7c4c bb

[mike l.]

i have 7c4c in the bb. 5-10 500 buy in great live game. 2 players limp, tilted fishy button who plays every hand but usually doesnt raise much raises to $40. he has about $2000, i have about $1200, others have around 600-1000. sb calls, i call, others call. 5 of us.

the flop is Ac5c5h. checked to button who bets $150. sb folds, i call, others fold. heads up.

the turn is 7s. i bet $250, he makes it $500 straight (min raise), i call.

the river is a 8c. i push my last $400.

now i already went over this with others and the turn bet there is awful. see this guy will almost never fold something like JJ there. he will just call down most likely. and the other stupid thing about my bet is if i had just checked he likely wouldve bet too small a bet, something like 150 or 200 or something because he never bet enough. actually that's one of the reasons i played the hand in the first place was he tended to let people come along for way too little in big pots. anyway just wanted to state that before the thread starts and people say the turn is dumb. im more interested in preflop and flop i guess and seeing if there's anything i may have missed or not realised.

[Ulysses]

I would often fold pre, sometimes call. I would usually check-fold the flop.

[mike l.]

"I would usually check-fold the flop."

could you explain that because gabe, lmd, rick, and coilean (all except rick dont play nl of course) all thought the call on the flop was good.

[Allinlife]

[ QUOTE ]
"I would usually check-fold the flop."

could you explain that because gabe, lmd, rick, and coilean (all except rick dont play nl of course) all thought the call on the flop was good.

[/ QUOTE ]
1) no pot odds
2) low implied odds (flush=visible to all)
3) odds of drawing dead to full
4) odds of drawing dead to otherguys higher flush
5) not making the draw and letting K high check river

you are in a spot to make bazillion mistakes where as your opponents can hardly misplay whatever they got.

foldssss

[mike l.]

wait a second!

"1) no pot odds"

pot is over $300 when i have to call $150.

"2) low implied odds (flush=visible to all)"

he is a complete retard and way likely to call with his whole stack if he has AK, AQ, etc. i was sitting in the game for the primary reason that he was deep and i wanted to double through him.

"3) odds of drawing dead to full"

zero on the flop because there is no way on earth this guy would bet aces full on the flop. he wouldve definitely checked.

"4) odds of drawing dead to otherguys higher flush"

that's a concern. the players behind me on the flop are a concern. the chance one of them has a 5 or A5 or a big A they will get aggro with or a bigger flush draw is a concern. those are reasons to fold, but i felt they were outweighed by the reasons to call.

"5) not making the draw and letting K high check river"

im not sure what youre saying here. bottom line is i need to make my flush to win when he bets so much on the flop i know he has a big pair or an A. one other concern is that he might have something red QQ thus killing one of my outs since the board is paired.

[Hattifnatt]

Fold preflop.

Flop-call looks OK.

[Ray Zee]

actually the turn bet is wonderful. as long as you think he may have bet the flop with nothing. if that isnt the case all other streets were terrible.

fold preflop
fold flop or check raise big
check fold turn or check raise turn
check river if he could possibly be bluffing or betting less than aces. or have aces with a big kicker

[AnyutaDva]

What hand did you put the villain on when he limit raised the turn. This looks like a very controlled play from the villain rather than a tilted fish play. It smells like he has his hand and wants to get your money in. So then it depends what he would do this with. If you think it could be AK, AQ etc then great, you are getting your odds as he is likely to call your river push. Against a reasonable player, this limit raise would worry me. You can easily show a 5 in this coup, and he still wants to get your chips in.

[mike l.]

"What hand did you put the villain on when he limit raised the turn. This looks like a very controlled play from the villain rather than a tilted fish play."

the guy's a scared tard that's why he raised so little. i was never at any point worried i was drawing dead. it was awesome he didnt push on the turn like he shouldve because then i wouldve been forced to fold. my turn bet sucked for other reasons which i went into elsewhere in the thread. the guy clearly had an A or a big pair.

[mike l.]

well this thread didnt change my mind about anything. the turn bet still sucked and the rest was still fine. he called when i pushed and he yelled the f word and was really angry and threw his cards off the table. i saw an A go flying.