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Saddlepoint
09-26-2005, 10:17 PM
Okay [censored] it, I didn't want to post this, because how can you live up to How Many 5 Year Olds...?, but clearly the time is right (http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=3504867&page=0&view=colla psed&sb=5&o=14&fpart=1).

The following argument has followed me from summer camp to middle school to high school to college. I've had it with dozens of people and it's never been resolved to my satisfaction.

Tomorrow morning, when the sun comes up, every single ant on planet Earth has one purpose and one purpose only: to destroy the human race. Humans receive no prior warning. The ant colonies are not working together, have no more intelligence than they would otherwise, and are still aware enough to understand that tasks like reproduction and food gathering are necessary to the war effort.

They will not stop until every single human being is dead. They would not be able to understand, nor would they accept, any kind of resolution or truce. The last ant alive will keep fighting until it's killed.

Who wins and how quickly?

Mason Hellmuth
09-26-2005, 10:21 PM
Humans and it's not close. The key is here:

[ QUOTE ]
The ant colonies are not working together [and] have no more intelligence than they would otherwise...

[/ QUOTE ]

yoshi_yoshi
09-26-2005, 10:23 PM
It's gotta be humans, though the vast majority of people will die. The reason is because we have a large # of people in the oceans, and once these people know of what's going on, they can devise a plan to continue the human race. Once survival is secured, killing every ant would be really tedious but inevitable.

shant
09-26-2005, 10:23 PM
The ants lose because we will arm ourselves with aerosol hairspray flamethrowers and they will stand no chance Trust me, I caused many an ant genocide when I was 10 years old with some AquaNet and a lighter.

Yeti
09-26-2005, 10:25 PM
Who wins?

Um, humans. I own a kettle.

mmbt0ne
09-26-2005, 10:28 PM
It'd be a lot closer if they all turned into these assholes.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Driver_ant

Bradyams
09-26-2005, 10:30 PM
People in some areas will sure have a hell of a fight on their hands though. I've watched that Ants show on the Discovery Channel. There are some crazy, flesh tearing ants out there.

TheIrishThug
09-26-2005, 10:30 PM
I think some of you are vastly underestimating the number of ants there are in the world. they also have the advantage of being able to evolve MUCH faster.

Mason Hellmuth
09-26-2005, 10:44 PM
[ QUOTE ]
they also have the advantage of being able to evolve MUCH faster.

[/ QUOTE ]
/images/graemlins/confused.gif

Saddlepoint
09-26-2005, 10:50 PM
He might mean "adapt." Really, though, everybody is SEVERELY underestimating the ants.

TheIrishThug
09-26-2005, 10:57 PM
ants reproduce faster and have natuarally shorter life spans. stronger traights will become more wide spread in the new ants because the ones that are survinging have some traight that benifited them.

TheBlueMonster
09-26-2005, 11:04 PM
Humans. There are few ants that can kill humans alone and they are limited to Tasmania (an island). Most times it takes thousands of ants to kill one large animal (human size). Even though the amount of ants vastly outnumbers the amount of people, it would take too many ants to kill one person to make their victory possible.
Plus we have insecticide. Lots of bug spray.

theweatherman
09-26-2005, 11:04 PM
Humans by far. Just think of the arsenal:

Double sided tape
glue
anteaters

No way theyd get anywhere once we got trained anteaters on our side.

The real question is will humans still die if a large component of the ecosystem is wiped out? If so then the ants have all the cards and the only option is creating robot ant replacements or else face certain doom

mslif
09-26-2005, 11:04 PM
[ QUOTE ]
ants reproduce faster and have natuarally shorter life spans. stronger traights will become more wide spread in the new ants because the ones that are survinging have some traight that benifited them.

[/ QUOTE ]

Only the queen can lay eggs. If we can kill the queens, this battle is a piece of cake!

TTChamp
09-26-2005, 11:05 PM
I don't think the ants would have a chance in cold climates, so how could they ever win?

People in cold climates would figure out what was happening, arm them selves with a ton of raid and take out the ants.

They only way I could see the ants having a chance is if they used there cooperative behavior to build weapons, but your premise doesn't allow for this.

The Ants would have no chance.

I think if the question was about one isolated area (one of the Hawaiian Islands for example) then it would be more compelling.

Paluka
09-26-2005, 11:06 PM
[ QUOTE ]
Humans. There are few ants that can kill humans alone and they are limited to Tasmania (an island). Most times it takes thousands of ants to kill one large animal (human size). Even though the amount of ants vastly outnumbers the amount of people, it would take too many ants to kill one person to make their victory possible.
Plus we have insecticide. Lots of bug spray.

[/ QUOTE ]

This post is underestimating how many ants there are.

09-26-2005, 11:17 PM
This isn't the easiest ? ever, but it's close.

As many have already noted, humans have tons of pesticides (aerosols, liquids, powders, etc.) and open communication. True, while the ants were setting upon us and warnings were being issued, thousands would ignore the warnings and die. (some dumbasses just don't understand the "You Can Never Be Too Paranoid" theory)

A word of warning: If you've never experienced this lil f***er - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fire_ant -
count yourself blessed. I got stories 'bout these summbitches! /images/graemlins/smile.gif

There's an old, old movie about army ants invading a plantation in So. America. Charlton Heston (I'm sure) and Liz Taylor(?). Creepy funny.

scotty34
09-26-2005, 11:19 PM
[ QUOTE ]
ants reproduce faster and have natuarally shorter life spans. stronger traights will become more wide spread in the new ants because the ones that are survinging have some traight that benifited them.

[/ QUOTE ]

You are aware that evolution occurs over thousands of years, not a few generations right?

TTChamp
09-26-2005, 11:20 PM
There is also a movie about smart Ants in a desert that attack a group of humans. At one point the humans hide out in a hut and the ants build these reflectors all around the house. The reflectors are at just the right angle so that the sun hits the hut and cooks the people inside.

Mason Hellmuth
09-26-2005, 11:22 PM
[ QUOTE ]
There is also a movie about smart Ants in a desert that attack a group of humans. At one point the humans hide out in a hut and the ants build these reflectors all around the house. The reflectors are at just the right angle so that the sun hits the hut and cooks the people inside.

[/ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
The ant colonies are not working together [and] have no more intelligence than they would otherwise...

[/ QUOTE ]

scotty34
09-26-2005, 11:26 PM
Humans, and it really isn't close. Sure they may eventually overrun the hillbillies with aeresol due to the sheer number of ants. The human race however has technology as well as brilliant scientists and military leaders. They can easily devise plans and technology to prevent mindless ants from taking over.

bravos1
09-26-2005, 11:28 PM
[ QUOTE ]
The ants lose because we will arm ourselves with aerosol hairspray flamethrowers and they will stand no chance Trust me, I caused many an ant genocide when I was 10 years old with some AquaNet and a lighter.

[/ QUOTE ]

My exact thought when I read this post... gotta luv crisping up some ants with aqua net and a zippo!

PoBoy321
09-26-2005, 11:29 PM
While I certainly think that many, many people would die, people would ultimately win due to the fact that we have open communication, are more intelligent and are able to devise weapons to wipe out the ants.

Plus, humans ALWAYS win. Haven't you seen Independence Day?

TheIrishThug
09-26-2005, 11:31 PM
the way i interpreted it was that a general colony would work together just as they had before. but it was more that seperate colonies would not be competing against one another, not concerned with who kills more, just that the killing happens. but it's def not every ant for himself, killing as many as they can.

i think if seperate colonies could work together, it would def increase their chances.

Mason Hellmuth
09-26-2005, 11:34 PM
[ QUOTE ]
Really, though, everybody is SEVERELY underestimating the ants.

[/ QUOTE ]
After further consideration, I agree. Proof:

http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/9093/egcover3aj.jpg

dblgutshot
09-26-2005, 11:36 PM
So you wake up tomorrow and this is all over the news, ants attacking worldwide. There hasn't been any tips or instructions from any government or police force, what is your plan, if any? Are you going to skip work?

TheIrishThug
09-26-2005, 11:40 PM
yeah, screw work. i'm heading to the nearest kmart and getting some free [censored].

fingokra
09-26-2005, 11:40 PM
I am going fishing. /images/graemlins/laugh.gif

TheBlueMonster
09-26-2005, 11:40 PM
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Humans. There are few ants that can kill humans alone and they are limited to Tasmania (an island). Most times it takes thousands of ants to kill one large animal (human size). Even though the amount of ants vastly outnumbers the amount of people, it would take too many ants to kill one person to make their victory possible.
Plus we have insecticide. Lots of bug spray.

[/ QUOTE ]

This post is underestimating how many ants there are.

[/ QUOTE ]
I was actually thinking of ant colonies. When a colony attacks something they tend to attack as a colony.
Plus not all ants are soldier ants. The OP said to assume that they still act like ants. Therefore only the soldier ants of most species would do the attacking ie. not ever single ant would try to kill us.

mmbt0ne
09-26-2005, 11:42 PM
I completely forgot to mention this earlier. Everyone has seen the MacGyver about this right?

Saddlepoint
09-26-2005, 11:53 PM
[ QUOTE ]
I completely forgot to mention this earlier. Everyone has seen the MacGyver about this right?

[/ QUOTE ]

[censored]. No. What happened?

[censored] MacGyver.

mmbt0ne
09-27-2005, 12:04 AM
</font><blockquote><font class="small">En réponse à:</font><hr />
</font><blockquote><font class="small">En réponse à:</font><hr />
I completely forgot to mention this earlier. Everyone has seen the MacGyver about this right?

[/ QUOTE ]

[censored]. No. What happened?

[censored] MacGyver.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ok, so MacGyver is either in Africa or South America, I'm not sure which, and there's this humongous colony (like, billions) of ants working its way through the jungle. Of course MacGyver knows some really important guy in the jungle, and whatever and whatnot ensues with the first 45 minutes of lameness. Anyway, the ants start attacking this guy's fortress type thing (it has a moat and a wall, don't ask me).

MacGyver sends the guy's head servent, who's like a 14 year old boy, out to open the dam so that the moat will keep the ants away. Well, the kid gets there and can't open it completely before he's overrun by the ants, and killed. So, there's a slowly filling moat, but the ants are still charging. In fact, the ants are so smart, that even as the moat is filling up, they are knocking leaves off of trees, and then riding them over the moat to the other side. Pretty impressive considering any current would actually be with the moat, not across it, since water is flowing in to fill it.

Now, MacGyver's like, holy [censored], we gotta blow the dam. So he get's the great plan to make some dynamite or something and blow it up, thus releasing the rest of the water quickly, and drowning billions of ants at once. But, he has some work to do first, because the ants are climbing the walls into the compound. Luckily for him, since the guy is in the middle of nowhere he has a gigantic gas container, that MacGyver is able to turn into a flame thrower to burn up the ants, and build a semi-perimeter to hold them out while he blows the dam. Of course it all works.

edit: oh yeah, and of course he didn't get hurt by the ants because he made an ant-repellant suit by melting a garden hose across a net and then wearing it.

theben
09-27-2005, 12:06 AM
go ants!

HopeydaFish
09-27-2005, 12:14 AM
The "war" would go on forever, as we'd never be able to kill all the ants. There are *many many* more ants on this planet than there are humans. We'd kill billions more ants than they'd be able to kill of us, but there'd always be more to replace the ones we killed.

Anyone living in a warm climate where there are the nastiest types of ants would be constantly living in fear. Those of us living in colder climates wouldn't really have much to worry about. The ants constantly trying to eat us would be more of an annoyance than anything. Most ants where I live don't have mandibles strong enough to even puncture my skin.

TheIrishThug
09-27-2005, 12:14 AM
MacGyver is my hero.

i think i just need to carry a giant gas tank around where ever i go. clearly it is very valuable.

09-27-2005, 12:28 AM
Humans win easily

Why? Logistics

2+2 wannabe
09-27-2005, 12:29 AM
[ QUOTE ]
The "war" would go on forever, as we'd never be able to kill all the ants. There are *many many* more ants on this planet than there are humans. We'd kill billions more ants than they'd be able to kill of us, but there'd always be more to replace the ones we killed.

[/ QUOTE ]

this is clearly the correct answer

Blarg
09-27-2005, 12:38 AM
Evolution wouldn't matter.

The number of ants in the world is astounding, but they aren't that deadly or hard to kill. The bit of many is nasty, but the bite of many others hardly hurts at all.

Further, most ants don't have a mobile way of living. You can't kill a lot of people when you need to build a immobile hive and keep it running, as most ants do. They don't go gathering all that food and bringing it back from long distances because they want to, but because they have to. It's a full-time job and it needs to be done. And even if done well in a rich area, a successful hive doesn't become unbelievably enormous or breed a checkerboard of hives that take over the earth.

Being an ant has natural limits. They can't afford to empty out their hive's resources in suicide attacks, unless they want that hive to wither and die. Either way, humans win.

The most they could do is be sporadically dangerous and extremely annoying. They could probably drive us out of your minds.

09-27-2005, 12:51 AM
[ QUOTE ]

...Ok, so MacGyver is either in Africa or South America...


[/ QUOTE ]

I think the writer(s) - term used very loosely here - should have their nuts kicked! (thank you Al Capone Junior)

This sounds suspiciously similar to the movie I referred to earlier!

Booooo!

/images/graemlins/mad.gif

Piz0wn0reD!!!!!!
09-27-2005, 01:02 AM
neither. ants could never kill all humans, and we could never rid the world of ants either.

we would, however, kill well over a trillion times more of them then they would kill of us.

ChipWrecked
09-27-2005, 03:55 AM
http://www.tcf.ua.edu/courses/Gary/TCF289/THEM.GIF

MarkL444
09-27-2005, 03:59 AM
go watch starship troopers

The Truth
09-27-2005, 04:02 AM
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Really, though, everybody is SEVERELY underestimating the ants.

[/ QUOTE ]
After further consideration, I agree. Proof:

http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/9093/egcover3aj.jpg

[/ QUOTE ]

good book.


-blake

09-27-2005, 04:21 AM
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Really, though, everybody is SEVERELY underestimating the ants.

[/ QUOTE ]
After further consideration, I agree. Proof:

http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/9093/egcover3aj.jpg

[/ QUOTE ]

good book.


-blake

[/ QUOTE ]

One of my favorite books actually!

chuddo
09-27-2005, 04:45 AM
did anyone else ever read the short story "Leiningen vs. the ants" ?

lem45216
09-27-2005, 07:22 AM
[ QUOTE ]
So you wake up tomorrow and this is all over the news, ants attacking worldwide. There hasn't been any tips or instructions from any government or police force, what is your plan, if any? Are you going to skip work?

[/ QUOTE ]

Ah, see i think the ants would kill a fair few people while they slept, they could easily crawl inside your mouth/nose/ears and start eating you from the inside, or pile inside your throat to suffocate you. This is where humans might struggle, eventually we'd have to sleep, and thats where the ants might do the most damage.

Saddlepoint
09-27-2005, 07:43 AM
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
So you wake up tomorrow and this is all over the news, ants attacking worldwide. There hasn't been any tips or instructions from any government or police force, what is your plan, if any? Are you going to skip work?

[/ QUOTE ]

Ah, see i think the ants would kill a fair few people while they slept, they could easily crawl inside your mouth/nose/ears and start eating you from the inside, or pile inside your throat to suffocate you. This is where humans might struggle, eventually we'd have to sleep, and thats where the ants might do the most damage.

[/ QUOTE ]

Touche.

I wonder, all you people who think it's not close: roughly how many people do you visualize being taken out before it ends?

stigmata
09-27-2005, 07:57 AM
There is an estimated one quadrillion ants in the world (1,000,000,000,000,000). I figure this to be around 200,000 ants per person.

How many ants, representitive of the local species, do you think you could take on? You would certainly need some preventitive measures, even if the local ants aren't at all scary. I would be looking to get a good (sealed) food supply, securing my house as good as possible, and stockpile plenty of insect killer, at least until the government started mass-spraying insecticides.

There would undoubtedly be severe carnage in many areas, especially those with dangerous species present.

Saddlepoint
09-27-2005, 08:03 AM
[ QUOTE ]
There is an estimated one quadrillion ants in the world (1,000,000,000,000,000). I figure this to be around 200,000 ants per person.

How many ants, representitive of the local species, do you think you could take on? You would certainly need some preventitive measures, even if the local ants aren't at all scary. I would be looking to get a good (sealed) food supply, securing my house as good as possible, and stockpile plenty of insect killer, at least until the government started mass-spraying insecticides.

There would undoubtedly be severe carnage in many areas, especially those with dangerous species present.

[/ QUOTE ]

THANK YOU.

And it's finally time to drop this one: In addition to people unlucky enough to live in areas with really nasty ants, there are going to be people (probably children) who fall down, are somehow rendered immobile, and are eaten alive. Once twenty or thirty people are killed within a hundred miles of you, and people are terrified to leave their homes, you don't expect your infrastructure to be affected? No worries at all about your food supply?

I'm not saying what I think, but people: this is much, MUCH closer than you think it is.

cbfair
09-27-2005, 08:28 AM
[ QUOTE ]


I'm not saying what I think, but people: this is much, MUCH closer than you think it is.



[/ QUOTE ]

Why won't you say what you think? You brought it up in the first place, and its an interesting question.

FWIW- My first reaction was ants and its not close. They're so small, strong, numerous, adaptable and well organized that we might truly have a tough time taking them on.

It's true that most ants in northern climates don't have mandables long enough to pierce flesh but I wonder how long it would take for their soldiers to find some upper hand against us.

diebitter
09-27-2005, 08:29 AM
I think we're underestimating the ants. I have this theory about the extinction of the dinosaurs, see, and...

Blarg
09-27-2005, 08:39 AM
Killing ants is just not that hard. Or even that expensive.

Nor could ants ever conceivably organize. Nor do some of the hilarious sneak attack type scenarios some people are postulating.

They're just ants, man. No matter how many of them there are.

Would I like them to be crazy agressive? No more than anything else being that way. But there's no way they could either build or sustain an advantage.

I'd be way more scared of the damage that having to use insecticide all the time would do to us than of the ants.

09-27-2005, 10:18 AM
[ QUOTE ]
Killing ants is just not that hard. Or even that expensive.

Nor could ants ever conceivably organize. Nor do some of the hilarious sneak attack type scenarios some people are postulating.

They're just ants, man. No matter how many of them there are.

Would I like them to be crazy agressive? No more than anything else being that way. But there's no way they could either build or sustain an advantage.

I'd be way more scared of the damage that having to use insecticide all the time would do to us than of the ants.

[/ QUOTE ]

Party Pooper

Shajen
09-27-2005, 10:23 AM
I think the people in the Amazon and surrounding areas would be [censored].

http://www.myrmecos.net/ants/NeiCal17.JPG

diebitter
09-27-2005, 10:25 AM
[ QUOTE ]
Party Pooper

[/ QUOTE ]

Hey that's a good name for that vodka/Sunny D. drink designed to allow you to anally abuse your girly!

stigmata
09-27-2005, 10:31 AM
[ QUOTE ]
Killing ants is just not that hard. Or even that expensive.

[/ QUOTE ]

200,000 is a big number. Let's think this through some more. Say, only half the nest is invested for "human killing", the rest are kept back for housekeeping chores. Once an ant finds a human, it lays a track for the rest of the nest to attack at once. Multiple nests can attack a single person. There are around 100,000 ants in the average nest.

Some people are going to get off OK. Others will be besieged by millions of ants at once. They also may not have access to insecticedes. I predict that the death toll will be pretty major in rural and underdeveloped areas, and obviously those with rather nasty ant species.

People in cities or the developed world will generally be fine.

Saddlepoint
09-27-2005, 01:43 PM
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Killing ants is just not that hard. Or even that expensive.

[/ QUOTE ]

200,000 is a big number. Let's think this through some more. Say, only half the nest is invested for "human killing", the rest are kept back for housekeeping chores. Once an ant finds a human, it lays a track for the rest of the nest to attack at once. Multiple nests can attack a single person. There are around 100,000 ants in the average nest.

Some people are going to get off OK. Others will be besieged by millions of ants at once. They also may not have access to insecticedes. I predict that the death toll will be pretty major in rural and underdeveloped areas, and obviously those with rather nasty ant species.

People in cities or the developed world will generally be fine.

[/ QUOTE ]

Fine, except food might begin to be a problem.

I think humans win it eventually, primarily because I think ants communicate at least partially through scent trails and pheremones, and our chemists ought to be able to produce something to totally [censored] that up. I think we'd get our asses kicked for the first month or so.

Of course, that answer changes if the human race has MacGyver at its disposal. And the answer would be much different for 7 year old ants.

09-27-2005, 01:53 PM
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Party Pooper

[/ QUOTE ]

Hey that's a good name for that vodka/Sunny D. drink designed to allow you to anally abuse your girly!

[/ QUOTE ]

Dammit! I didn't think of it when I was reading that thread. Would I have won?

SossMan
09-27-2005, 02:18 PM
[ QUOTE ]
The real question is will humans still die if a large component of the ecosystem is wiped out? If so then the ants have all the cards and the only option is creating robot ant replacements or else face certain doom


[/ QUOTE ]

best answer so far

JDErickson
09-27-2005, 02:37 PM
I think it would be a hell of a fight

Bullet Ant (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paraponera)

threeonefour
09-27-2005, 02:53 PM
change ants to all insects arachnids(sp) bugs... whatever else that is generally insectlike.... and the question becomes much much more interesting

i think human would definitely not be made extinct via the insect war. but the proliferation of insectides and elimination of many insect species could severely hurt biodiversity/the biosphere. in that scenerio i guess it would end up being a long war that results in both losing.


edit: add a little intelligence to the insects as well also. at least make them smart enough(perceptive enough i guess) to realize than they will never make it through a glass window.

4_2_it
09-27-2005, 03:02 PM
[ QUOTE ]
change ants to all insects arachnids(sp) bugs... whatever else that is generally insectlike.... and the question becomes much much more interesting

i think human would definitely not be made extinct via the insect war. but the proliferation of insectides and elimination of many insect species could severely hurt biodiversity/the biosphere. in that scenerio i guess it would end up being a long war that results in both losing.


edit: add a little intelligence to the insects as well also. at least make them smart enough(perceptive enough i guess) to realize than they will never make it through a glass window.

[/ QUOTE ]

Throw in killer bees, hornets and spiders and I think humans might be in trouble.

Jules22
09-27-2005, 03:11 PM
sounds like a helluva straight to usa movie

college_boy
09-27-2005, 04:09 PM
Ants wouldn't survive if they spent a significant amount of their time attacking humans.

Hamish McBagpipe
09-27-2005, 08:20 PM
Using the ideas posited in this thread and quickly throwing the variables into the University's supercomputer I was able to come to some conclusions.

The only difference from the original post was that I presumed some minor level of ant intelligence, as hinted at in other responses, in order to give the ant's at least some kind of coordination amongst themselves.

After briefly inputting genetics; weapons technology; psychological factors; available resources to each species; historic and contemporary military strategies and tactics; physics, chemistry, and venom of ant bites; number of ants crushed with a single stamp of a hush puppy; etc. the computer came up with a model that is accurate to within a +/- 0.04% margin of error.

Apparently, the culmination of the bloody war occurs in the year 2147 with the final defeat of human forces at the hands of the ant queen. After manuevering her forces against the invading mechanized and armoured human forces, the ant queen uses a brilliant "pincer" movement to engulf and finally destroy the last of human resistance. As we see from the battle map, the humans, lulled by the gap between the 5th Light Red Ant battalion of the Antz division and the 3rd Mounted of the Bug's Life Division, thrust toward the ant farm only to be buffeted by the Queen's Own Guard while elements of the Bug's Life Division exploit the resulting gap in the Human formations resulting in a total route. The computer doesn't lie people....prepare to hail the ant queen!


http://img399.imageshack.us/img399/8789/antwar4zw.png





BTW, stop telling me to get off the crack.

4_2_it
09-27-2005, 08:31 PM
[ QUOTE ]
Using the ideas posited in this thread and quickly throwing the variables into the University's supercomputer I was able to come to some conclusions.

The only difference from the original post was that I presumed some minor level of ant intelligence, as hinted at in other responses, in order to give the ant's at least some kind of coordination amongst themselves.

After briefly inputting genetics; weapons technology; psychological factors; available resources to each species; historic and contemporary military strategies and tactics; physics, chemistry, and venom of ant bites; number of ants crushed with a single stamp of a hush puppy; etc. the computer came up with a model that is accurate to within a +/- 0.04% margin of error.

Apparently, the culmination of the bloody war occurs in the year 2147 with the final defeat of human forces at the hands of the ant queen. After manuevering her forces against the invading mechanized and armoured human forces, the ant queen uses a brilliant "pincer" movement to engulf and finally destroy the last of human resistance. As we see from the battle map, the humans, lulled by the gap between the 5th Light Red Ant battalion of the Antz division and the 3rd Mounted of the Bug's Life Division, thrust toward the ant farm only to be buffeted by the Queen's Own Guard while elements of the Bug's Life Division exploit the resulting gap in the Human formations resulting in a total route. The computer doesn't lie people....prepare to hail the ant queen!


http://img399.imageshack.us/img399/8789/antwar4zw.png





BTW, stop telling me to get off the crack.

[/ QUOTE ]

Brillant!

09-27-2005, 08:51 PM
[ QUOTE ]

Brillant!


[/ QUOTE ]

Damn, too slow - beaten - again! (hope you're not an Ant!)

__________________________________________________ __________

Also, extremely well thought out and written. There's hope for our side yet, maybe.

/images/graemlins/grin.gif

PoBoy321
09-27-2005, 08:59 PM
[ QUOTE ]
The ant colonies are not working together

[/ QUOTE ]

Real quick, doesn't this clause completely negate the plausability of your premise? I mean, if all the ants were to attack people simultaneously, wouldn't they necessarily be working together? And if they don't work together, how would they possibly be able to attack simultaneously?

Your question is flawed.

lem45216
09-27-2005, 09:00 PM
[ QUOTE ]
Using the ideas posited in this thread and quickly throwing the variables into the University's supercomputer I was able to come to some conclusions.

The only difference from the original post was that I presumed some minor level of ant intelligence, as hinted at in other responses, in order to give the ant's at least some kind of coordination amongst themselves.

After briefly inputting genetics; weapons technology; psychological factors; available resources to each species; historic and contemporary military strategies and tactics; physics, chemistry, and venom of ant bites; number of ants crushed with a single stamp of a hush puppy; etc. the computer came up with a model that is accurate to within a +/- 0.04% margin of error.

Apparently, the culmination of the bloody war occurs in the year 2147 with the final defeat of human forces at the hands of the ant queen. After manuevering her forces against the invading mechanized and armoured human forces, the ant queen uses a brilliant "pincer" movement to engulf and finally destroy the last of human resistance. As we see from the battle map, the humans, lulled by the gap between the 5th Light Red Ant battalion of the Antz division and the 3rd Mounted of the Bug's Life Division, thrust toward the ant farm only to be buffeted by the Queen's Own Guard while elements of the Bug's Life Division exploit the resulting gap in the Human formations resulting in a total route. The computer doesn't lie people....prepare to hail the ant queen!


http://img399.imageshack.us/img399/8789/antwar4zw.png


[/ QUOTE ]

Hmm, i believe your calculations to be incorrect. Whilst the ants may have the required firepower etc you are ignoring an important fact.
That it is well documented that red ants and black ants generally hate each other, with the red ants often trying to eat the black ants. I think this could result in a serious power struggle within the ant ranks, possibly resulting in desertions and mutiny. Therefore i think we could take advantage of this and possibly get them to declare full scale war on each other, resulting in civil war, and we can sit back and watch, and mop up the survivors.

Hamish McBagpipe
09-27-2005, 09:14 PM
[ QUOTE ]
Hmm, i believe your calculations to be incorrect. Whilst the ants may have the required firepower etc you are ignoring an important fact.
That it is well documented that red ants and black ants generally hate each other, with the red ants often trying to eat the black ants. I think this could result in a serious power struggle within the ant ranks, possibly resulting in desertions and mutiny. Therefore i think we could take advantage of this and possibly get them to declare full scale war on each other, resulting in civil war, and we can sit back and watch, and mop up the survivors.

[/ QUOTE ]

Interesting. I stand by the computers calculations. However, I will input your suggested political, interspecies racism, and espionage variables to see if our fate may be changed.

After a quick scan of the printout from the computers calculations, though, I predict that the new variables will only result in a slight weakening of the ant's left flank during the final Battle of the Species easily countered by forwarding the Carpenter ant reserves not shown in the original map. But we'll have to see.

09-27-2005, 10:29 PM
You tell 'em Hamish. Party Poopers!

/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Saddlepoint
09-27-2005, 11:09 PM
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
The ant colonies are not working together

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Real quick, doesn't this clause completely negate the plausability of your premise?

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No.

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I mean, if all the ants were to attack people simultaneously, wouldn't they necessarily be working together? And if they don't work together, how would they possibly be able to attack simultaneously?

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Two people who incidentally have the same goal may effectively work together without being in collusion, just like two 2+2ers at the same table picking on the fish. I'm not John Nash or anything, but I'm pretty sure I didn't contradict myself.

True collusion occurs when one group takes a personal loss to increase the overall gain of the team. If one colony had their food source destroyed, no other colony would come to their rescue. They wouldn't coordinate. However there would be a great deal of effective collusion between colonies, simply because they all share the same primary goal.

Put simply: The ants would not go out of their way to work together, nor would they go out of their way to avoid collusion (that is until Ant Paul Phillips shows up and starts complaining).

Hamish McBagpipe
09-28-2005, 02:40 AM
[ QUOTE ]
They wouldn't coordinate. However there would be a great deal of effective collusion between colonies, simply because they all share the same primary goal.

Put simply: The ants would not go out of their way to work together, nor would they go out of their way to avoid collusion (that is until Ant Paul Phillips shows up and starts complaining).

[/ QUOTE ]

This latest computer simulation, below, shows quite clearly that the different ant species do, in fact, with proper leadership, work together to defeat their common enemy.

Clearly, the man and his best friend (presumably criminally coerced into helping in the war) have sustained grave injury, requiring immediate medical attention, by the relatively small number of ants. In truth, this model shows that a mere 57 ants can overcome the obviously shaken man and his friend, not the 200 000 as suggested previously.

Leadership boosts morale. Subscribing to the "great-man/ant" theory of history, I believe that an Atom Ant or possibly even an Adam Ant would easily lead the ants to final victory.

http://img385.imageshack.us/img385/1209/shagscoob9mp.jpg

Sephus
09-28-2005, 02:52 AM
[ QUOTE ]
True collusion occurs when one group takes a personal loss to increase the overall gain of the team

[/ QUOTE ]

no, true collusion occurs when a group maximizes individual gains by maximizing collective gain.

TheMainEvent
09-28-2005, 02:54 AM
I would punch every ant in the face

ChipWrecked
09-28-2005, 03:03 AM
Anybody who has read 'The Once and Future King' and 'The Book of Merlin' knows that ants are damn racists. They will waste their efforts fighting red v. black, giving us the vital time needed to destroy them all.

(not that Hamish's battle scenario doesn't [censored] rule)

Blarg
09-28-2005, 06:22 AM
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Ants wouldn't survive if they spent a significant amount of their time attacking humans.

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That's what I said, but it seems people think ants are on welfare or something, and it seemed to get ignored.

Ants would starve if they did anything but try to just be ants.

Saddlepoint
09-28-2005, 07:49 AM
Let me just be absolutely clear that I think you're a genius.

Saddlepoint
09-28-2005, 07:52 AM
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Ants wouldn't survive if they spent a significant amount of their time attacking humans.

[/ QUOTE ]

That's what I said, but it seems people think ants are on welfare or something, and it seemed to get ignored.

Ants would starve if they did anything but try to just be ants.

[/ QUOTE ]

I question this statement. Aren't ants pretty adaptable? Would it really be so difficult for them to streamline their gathering/digging/reproduction departments, and enhance their human killing department with the extra resources?

swede123
09-28-2005, 08:20 AM
[ QUOTE ]
I question this statement. Aren't ants pretty adaptable? Would it really be so difficult for them to streamline their gathering/digging/reproduction departments, and enhance their human killing department with the extra resources?

[/ QUOTE ]

But just imagine the time spent filling out TPS reports. Sometimes bureaucracy isn't the solution.

Swede

stigmata
09-28-2005, 08:38 AM
Ants are really autocratic -- they love all this bureaucracy. They will have no problems whatsoever with officially sanctioned re-allocation of surplus resources away from war with other colonies to war with humans.

samjjones
09-28-2005, 09:26 AM
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I think some of you are vastly underestimating the number of ants there are in the world. they also have the advantage of being able to evolve MUCH faster.

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emonrad87
09-28-2005, 11:45 AM
This reminds me of SimAnt, when you had to fight off all the red ants, take over the yard, and then take over the house. Then there is the animation at the end where the human and dog are going crazy and the house has a for sale sign up.

Hamish McBagpipe
09-28-2005, 06:34 PM
[ QUOTE ]
This reminds me of SimAnt, when you had to fight off all the red ants, take over the yard, and then take over the house. Then there is the animation at the end where the human and dog are going crazy and the house has a for sale sign up.

[/ QUOTE ]

So this is why everyone thinks that there would be fighting between the ants. I think in a fight to the finish against humans we'd have to assume at least a temporary alliance with the red ants.

Hamish McBagpipe
09-28-2005, 08:30 PM
http://img218.imageshack.us/img218/8705/lostcastgrande91de.png

jba
09-28-2005, 08:49 PM
week one: ants [censored] up about 10% of the world population. total carnage. people are outnumbered 100,000,000:1 in many rural areas. people in big cities lock down. lots of ants and people perish

week two: walmart starts selling anti-ant suits made in china for $3.97. They are hot as a bitch but the ants can't get through them. people gradually adjust to having their entire bodies covered in fabric whenever outdoors. People continue to be eaten in their sleep when ants break into their homes -- which will happen often in the first few years.

my guess is five years tops and ants rarely get within 10 feet of a person within the US. lifestyle changes abound however. each year drunk driving and ant devourings will race for most killings.

ants are not nearly as tough as bacteria and viruses in my opinion