Common Occurence

[CMangano]

$3-$6 hand online. This is only my fourth hand at the table, so I have very little information on the players. I am in the CO and find black 9's. Table is 7-handed right now.

UTG folds, UTG+1 limps, MP folds, I limp (maybe should have raised?), button folds, SB folds, BB checks. 3 to the flop.

Flop comes 5/forums/images/icons/spade.gif 8/forums/images/icons/diamond.gif 2/forums/images/icons/club.gif

BB bets, UTG+1 calls, I raise figuring they may have each made a pair smaller than mine. BB folds, UTG+1 calls. I currently think UTG+1 has an A with one of the board cards, or a K with one of the board cards. 2 to the turn.

Turn comes J/forums/images/icons/heart.gif [5/forums/images/icons/spade.gif 8/forums/images/icons/diamond.gif 2/forums/images/icons/club.gif]

UTG+1 checks to me, I bet, he calls. I feel pretty good at this point that the J missed him, and that he is still hoping his one pair will be good, or his overcard will hit.

River comes 3/forums/images/icons/heart.gif [J/forums/images/icons/heart.gif 5/forums/images/icons/spade.gif 8/forums/images/icons/diamond.gif 2/forums/images/icons/club.gif]

UTG+1 again checks, and I bet, he calls.

Results to follow. Comments appreciated.

[JTG51]

I think not raising preflop was a pretty big mistake. After the flop, I think you played it perfectly.

I'm guessing you lost though, or there wouldn't be much reason to post the hand. Did UTG+1 have some junk like JT?

[CMangano]

I'm guessing the raise in this situation is primarily because of the small number of players in the pot? That was why I contimplated raising.

These hands scare me, because of all the overcard possibilites, and the fact that people at these limits play with any A or K. I usually raise an unraised pot with JJ-AA, or hands like AKs or AQs, and AK and maybe AQ if there aren't a lot of limpers. However, I don't like to raise with TT or lower because of the overcard possibilites. Is this wrong? I would really like some feedback as these medium pairs usually kill me.

[haakee]

I'd raise it preflop and play it the same way you did postflop. In addition to probably getting it 3 or 4 way preflop your raise will also often buy the button.

[Yerma]

$3-$6 hand online. This is only my fourth hand at the table, so I have very little information on the players. I am in the CO and find black 9's. Table is 7-handed right now.

UTG folds, UTG+1 limps, MP folds, I limp (maybe should have raised?), button folds, SB folds, BB checks. 3 to the flop.


You are supposed to raise. But calling is not a large mistake.


Flop comes 5 8 2

BB bets, UTG+1 calls, I raise figuring they may have each made a pair smaller than mine. BB folds, UTG+1 calls. I currently think UTG+1 has an A with one of the board cards, or a K with one of the board cards. 2 to the turn.


UTG+1 should raise liberally here if he is any good. He can call with a big draw or big made hand as well (if he is any good). If he just called with something like 66, 77, or A8s here then he is weak, and if he just called with overcards then he sucks.

This is the sort of info you should get from this hand and from hands like these. Basically, what the player has here will vary from player to player. So it's your job to model his behavior correctly after watching him play a few of these hands.


Turn comes J [5 8 2]

UTG+1 checks to me, I bet, he calls. I feel pretty good at this point that the J missed him, and that he is still hoping his one pair will be good, or his overcard will hit.


It sounds like he is the weak player I mentioned. Against this sort of player, you can afford to make all sorts of marginal bets since you can easily get away from your hand those times he raises you. In the principle, he can still hold 76s and be drawing to beat you (and so not be such a weak player).


River comes 3 [J 5 8 2]

UTG+1 again checks, and I bet, he calls.


I'll guess he had 77 or 66 and just decided to make a weak call down.

[Bob T.]

I like how you played this hand. I would have probably raised with only one limper in front of me in the cutoff, but I think that calling is OK also.

[Bob T.]

...your raise will also often buy the button.

The more I think about it, I like the raise here more and more. I said in my post that I would probably raise, and I there are a lot of reasons to raise.

1 - win the button.
2 - get the initiative after the flop.
3 - eliminate the blinds.
and probably more, but its late.

I remember several months ago, in a post, vehn said something to the effect of '...if someone had told me a long time ago, to never to enter a pot second in, in mid to late position, by calling, I would have a lot more money now.'

[Lil Ribbit]

I can relate to your ideas about not raising TT and 99 in games like this. If the situation came up again though, I would raise the 99.

I also found out that my raise with TT even UTG has been effective in the long run. Especially against these low limit players. It provides them with a psycologoical effect of AA or AK... ect. Even with overcards I find that a scary board with a lone K on it is enough to scare people away.

[CMangano]

First, thanks everyone for the replies. Even after I limped I thought the right play was probably to raise, and it sounds like everyone agrees with that. I honestly thought this pot was mine and was waiting for his hand to enter the muck, but instead he turned over...

A/forums/images/icons/diamond.gif A/forums/images/icons/heart.gif

So of course, my 9's were no good. The reason I posted this was two-fold. First, my problem with playing these medium sized pairs, and second, because this is the second time this has happened to me (had K's busted by slowplayed A's). Also, I was at a table the other night were one player 3 times took down pots after slowplaying big pairs (luckily none against me).

My question is, assuming you know this player slowplays his big pairs, how do you play him? They never show strength at any time, then at the end they flip over AA or KK or something. Do you just chalk it up to this guy is extremely weak and will get his pairs busted more times than not to draws, or is this person maybe a skilled player using some kind of deception?

[Nottom]

Your opponent is an idiot, I wouldn't worry about the one time in 100 that he decided to slowplay a big hand since all he's doing is costing himself money. You'll make it all back when you spike a set on the turn or river or draw out on him because he doesn't know to push his big hands.

[Joe Tall]

This isn't slowplaying a big pair, this is MISPLAYING a big pair. I have a lot of trouble with these passive-types (and they're more than passive..they are ULTRA-passive). I've seen it more than once, I have NO idea how to play them. So, given the information you were during this hand, I feel you played fine, except the non-preflop raise. Mark this player down as ULTRA-passive!! Because if you make a draw on them they'll pay you off all the way!!