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View Full Version : I've never really been a whore?


rybones
09-25-2005, 09:24 PM
So while I have taken advantage of a few reload bonuses before, I generally reload 20% at empire and party where I play sngs almost exclusively (except when I need to clear a bonus). However, I now have a decent bankroll and some extra $ and I was thinking about the full tilt 100% new member bonus. I have tried the search and most of the information seems a bit old (it may be that I suck at searching). I have also looked on the bonusWhores site (they had some charts, but i sure couldn't figure out what it was saying) and got some info. However, I still have a few questions.

1: how many hours of 4 tabling/nutpeddling the 2-4 limit table will it take to clear a $500. bonus?

2: Can I find 4 full tables in the evening?

3: is there a better bonus/site out there? Either because the bonus structure is better, there are more soft tables or whatever? Note, I want to clear the bonus as quickly as possible as I really like the party sng fish.

Thanks for any advise anyone can give.

Ryan

BigBiceps
09-25-2005, 09:34 PM
To clear the $600 signup bonus at Full Tilt you have to sit at the table for $10,000 of rake.

So if you play 4 tables of 2-4 and play 200 hands per hour, with an average rake of 1.25 / hand (the pots are smaller, due to all the rocks and it is 9 handed), then you should be able to clear the $600 bonus in 40 hours of 4 tabling.

The bonus expires in 60 days and is released in $10 increments. I like the site, it is fast there are not weird river cards like PartyPoker. I don't play 2-4 though, and right now this evening there are only 2 full tables, and 4 6-max tables going.

BigBiceps
09-25-2005, 10:51 PM
I just found out it is 10% increments not $10 increments. I was dumb and only made $100 opening deposit. Now I have to do the reload at 50%.

Photoc
09-26-2005, 12:51 AM
It's 10% or $20 increments, whichever is less. Deposit 600 and you'll clear at $20. The bonus still isn't the greatest but it's a nice little bit of the R word basically.

09-26-2005, 05:39 AM
[ QUOTE ]
I like the site, it is fast there are not weird river cards like PartyPoker.

[/ QUOTE ]

I know just what you mean. I hate it when Party gives you the 17 of clubs, or 3.5 of spades, on the river. Destroys all my pot odds calculations.

AcmeSalesRep
09-26-2005, 08:28 AM
[ QUOTE ]
I like the site, it is fast there are not weird river cards like PartyPoker.

[/ QUOTE ]

I love how you find a way to insert this pathetic drivel into any thread...

Yeah, Party is rigged. And it is set to favor some people at the expense of others. Too bad you aren't smart enough to figure out the secret code you need to enter to become one of the "special" few they reward...

Acme

BigBiceps
09-26-2005, 02:08 PM
There is no secret code. It is some sort of algorithm that rates the players, based on play frequency, rake generated, bonuses received, etc.

Your sarcasm is weak.

geardaddy
09-26-2005, 02:11 PM
Ryan, I think I can help you out. I don't know how long it will take at Full Tilt, but there are better bonuses out there. Check out Bonuswhores.com They not only tell about all the bonuses, but at what rate you'll clear them pet hour per table. I've found the PokerRoom site very good. You can clear it easily and there are always plenty of games. Many of the newer less established sites don't offer enough games.Playing on 4 tables there should clear at least $40/hour at 2/4. Good luck.

09-26-2005, 02:16 PM
[ QUOTE ]
There is no secret code. It is some sort of algorithm that rates the players, based on play frequency, rake generated, bonuses received, etc.

Your sarcasm is weak.

[/ QUOTE ]

Your conspiracy evidence is strong.

BigBiceps
09-26-2005, 03:15 PM
Your sarcasm is weak too.

That is the whole point, that I don't have strong evidence. I was hoping the people with analytical minds at 2+2 could search or help find evidence. It is not a simple thing to prove. Unfortunately, the majority of the 2+2 community is in some sort of denial about the possibility of unethical behavior by Party Poker.

09-26-2005, 03:26 PM
[ QUOTE ]
Your sarcasm is weak too.

That is the whole point, that I don't have strong evidence. I was hoping the people with analytical minds at 2+2 could search or help find evidence. It is not a simple thing to prove. Unfortunately, the majority of the 2+2 community is in some sort of denial about the possibility of unethical behavior by Party Poker.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah. I find that the entire community, especially with all the data they have, just chooses to ignore the allegations made by noobs with little or no data but a few bad beat stories. This is clearly a case where they have the data showing its rigged, but choose to just lose mney instead, because thats how 2+2ers are -- they like to lose money and hate to analyze stats.

BigBiceps
09-26-2005, 03:56 PM
Thanks for another sarcastic post, it is what I have come to expect. I guess being a veteran to the community means you have the right to be a jerk.

I gave no bad beat stories, I admit that I have little data.

I have won on all the poker sites I have played on. I have played Stars, UB, Paradise, Pacific(limited), Party/Empire, and FullTilt. Why would I just try to say Party/Empire are suspicious? I have no motivation, it just seems like there is some BS going on there.

Since, no one here is going to help do any analysis and basically just trust partypoker (similar to the religious folks belief in God), I will just stop playing there, and play on the other sites, until I have sufficient time and energy to do some exhaustive analysis.

I don't know if it is the internet or what, but I don't see why it is necessary to treat new posters rudely and sarcastically like is commonplace here.

09-26-2005, 04:02 PM
[ QUOTE ]
Thanks for another sarcastic post, it is what I have come to expect. I guess being a veteran to the community means you have the right to be a jerk.

I gave no bad beat stories, I admit that I have little data.

I have won on all the poker sites I have played on. I have played Stars, UB, Paradise, Pacific(limited), Party/Empire, and FullTilt. Why would I just try to say Party/Empire are suspicious? I have no motivation, it just seems like there is some BS going on there.

Since, no one here is going to help do any analysis and basically just trust partypoker (similar to the religious folks belief in God), I will just stop playing there, and play on the other sites, until I have sufficient time and energy to do some exhaustive analysis.

I don't know if it is the internet or what, but I don't see why it is necessary to treat new posters rudely and sarcastically like is commonplace here.

[/ QUOTE ]

Newbie makes allegation of cheating and derides 2+2ers as in denial for not supporting his allegation, then follows it up with "I admit that I have little data." Who is the one in denial again?

rybones
09-26-2005, 04:13 PM
<font color="red"> h </font><font color="green"> E </font><font color="blue"> l </font><font color="purple"> p </font> <font color="#666666"> M </font><font color="orange"> y </font> <font color="green"> T </font> <font color="black"> H </font><font color="red"> r </font> <font color="pink"> Ea </font><font color="green"> d </font> <font color="blue"> h </font><font color="brown"> a </font><font color="red"> s </font> <font color="yellow"> B </font><font color="#666666"> eE </font><font color="red"> n </font> <font color="blue"> h </font><font color="green"> I </font><font color="purple"> J </font><font color="black"> a </font><font color="green"> c </font><font color="orange"> K </font><font color="yellow"> e </font><font color="red"> D </font>

AcmeSalesRep
09-26-2005, 04:16 PM
[ QUOTE ]
That is the whole point, that I don't have any evidence.

[/ QUOTE ]

FYP.


You have no evidence...because Party is not fixed. Or should millions of hands of statistical evidence (showing that things are legit) be damned?

Acme

BigBiceps
09-26-2005, 04:21 PM
Having millions of hands showing the starting hands are not rigged, and that equal numbers or each card show up on every street, DOES NOT prove that things are not rigged.

Summaries of data, can always be manipulated to show that the average of everything is on par. It is complicated to show the evidence of something being rigged.

I mentioned before, as an example, how to do this by looking at how often TPTK gets beat by TPweakK on the river. This type of analysis has never been done that I am aware of.

BigBiceps
09-26-2005, 04:23 PM
[ QUOTE ]
<font color="red"> h </font><font color="green"> E </font><font color="blue"> l </font><font color="purple"> p </font> <font color="#666666"> M </font><font color="orange"> y </font> <font color="green"> T </font> <font color="black"> H </font><font color="red"> r </font> <font color="pink"> Ea </font><font color="green"> d </font> <font color="blue"> h </font><font color="brown"> a </font><font color="red"> s </font> <font color="yellow"> B </font><font color="#666666"> eE </font><font color="red"> n </font> <font color="blue"> h </font><font color="green"> I </font><font color="purple"> J </font><font color="black"> a </font><font color="green"> c </font><font color="orange"> K </font><font color="yellow"> e </font><font color="red"> D </font>

[/ QUOTE ]

You got any more questions about full tilt?

With the bonus, other incentives, and a nice site to play at - in my opinion it is worth playing there.

AcmeSalesRep
09-26-2005, 04:25 PM
[ QUOTE ]
I gave no bad beat stories, I admit that I have little data.

[/ QUOTE ]

You have no data showing anything unusual. You have not played anything close to enough hands to know if anything unusual is occuring...


[ QUOTE ]
I have won on all the poker sites I have played on. I have played Stars, UB, Paradise, Pacific(limited), Party/Empire, and FullTilt.

[/ QUOTE ]

Even if we accept this is true, how does this mean there is anything off with Party? (Hint, it doesn't.) I mean...I destroy Stars at every limit I have ever played there except 1/2...both higher and lower limits have been easily beaten. Yet I lose at 1/2.

Something must be amiss at 1/2...it must be rigged! That or I have not played enough hands to actually be statistically significant.


[ QUOTE ]
Since, no one here is going to help do any analysis and basically just trust partypoker

[/ QUOTE ]

It has been done. We just don't like you, so we won't let you see the results.


[ QUOTE ]
I don't know if it is the internet or what, but I don't see why it is necessary to treat new posters rudely and sarcastically like is commonplace here.

[/ QUOTE ]

I am newer here than you are...yet nobody has treated me rudely or sarcastically. You must be special...

That or you post drivel and cannot stand it when people tell you to take it somewhere else...

Acme

AcmeSalesRep
09-26-2005, 04:35 PM
[ QUOTE ]
Having millions of hands showing the starting hands are not rigged, and that equal numbers or each card show up on every street, DOES NOT prove that things are not rigged.

[/ QUOTE ]

Who said anything about millions of hands showing the STARTING hands were not rigged? Them's your words.

My words are that there are millions of hands showing that NOTHING is rigged.


[ QUOTE ]
Summaries of data, can always be manipulated to show that the average of everything is on par.

[/ QUOTE ]

What would any of us get out of rigging our data to show Party is not rigged? (Hint: Less than you get from accusing it of being suspicious.)


[ QUOTE ]
I mentioned before, as an example, how to do this by looking at how often TPTK gets beat by TPweakK on the river. This type of analysis has never been done that I am aware of.

[/ QUOTE ]

It should happen 3/44 times (if you just want to consider the cases where the kicker pairs to win). The analysis is both easy and anyone can do it quickly (and has been done many times before). But it is a lot easier for you to scream that things don't "feel right" than it is for you to either do the work or accept that short-term variance can be a real bitch.

Lame.

Acme

BigBiceps
09-26-2005, 04:42 PM
I have not played enough on party poker for definitive proof, but I have played enough to get a general indication of the trend of unusual events occuring.

That was exactly my point, that my motivation for this posting is not due to losses or bad beats, my motivation is based on observations.

There has been no analysis of the type that I am talking about that I am aware of. I have read the FAQs and archives and have seen the analysis of starting hands, flop/turn/river cards, but that is not the type of analyses that I am talking about.

The fact that you are newer than me is not statistically significant. We registered within 5 months of each other. In fact I made only a few posts in March/April 2004, then did not post again until August 2005. You make an oversimplification here, similar to your oversimplification of the analysis of the data. [It so happens that I surfed this website in the early/mid-ninties before internet poker was commonplace - (not that this is relevant, just illustrates that you cannot learn everything by just a few pieces of information).]

AcmeSalesRep
09-26-2005, 04:58 PM
[ QUOTE ]
I have not played enough on party poker for definitive proof, but I have played enough to get a general indication of the trend of unusual events occuring.

[/ QUOTE ]

The observations of a human in the short-term (and, really, the long-term as well) are virtually meaningless. I know this well as I wrote a PhD dissertation on the issue. (My dissertation involves machine learning...so don't come at me with some psycho-babble or pure mathematics. Neither means anything to me.)


[ QUOTE ]
There has been no analysis of the type that I am talking about that I am aware of.

[/ QUOTE ]

You not being aware of it does not mean much to me. Using machine learning techniques and large databases, I have investigated things to my satisfaction. I am 100% convinced that there is absolutely nothing amiss with the large poker sites.

Whether you choose to accept this or not, I could not care less. I have no desire to let anyone see my work...and even if I did, you would be well down the list.


[ QUOTE ]
The fact that you are newer than me is not statistically significant.

[/ QUOTE ]

True...but it sure sounded good! The fact is, we are both in the same boat in terms of time/posts and I have been treated well by the community... So one of us must be special.

Acme

timprov
09-27-2005, 01:56 AM
[ QUOTE ]
Unfortunately, the majority of the 2+2 community is in some sort of denial about the possibility of unethical behavior by Party Poker.

[/ QUOTE ]

In fact, I think if you did a poll that was just "Is Party Poker engaged in unethical behavior," you'd get a lot of yes answers. Certainly there are some people here who spend a lot of time fellating PP, but there are also quite a few of us who don't trust them at all, and realize that they're actively trying to lower our earn.

What both groups have in common is a firm conviction that the deck is fair.

DuggleBogey
09-27-2005, 08:43 AM
Oh come on....he's my favorite conspiracy type...

"I win there, but it's still rigged!"

AcmeSalesRep
09-27-2005, 10:48 AM
[ QUOTE ]
In fact, I think if you did a poll that was just "Is Party Poker engaged in unethical behavior," you'd get a lot of yes answers. Certainly there are some people here who spend a lot of time fellating PP, but there are also quite a few of us who don't trust them at all, and realize that they're actively trying to lower our earn.

What both groups have in common is a firm conviction that the deck is fair.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ding, ding, ding. We have a winner! Trusting the deck has nothing to do with liking Party...

Acme