tells in online MTTs?

For the MTT players with more experience online... What do you use as tells online? I've been fairly successful playing aggressively in live tournaments - I'll try to read my opponents and have been able to accumulate chips by stealing pots when they show weakness or save chips when they're showing genuine strength. Doesn't always work out, but makes a difference when it does.

Online, however, without being able to see my opponents, more often than not I've found my aggression just plays into their slowplaying. Or, as preflop raiser, I'll bet into a harmless-looking board with overcards and am faced with a check-raise all-in (betting the same way I would with an overpair). What do you use to tell which opponents you can run over with aggression and which ones you need to steer clear of? I've found I tend to do well in the early stages of the tournament and can beat the fish, but once it gets down to the middle stages I've had trouble with the tougher players who play back at me very aggressively.

Any suggestions? I read Punker's Party Super tournament recaps, for example ( #1 (http://archiveserver.twoplustwo.com/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=&Number=2004732&page=&view =&sb=5&o=&fpart=1) and #2 (http://archiveserver.twoplustwo.com/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=1521513&page=&view=&sb=5& o=&fpart=1&vc=1)) but when making similar moves I've only bled my chips away. What do you use to tell who you can move against? Gigabet can make his moves against the thinking players, but online it's tougher to tell who is capable of folding a big hand.

Thanks all.

[Equal]

Basically betting patterns are ten times more important than tells and online you have betting patterns to watch for.

Since you typically only have a very small sample size to work with online before the table breaks (again), do you look for anything in particular in someone's betting pattern to get a fast read on them?

[baumer]

watch every single hand and learn everything you can about the way your opponents bet.

[AtticusFinch]

[ QUOTE ]
Basically betting patterns are ten times more important than tells and online you have betting patterns to watch for.

[/ QUOTE ]

Agreed, however, there are a few particular tells I look for. Some of these may fall under the "betting patterns" category, but they are good red flags to observe. Note that I don't suggest what each of these means, rather that they each usually mean something. You'll have to watch your individual opponents to find out what. I've found, though, that most players are pretty consistent with each of these.

1) Long delay before acting (not counting PF with no raise, that's usually a piss break).

2) Non-standard PF bet amount for that player. A minraise, or a bet of 4x BB when the player normally best 3xBB, or a typed in bet like 2437. If the player always minraises, or types his bets, then obviously you learn nothing.

3) Overbetting on the flop, but not a push. I.e. pot is 60, player with 1k chips bets 120.

4) Minbets or extra-small post-flop bets, especially on the river. Often a monster looking to sweeten the pot, but sometimes a weak attempt at taking down the pot, depending on the player.

5) Preselect check/x buttons. Obvious, but careful on a flop full of rags. He's probably more likely to have hit it than you are.

Pay close attention when you see any of these at your table, and pray for a showdown.

[diebitter]

Apart from betting patterns, the only online tells I watch for is the length of pause before calling/raising.

Sometimes huge hands pause for a long time, sometimes drawing hands with poor odds pause for a long time. Don't assume anything until you see a player do it twice and be consistent with it a third time though.

Their pattern will hold up until the final table where it often breaks down, so discard it once you get here (keep the notes though, and watch to see if it's being reproduced still - and use this if it is)


Some, but not much, use.