlins/smile.gif In other words, using the teeth example, I try to choose the option that I can't argue with - I know that if I just go and brush my teeth I will be happier (more self-esteem, less dental bills, more will power, and so forth).

So tying this all back into the original question "do you think you'll be this way the rest of your life, or do you see yourself going back to the corporate world again someday?", I will only return if the sum of the choices I encounter each inarguably lead me there, and those choices are themselves imbued with peace and happiness. So my instincts say "no" because I can pretty clearly remember the types of ingrained beliefs I had to undo to finally leave that world. For example I would have to choose someday that I would prefer to get up early and go to bed accordingly (something I have never, even in school, been able to enjoy). I would have to choose to spend the majority of my time at an office, rather than with my friends/wife/kids/pets/etc. I would have to choose to allocate the planet's resources towards wealth creation instead of towards increasing biodiversity and health.

I made those types of choices easily when I was on autopilot from a finance education, but now that I understand the consequences of those choices... why would I choose to do something that brings me unhappiness and dis-ease?

As an aside, I appreciate all the feedback I have been getting on this stuff, it has been very useful for me to put down in words some of the stuff that is floating around in my head. It also has made me feel much more connected to the community around me to know that some other people are thinking about this too.

-Eric