77 in BB

[MrEngenic]

No reads on the players, I just sat down.I think this situation has more to it than meets the eye.


Party 2/4

Preflop: Hero is BB with 7 /images/graemlins/spade.gif7 /images/graemlins/club.gif
UTG+1 calls, MP3 calls, SB calls, Hero checks

Flop: (4 sb) 4 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif6 /images/graemlins/heart.gif6 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif
SB bets, Hero

[thesharpie]

Raise, you have an overpair.

[Arnfinn Madsen]

2/4-average players instinct: I have trips, don't bet. I have 4, protect. Raise to protect your hand.

[Nick Royale]

[ QUOTE ]
I think this situation has more to it than meets the eye.

[/ QUOTE ]
Give me a good reason why you should not raise.

[toss]

One is the small pot size. I would still raise here though.

[Nick Royale]

[ QUOTE ]
One is the small pot size. I would still raise here though.

[/ QUOTE ]
Sure, I was thinking of a reason making it a fold...

[toss]

We can call and raise a favorable turn. (Any 2,3,5,6,7, maybe an 8)

[Nick Royale]

[ QUOTE ]
We can call and raise a favorable turn. (Any 2,3,5,6,7, maybe an 8)

[/ QUOTE ]
I like raising the flop much better. The pot is small so it will protect our hand. If we gets us 2 additional callers we have given a cheap card for overcards to draw against us and with several callers behind it's likely that SB will check the turn with a pair of 4's.

[TemetNosce]

Raise the flop. Try to get out anyone who would call a bet to peel one off on the turn with one or two overs. Many 2/4 players wouldn't bet out with trip sixes, so you need to protect your hand. You could be up against a four, another pocket pair or a draw from the SB.

[Pharity]

It is imperative to raise here. To hope for these few cards and hope they will not help the players behind in some way (maybe a redraw or whatever) is not profitable.

[27offsooot]

Raise PF and raise the flop.

I like to raise in this spot to see where you are. If you get reraised, you're probably up against a set of 6's. With 2 or more callers, you are probably looking at at least a flush draw. If a diamond falls on the turn, I would slow down.

[@bsolute_luck]

i'm leaning more towards folding due to pot size and unknown table. there really isn't going to be a "favorable" turn really that you're going to be sure enough to continue in the hand if you merely call. if the table is a bunch of loose/passives, they could call you with any backdoor draw or higher pocket pairs or overcards.

plus a flush draw behind you could cold call (or worse 3-bet) your raise here and put you in bad shape for the turn- again unsure what cards are good or bad.

so i say: fold>raise>call

[eviljeff]

this is a definite raise or fold, and I raise. calling is ludicrous - too many overs can come to kill our hand. raising might knock out 88/99.

...or even 44 if you can represent quad 6s.

[Delzek15]

No way in hell I lay this down. You have an overpair this is an automatic raise. If you do get 3-bet your probably beat but I really doubt in this level of play the SB would bet out a 6.

[toss]

[ QUOTE ]
It is imperative to raise here. To hope for these few cards and hope they will not help the players behind in some way (maybe a redraw or whatever) is not profitable.

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
One is the small pot size. I would still raise here though.

[/ QUOTE ]

[MrEngenic]

Scenario 1:

Hero raises, MP3 calls, SB calls.

Turn K /images/graemlins/spade.gif
SB bets, Hero?


Scenario 2:

Hero raises, all fold, SB 3bets, Hero?


Now what?

[shant]

If you are raising that turn it's with the intention of folding to a 3-bet so I'd fold.

[Justin A]

[ QUOTE ]
If you are raising that turn it's with the intention of folding to a 3-bet so I'd fold.

[/ QUOTE ]

Huh?

[Justin A]

[ QUOTE ]
Scenario 1:

Hero raises, MP3 calls, SB calls.

Turn K /images/graemlins/spade.gif
SB bets, Hero?


Scenario 2:

Hero raises, all fold, SB 3bets, Hero?


Now what?

[/ QUOTE ]

Scenario 1: Raise and make it the last bets you put into the pot.

Scenario 2: Either 4bet or call down and expect to be shown A4 or somesuch most of the time.

[lighterjobs]

[ QUOTE ]
2/4-average players instinct: I have trips, don't bet. I have 4, protect. Raise to protect your hand.

[/ QUOTE ]

couldn't have said it better.

[shant]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
If you are raising that turn it's with the intention of folding to a 3-bet so I'd fold.

[/ QUOTE ]

Huh?

[/ QUOTE ]
My bad I missed that those were scenarios. I thought the SB had bet/3-bet the K/images/graemlins/spade.gif turn. I was basically saying what you said that if you raise the K/images/graemlins/spade.gif turn, it's the last money you put into the pot. I agree with what you said about scenario 2.

[PTjvs]

[ QUOTE ]
Raise PF

[/ QUOTE ]

Is this a good idea?

jvs

[W. Deranged]

I honestly think anyone looking to do anything but simply raise this flop is looking way, way too hard for "plays" to make.

Don't overthink this situation. We have a hand that is very likely to be good, but which is vulnerable to many cards. The player betting into us gives us the perfect opportunity to raise to protect our hand. Waiting to raise the turn will put us in many tough situations as many turn cards (like the K in the discussion) are cards we don't want to see and don't really want to be putting two BB on, particularly into a large field. Waiting until the turn also means we may have put in more bets than necessary before we learn that we are up against trips or something like that.

Raising the flop here seems to me like the very, very obvious best course here.

[27offsooot]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Raise PF

[/ QUOTE ]

Is this a good idea?

jvs

[/ QUOTE ]

When i initially posted, i thought that it was going to be three handed with one limper and the sb complete (missed the other limper). Then i think that it is definitely correct. I'm still raising 88+ and 77 is borderline, but i raise it.