Loosing tons of cash is fun....please help me (longish)

[inyaface]

Well I knew it was going to happen sooner or later. You can only run at 30-40% ROI for so long. In fact every sit and go I played I kept thinking this was going to be the one where my downswing starts. Well yesturday it happened. Pretty standard, bust one bubble with AA one with KK 3 with races and another one involving shorties that were almost all in and me loosing two 70/30's. But....this isn't a bad beat post as good as it felt to get that out and as much as it sounds like im bitching. The point is i dropped 10 buyins at the 109's which is really notthing. I've been through multiple 10/20/30 buyin downswings and the same thing happens everytime. I feel like crap after and I loose the motivation to keep playing. Now I'm totally getting better at dealing with loosing as I'm way over bankrolled and I've learnt that playing 30/60 limit is not a good idea when your buying in for 1/3 of your bankroll and most importantly that variance exists and it sucks ass. But is loosing just something you need to learn to deal with? I mean I'm going to have a compleatly free day tommorow where I could easily fly through 5-6-7-8-8-10 sets and since school's starting up soon I'm going to have fewer of those days so I reall would like to play a ton tommorow. So do I just play and hope that im smart enough to play my perfect, tilt free game. Do I just chill out take the day off, realise 10 buy ins come and go like nothing and come back in a few days ready to pwn (or continue getting sucked out on because I'm still due for my downswing to be way bigger then it has been).Do I go to the bar and spend $200 bucks on booze...oh wait I already did that last night /images/graemlins/tongue.gif .Do I quit this stupid game all together (ok I'm sorry, I take that back). I'm sure most of the big game players and the 12348098590823409 sng per month players have learnt to deal with this. What's the best way to stay calm and just keep playing because compared to the $9 plus tips I'm making at my other job dropping $1000 in a day seems like just a little bit (AKA my months salery). Maybe thats my problem....that I have a job and that I still think of my poker BR as money as opposed to chips. I mean ideally I want to be at the point where an hour played is just an hour played, not 600 bucks made or 600 lost. How do I get there...can i get there... I think I'm starting to focus on my play more then money made or lost but I think It's still a long way until I can totally eliminate the money factor and just play. But for now I'm going to the place where I make less per hour then I do in rakeback per hour...yikes thats scary. Hopefully when I come back there will be a response to this with the answers to my problems as well as the meaning of life because if theres not ill be disapointed /images/graemlins/confused.gif

[tom441lbk]

[ QUOTE ]
But for now I'm going to the place where I make less per hour then I do in rakeback per hour...yikes thats scary.

[/ QUOTE ]

hmm, do you like playing poker?

Sounds like you're making tons more playing poker, and yes if you've been running at 30-40% for a long time, a downswing is expected, its part of the game, as long as the ROI stays + isn't that all that matters?

as for the meaning of life...? i'm still looking get back to you later

-Tom

[Ogre]

is this a joke? 10 buyin downswing?

[1C5]

if the money means that much to do (10 buy ins), play the $11s or something.

[stanzee]

Learning how to deal with losing is crucial in being a good SNG player. I had a 60 buyin downswing and it really did effect my game. I can't say with my hand on my heart that if it happened to me again it wouldn't effect me but i really do think i would deal with it a lot better. If i get a 10 game downswing now, it hurts, but if i go through the HH's and find out i really didnt do anything that wrong, then i'll stay confident in my game and wont make unnecessary adjustments. Confidence in knowing you are playing a "winning" game is key during the downswings.

Playing for the stakes you are while working for 9+tips does not compute.

Your post has like a bajillion poker emotions in one paragraph. Get it togethere dude.

Unless you post was humor/parody in which case it was pretty funy. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[3rdEye]

But how is tightening it?

[brimstone1]

[ QUOTE ]
...The point is i dropped 10 buyins at the 109's which is really notthing. I've been through multiple 10/20/30 buyin downswings and the same thing happens everytime. I feel like crap after and I loose the motivation to keep playing. Now I'm totally getting better at dealing with loosing as I'm way over bankrolled...

[/ QUOTE ]


-You've had 10, 20, 30 buy-in swings before.
-You have been in this state of mind before, and can acknowledge its presence.
-You are "over-bankrolled" for your level,
-And "dropping 10 buyins at the 109s...is really notthing."

and yet... here you are, posting about it, ranting about it.

I think you need to socialize more. Your post looks more like a stream of self-spoken words rather than an actual thought-out question of any sort. This is the sort of ranting you should be doing to a friend.

I'm not complaning about it -- we've all been there at one time or another, and it's a tough place to be. I'm just saying that talking to a friend might be a better way of going about this, your problem has more to do with you than actual STT strategy.

[inyaface]

Woah cool I got some responses
ok so to adress some of the stuff

1. yes I like playing poker. I just find the thought process involved and the competition to be very cool, but losing money isn't fun obviously.

2. The point isn't that I can't afford to loose 10 buy in's or that the money means a lot to me. It's more of a concept that I'm a 20 year old university kid who's surrounded by people that work 9-5 for three weeks and make the kind of money that I lost in one day.

3. It's not a matter of bad play, it's a matter of variance. Like I said most of the hands I lost were suckouts or races. When your an 80% favorite your still going to lose 20% of the time and you can't money in every tourney you play obviously (yes I expect to get flamed for stating the obvious)

4. I work the job because it's fun and it gives me a chance to get out and make some extra cash, plus I like chilling with the people I work with.

As for all this....

[ QUOTE ]

I think you need to socialize more. Your post looks more like a stream of self-spoken words rather than an actual thought-out question of any sort. This is the sort of ranting you should be doing to a friend.

I'm not complaning about it -- we've all been there at one time or another, and it's a tough place to be. I'm just saying that talking to a friend might be a better way of going about this, your problem has more to do with you than actual STT strategy.


[/ QUOTE ]
I really don't need to socialize more...I play poker maybe 10-20 hours a week and I'm in class maybe 15. Other then that I just hang out with my friends and party. Yes this is not really a question post but more of discusion post and the reason I don't talk to my friends about it that much is because they can't understand everything behind the swings involved in poker. If I told them I had lost $1000 in a day then they would imediatly look at me like some degenerate gambler...which I might be haha. Although some of them kind of understand based on me explaining it to them most still don't get that poker is a game where you can make money but where you will lose at points. I figured people on here deal with this stuff on a daily basis

In general the reason I made the post was to find out ways people deal with downswings and just start up a discution which I guess I did. I'm not like depressed or anything. I haven't broken my computer, it's just always a bit disheartening to lose regardless of how it happens and I was just wondering what people thought and how they dealt with their downswings and how to come out of them. If you just ride it out or if its better to take a break and refresh yourself and your game.

The meaning of life is to learn the difference between "loose" and "lose."

Go forth and prosper.

[inyaface]

You think I would have learned how to spell after the first two years of Uni....or at least proofread

[golfcchs]

I'm sure you have read this post, but read it again it always helps me. Link (http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showthreaded.php?Cat=&Board=singletable&Number=182 5403&Forum=,,,f22,,,&Words=&Searchpage=3&Limit=25& Main=1825403&Search=true&where=bodysub&Name=18623& daterange=1&newerval=1&newertype=y&olderval=&older type=&bodyprev=#Post1825403)

[freemoney]

if u have a 30-40% ROI how is buying into 30/60 1/3rd of ur bankroll? it aggravates me that you would lie through your teeth over an anonymous internet forum. ive read your hands and thought processes, you arent a good player and you will go broke, you are making almost 300 a set you say so 1000 is 3 hours of work, you dont hear a guy working mcdonalds cry cuz he went to the [censored] movies and spent 15 dollars, you suck u will go broke and no one thinks your cool for going to a bar and spending money so grow up and stop lying.

[inyaface]

[ QUOTE ]
if u have a 30-40% ROI how is buying into 30/60 1/3rd of ur bankroll? it aggravates me that you would lie through your teeth over an anonymous internet forum. ive read your hands and thought processes, you arent a good player and you will go broke, you are making almost 300 a set you say so 1000 is 3 hours of work, you dont hear a guy working mcdonalds cry cuz he went to the [censored] movies and spent 15 dollars, you suck u will go broke and no one thinks your cool for going to a bar and spending money so grow up and stop lying.

[/ QUOTE ]

sweet dude...well I played 30/60 before I started playing SNGS when my roll was about 5k. My 30-40% was over about 50 sngs out of the 700 or so I've played. I never claimed to be amazning which is why I post hands. I also only post hands that I've played like crap so I can get good advice on areas that need improvement. Just chill out and don't take everything so seriously

[Ogre]

move down, the money clearly means way to much to you to be playing at this level

[Apathy]

Dude... this thread has to be a joke. Did you thin kthat you could get away with this [censored] just cause I'm in vegas??

I mean all this about your friends oooing and awwing about you losing 1k?!?

I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that you are kidding about this thread, but maybe you just thought Id never read it.

As for helping you disattachment with money, I highly reccomenend Hanging out with a ton of cool baller stters and seeing em play craps and BJ for ten times what your bitching about. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[inyaface]

haha arigt well you and one other dude are the exception but I'm talking about the people I live with. You clearly know that I'm not adjusted to winning and loosing this kind of money quite yet even though I'm turning into a gamboolaholic and I'll be used to it soonish. Maybe I need to quit my job or something. Or maybe I need to try playing Paigow or BJ at 1k a hand and loose a few grand to stop bitching or at least spend 1k at the stippers. Anyways this thread wasn't about me being upset about the money necissarily...it was about how to play optimally after loosing money and if people really do once they hit a bit of a downswing and if you should just play through it or take a break.

[Sponger15SB]

[ QUOTE ]
You think I would have learned how to spell after the first two years of Uni....or at least proofread

[/ QUOTE ]

You would think you would learn to use paragraphs so it wouldn't be painful to read.

[Paul2432]

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In general the reason I made the post was to find out ways people deal with downswings and just start up a discution which I guess I did.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think you need to stop thinking in these terms. If you are adequately bankrolled and you are a winning player, there is nothing to deal with. For example, if your bankroll is 100 buy-ins and you lose 20 buy-ins nothing has really changed. You still have a solid bankroll and you are a winning player. That is a pretty good combination. So what exactly is the problem?

Instead of thinking, "oh my god what am I going to do" your thoughts should be "what mistakes have I made and how can I get better". A losing streak is simply an opportunity to reflect on your game and improve your play (you should be doing this all the time).

Paul

[inyaface]

Sweet a post that isn't just flaming me. Well what your saying is what I'm trying to achieve. I guess the amount of money I'm playing for is just a bit of a barrier...one which I'm slowly getting around. The giga post that's linked above is a really good one relating to this. If you haven't checked it out I defiantly would.

About mistakes I always go over HH's and cut and paste hands that I find interesting of that I misplayed during the SNGs and go over them which is something I never did before but something which is sooo crucial.

I haven't played for a few days and feel like I want to play so I'm about to fire up some sngs and play perfectly hopefully

[MegaBet]

[ QUOTE ]
Learning how to deal with losing is crucial in being a good SNG player. I had a 60 buyin downswing and it really did effect my game. I can't say with my hand on my heart that if it happened to me again it wouldn't effect me but i really do think i would deal with it a lot better. If i get a 10 game downswing now, it hurts, but if i go through the HH's and find out i really didnt do anything that wrong, then i'll stay confident in my game and wont make unnecessary adjustments. Confidence in knowing you are playing a "winning" game is key during the downswings.

[/ QUOTE ]

Better still, get someone ELSE to check your hand histories. During a downswing you subconsciously want to believe you are doing nothing wrong and it's all down to bad luck, and after analyzing your own HH's you may convince yourself of that. Find someone who's poker skills you trust and have them take a look. You may not get the answers you want, but the tough lessons will make you a better player.

[AA suited]

If it makes you feel any better, my worst -ROI streak is:

$50+5:
61 games
21% ITM
-36% ROI /images/graemlins/ooo.gif /images/graemlins/crazy.gif /images/graemlins/frown.gif

- $1200 (-24 buy ins in 2 days)

Note: I was still +$ for that month so don't fret OP.

[MegaBet]

[ QUOTE ]
If it makes you feel any better, my worst -ROI streak is:

$50+5:
61 games
21% ITM
-36% ROI /images/graemlins/ooo.gif /images/graemlins/crazy.gif /images/graemlins/frown.gif

- $1200 (-24 buy ins in 2 days)

Note: I was still +$ for that month.

[/ QUOTE ]

Variance can suck, huh? If I ever actually lost money over the course of a month, I'd probably give up poker and become a monk.

[bigt439]

Dude, you are way smarter than this post. You know enough about poker and simple logic that you shouldn't be saying this stuff. Hold it down and represent, you know how poker works, variance happens, deal with that shizzzzz. I really don't know why you made this post, Peter already said this, but this is dumb.

And just to respond to freemoney for a second: You need to actually contribute something... to anyone... before you decide to tell people whether they're good or not. The fact that you'd tell someone with a 25%+ ROI over 1000+ games that they're junk is ignorant enough, but you manage to do it in a way that makes you look even dumber than this would indicate. Please say 10 things intelligent before your next completely uneducated response.

[inyaface]

Woah I totally forgot about this post...ok yes it was stupid and yes I know better and it was a bit of a vent post so i appologize for that...but hey it worked. I felt much better and I've had a nice little run over the last few days with my first few tries at 8 tabling. So if nothing else it let me get a little loosing streak off my cheast and let some other people share their terrible runs which once again should give me a chance to stop bitching about my little 10 buy in downswing.

[ QUOTE ]

And just to respond to freemoney for a second:...Please say 10 things intelligent before your next completely uneducated response.

[/ QUOTE ]
I second that motion

PS I also got a link to that gigabet post which was genious and everyone should read so some good came out of this all

[bigt439]

[ QUOTE ]
PS I also got a link to that gigabet post which was genious and everyone should read so some good came out of this all

[/ QUOTE ]

I find it ironic when people spell genius wrong. I am therefore taking this moment to point out that you do not spell well. INYAFACE!

[inyaface]

I would like to point out I just drank for 4 hours and smoked 2 bowls

[se2schul]

Maybe we need to split the forum up so that I can read about my low limit $22s and $33s with less of the usual "I lost 10 buy-ins" posts. /images/graemlins/shocked.gif

[AA suited]

[ QUOTE ]
Megabet wrote:
[ QUOTE ]
AA Suited wrote:
If it makes you feel any better, my worst -ROI streak is:

$50+5:
61 games
21% ITM
-36% ROI /images/graemlins/ooo.gif /images/graemlins/crazy.gif /images/graemlins/frown.gif

- $1200 (-24 buy ins in 2 days)

Note: I was still +$ for that month.

[/ QUOTE ]

Variance can suck, huh? If I ever actually lost money over the course of a month, I'd probably give up poker and become a monk.

[/ QUOTE ]

I've lost $1800 at 30+3 in a month. (-60 buy ins)
I've also had a 650 game breakeven streak at 50+5's.
But I've also been +20% ROI over 1500 50+5's.

Expect a MAJOR losing month. but you can also expect a hot streak where your luckbox is so strong that you can raise with 72o and correctly guess 2pair or better on the flop.