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View Full Version : ($27) TT in the CO this time


durron597
09-17-2005, 07:07 PM
The SB is decent. The BB is a solid multitabler that I am playing on two tables with and probably percieves me as solid/good, since I haven't done anything too donkish yet.

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t150 (8 handed) pokerhand.org hand converter (http://www.pokerhand.org)

Button (t2035)
SB (t1185)
BB (t2735)
UTG (t2645)
UTG+1 (t710)
MP1 (t1385)
MP2 (t1050)
Hero (t1755)

Preflop: Hero is CO with T/images/graemlins/spade.gif, T/images/graemlins/club.gif.
<font color="#666666">4 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to t400</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">SB raises to t1185</font>, <font color="#CC3333">BB raises to t2735</font>, Hero ????

KingDan
09-17-2005, 07:17 PM
I prefer a push preflop.

Given the action, I think you have to call, but I wouldn't be thrilled about it.

durron597
09-17-2005, 07:37 PM
[ QUOTE ]
I prefer a push preflop.

Given the action, I think you have to call, but I wouldn't be thrilled about it.

[/ QUOTE ]

I dunno, my stack is kinda big for an open push.

DyessMan89
09-17-2005, 07:40 PM
You have just under 12X BB, which is just enough room where you arent "desperate" to make a move. However, its not big enough (IMO) where you can make a standard raise and feel comfortable in your decision if someone comes over the top of you. I think in this situation, its a push or a fold. I think this is the value of the moves ...

1. Push
2. Fold (slightly less)
3. Limp
4. Standard Raise

durron597
09-17-2005, 07:45 PM
[ QUOTE ]
You have just under 12X BB, which is just enough room where you arent "desperate" to make a move. However, its not big enough (IMO) where you can make a standard raise and feel comfortable in your decision if someone comes over the top of you. I think in this situation, its a push or a fold. I think this is the value of the moves ...

1. Push
2. Fold (slightly less)
3. Limp
4. Standard Raise

[/ QUOTE ]

Are you joking? I happily call one push, especially when people are often pushing with weak aces, small pairs, or worse. The problem is that I got two. If I open push I either get the blinds, or am a huge dog to AA-JJ, or AK calls, or occasionally AQ will call.

DyessMan89
09-17-2005, 07:49 PM
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
You have just under 12X BB, which is just enough room where you arent "desperate" to make a move. However, its not big enough (IMO) where you can make a standard raise and feel comfortable in your decision if someone comes over the top of you. I think in this situation, its a push or a fold. I think this is the value of the moves ...

1. Push
2. Fold (slightly less)
3. Limp
4. Standard Raise

[/ QUOTE ]

Are you joking? I happily call one push, especially when people are often pushing with weak aces, small pairs, or worse. The problem is that I got two. If I open push I either get the blinds, or am a huge dog to AA-JJ, or AK calls, or occasionally AQ will call.

[/ QUOTE ]

So these players will push with any Ax, small pairs, and other trash hands ... but when calling an all-in they are restricted to premium hands? You dont think with a push youll get called by a small pocket pair, Ax, etc?

KingDan
09-17-2005, 07:56 PM
[ QUOTE ]
]

I dunno, my stack is kinda big for an open push.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree with you... but I hate these 10-15xx bb situations. Not enough to just shove, but too little to really manuever.

durron597
09-17-2005, 07:57 PM
[ QUOTE ]

So these players will push with any Ax, small pairs, and other trash hands ... but when calling an all-in they are restricted to premium hands? You dont think with a push youll get called by a small pocket pair, Ax, etc?

[/ QUOTE ]

In the $27s yes, push ranges are much MUCH wider than call ranges in my experience.

pooh74
09-17-2005, 08:31 PM
[ QUOTE ]
You have just under 12X BB, which is just enough room where you arent "desperate" to make a move. However, its not big enough (IMO) where you can make a standard raise and feel comfortable in your decision if someone comes over the top of you. I think in this situation, its a push or a fold. I think this is the value of the moves ...

1. Push
2. Fold (slightly less)
3. Limp
4. Standard Raise

[/ QUOTE ]

Are you actually saying you fold TT before you'd raise or limp? Thats awful!

Curtains...come call this guy "weak tight" for me

bigt439
09-17-2005, 08:39 PM
I like the initial raise and I fold when it gets back to me. Like you said I'll call one push, happily at that, but 2 is ugly and your stack is big enough that you can fold.

miami32
09-17-2005, 08:40 PM
Fold. Not even a question.

miami32
09-17-2005, 08:49 PM
Change that. Let's think about this here. Personally I like your raise. Then you have one move in. Easy call if the BB doesn't move in but he does. So let's examine the hands he the BB would move in with(FWIW I agree with you that the range of hands that one would call a push with is much smaller then those that one would actually push with). I would say that the BB could have AA-99,AKs,AKo,AQs,AQo, and maybe AJ suited or unsuited. Assuming that this is a typical player. I can't seem him calling with anything worse. Now I think he is most likely ahead the majority of the time. Also, I'm way to lazy on the math to actually do it, but based on his range of hands I'm pretty sure math wise it's incorrect to call. Also assuming your one of the better players at the table or the best. It would be idiotic to gamble here. So I think still it's a clear fold.

miami32
09-17-2005, 08:50 PM
This is also pretty much my highest level of thinking, so if I'm stupid and wrong could someone please correct me.

durron597
09-17-2005, 09:32 PM
[ QUOTE ]
I would say that the BB could have AA-99,AKs,AKo,AQs,AQo, and maybe AJ suited or unsuited. Assuming that this is a typical player.

[/ QUOTE ]

He is much more likely to have 77 here then he is AJ or AQo.

09-17-2005, 09:54 PM
I disagree with pushing preflop here, I like your PFR. As you pointed out, your raise gives a chance for someone to come over the top and most of the time you will be ahead.

Obviously things change once the BB goes all in. I would put his range as KK or QQ to 66 and down to AQo. He doesn't seem to want your call here, so I can see where you are coming from as 77 being a likely hand. Then you have to factor in what the SB would have as well, a range that your hand easily beats on average though.

At first it seems a pretty easy fold, but I believe its a rather close decision but you will probably only win here 35-40% of the time. Therefore, if I'm feeling tiltish I'll call out of spite but if I've been playing well I'll fold. /images/graemlins/crazy.gif

durron597
09-17-2005, 10:51 PM
[ QUOTE ]

At first it seems a pretty easy fold, but I believe its a rather close decision but you will probably only win here 35-40% of the time. Therefore, if I'm feeling tiltish I'll call out of spite but if I've been playing well I'll fold. /images/graemlins/crazy.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

If I think I will win 35-40% of the time it's an instacall getting 2:1 on my money. Really the question is how many pairs under TT is he pushing with.