Helicopters flights banned in N.O. ... for a photo-op

[Matty]

http://www.macon.com/mld/macon/news/politics/12548040.htm

[ QUOTE ]
And for the entire time Bush was in the state, the congressman said, a ban on helicopter flights further stalled the delivery of food and supplies.

[/ QUOTE ]Confirmed: http://www.nola.com/weblogs/print.ssf?/mtlogs/nola_Times-Picayune/archives/print076556.html

[ QUOTE ]
http://www.macon.com/mld/macon/news/politics/12548040.htm

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And for the entire time Bush was in the state, the congressman said, a ban on helicopter flights further stalled the delivery of food and supplies.

[/ QUOTE ]Confirmed: http://www.nola.com/weblogs/print.ssf?/mtlogs/nola_Times-Picayune/archives/print076556.html

[/ QUOTE ]

How is it that I'm simultaneously shocked and not surprised? /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[newfant]

Didn't you see him though? He looked so manly (or chimply as the case may be). His sleeves were 'rolled up' and he was signalling that he had finished his vacation and was ready to 'get to work.'

[Matty]

Yeah I watched it:

http://www.cnn.com/video/partners/clickability/index.html?url=/video/us/2005/09/02/vo.bush.biloxi.families.cnn

Transcript:

Bush to women: "There's a Salvation Army center that I want to, that I'll tell you where it is, and they'll get you some help. I'm sorry.... They'll help you.....

Woman 1: "I came here looking for clothes..."

Bush: "They'll get you some clothes, at the Salvation Army center..."

Woman 1: "We don't have anything..."

Bush: "I understand.... Do you know where the center is, that I'm talking to you about?"

Guy with shades: "There's no center there, sir, it's a truck."

Bush: "There's trucks?"

Guy: "There's a school, a school about two miles away....."

Bush: "But isn't there a Salvation center down there?"

Guy: "No that's wiped out...."

Bush: "A temporary center? "

Guy: "No sir they've got a truck there, for food."

Bush: "That's what I'm saying, for food and water."

Bush turns to the sister who's been saying how she needs clothes.

Bush to sister: "You need food and water."

[QuadsOverQuads]

Remember Bush standing on the rubble of the WTC, giving his big "9/11" speech? They had to shut down the rescue efforts during that photo-op, too.


q/q

[Myrtle]

[ QUOTE ]

Remember Bush standing on the rubble of the WTC, giving his big "9/11" speech? They had to shut down the rescue efforts during that photo-op, too.


q/q

[/ QUOTE ]

.....only proving again that chimps truly do love cameras.

[newfant]

[ QUOTE ]
Bush to women: "There's a Salvation Army center that I want to, that I'll tell you where it is, and they'll get you some help. I'm sorry.... They'll help you.....

Woman 1: "I came here looking for clothes..."

Bush: "They'll get you some clothes, at the Salvation Army center..."

Woman 1: "We don't have anything..."

Bush: "I understand.... Do you know where the center is, that I'm talking to you about?"

Guy with shades: "There's no center there, sir, it's a truck."

Bush: "There's trucks?"

Guy: "There's a school, a school about two miles away....."

Bush: "But isn't there a Salvation center down there?"

Guy: "No that's wiped out...."

Bush: "A temporary center? "

Guy: "No sir they've got a truck there, for food."

Bush: "That's what I'm saying, for food and water."

Bush turns to the sister who's been saying how she needs clothes.

Bush to sister: "You need food and water."

[/ QUOTE ]

Can't argue witht the man's logic. He's got a mind like a steel trap. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

Remember Bush standing on the rubble of the WTC, giving his big "9/11" speech? They had to shut down the rescue efforts during that photo-op, too.


q/q

[/ QUOTE ]

.....only proving again that chimps truly do love cameras.

[/ QUOTE ]

http://daniellelouiz.itgo.com/images/chimp_w_camera.jpg

[Myrtle]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Bush to women: "There's a Salvation Army center that I want to, that I'll tell you where it is, and they'll get you some help. I'm sorry.... They'll help you.....

Woman 1: "I came here looking for clothes..."

Bush: "They'll get you some clothes, at the Salvation Army center..."

Woman 1: "We don't have anything..."

Bush: "I understand.... Do you know where the center is, that I'm talking to you about?"

Guy with shades: "There's no center there, sir, it's a truck."

Bush: "There's trucks?"

Guy: "There's a school, a school about two miles away....."

Bush: "But isn't there a Salvation center down there?"

Guy: "No that's wiped out...."

Bush: "A temporary center? "

Guy: "No sir they've got a truck there, for food."

Bush: "That's what I'm saying, for food and water."

Bush turns to the sister who's been saying how she needs clothes.

Bush to sister: "You need food and water."

[/ QUOTE ]

Can't argue witht the man's logic. He's got a mind like a steel SIEVE. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

FYP...

[zipo]

>>Can't argue witht the man's logic. He's got a mind like a steel trap.<<

Careful buddy. That's the elected leader of the free world you're talking about.

[cardcounter0]

Daddy Bush went to Florida to view damage from Hurrican Andrew, and shut down all the roads for several hours while his motorcade passed, causing major disruption to rescue efforts.

After that, it has been policy that the President physically stay away from sites for several days. Of course it is in question if this President was ever mentally present in the first days of this event.

[vulturesrow]

And yet can you imagine how much whining you guys would be doing if Bush hadnt visited the scenes. I can almost read the posts now...

[Myrtle]

[ QUOTE ]
>>Can't argue witht the man's logic. He's got a mind like a steel trap.<<

Careful buddy. That's the elected leader of the free world you're talking about.

[/ QUOTE ]

.....yup...helluva scary thought, ain't it?

[zipo]

>>..yup...helluva scary though, ain't it?<<

I'm not a fundamentalist Christian by any means, but it's enough to make one believe a little in all that 'end times' prophecy stuff.

Or at least cringe a little to be an American.

[SheetWise]

Ban of flights is SOP when Air Force One is present, it's dictated by Secret Service. That was Bush's stated reason not to come earlier -- it would disrupt the local operation. He came when it was necessary to take over the local operation -- and he left quickly so flights could resume.

If he had sat on the tarmac for three hours waiting for Christophe to give him a haircut, there would be something to the story.

[BCPVP]

You don't have to imagine, I've seen these types of posts. Many liberals here have been complaining about how Bush hasn't gotten involved. Yet when he does get involved, he's criticized for it. Which way do you libs want it?

[Matty]

Who has authority over the Secret Service?

[Myrtle]

[ QUOTE ]
Who has authority over the Secret Service?

[/ QUOTE ]

...why must you always ask such relevant questions? /images/graemlins/blush.gif

[BCPVP]

Which political affiliation has been hysterically shrill in calling for Bush to get involved? Answer: the left. So he gets involved and wham, you nag on him for getting involved. Which way do you want it, because I'm sure America is getting tired of guessing...

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Which political affiliation has been hysterically shrill in calling for Bush to get involved? Answer: the left. So he gets involved and wham, you nag on him for getting involved. Which way do you want it, because I'm sure America is getting tired of guessing...

[/ QUOTE ]

I wasn't aware that the left was a political party. But to answer your question, we want Bush to get involved and at the same time not be a hindrance. Does that make sense to you? Is that too hard to grasp?

[BCPVP]

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I wasn't aware that the left was a political party.

[/ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Which political affiliation

[/ QUOTE ]
Do you know the difference between political affiliation and political parties?

[ QUOTE ]
But to answer your question, we want Bush to get involved and at the same time not be a hindrance. Does that make sense to you?

[/ QUOTE ]
No. You want the President of the United States to micromanage disaster relief and expect him not to be in the way. This is specifically why we have state, local, and departments within the scheme of government. So that the President doesn't have to do everything himself and get in the way. Leaders don't micromanage problems, they delegate power to others so they aren't in the way. I, as well as many others, expected Bush to make a trip down to the affected area. And with that, I expect that he will need the necessary security, especially when in an area that is not fully under control.

He should visit the area, but not when he will get in the way of relief efforts. He waited this long, so wait longer. He can be constructively involved without actually physically stepping foot in NO right now. Savvy?

[Matty]

[ QUOTE ]
Which political affiliation has been hysterically shrill in calling for Bush to get involved? Answer: the left. So he gets involved and wham, you nag on him for getting involved. Which way do you want it, because I'm sure America is getting tired of guessing...

[/ QUOTE ]I do not recall anyone nagging Bush to get down to N.O. A photo-op is not "getting involved".

All I recall is people getting pissed off that he was playing country rock star, and having birthday parties while people died. I recall people wanting him to come off of his vacation and get to work. I recall a call for reverence.

If he hadn't visited N.O. until after everyone was rescued, I am completely confident you wouldn't hear much of anything about it from the left.

And when people's lives are at stake, you can find a way to not shut down the whole state for a visit. The secret service will do what the President tells them. Why is it that the buck never, ever stops at Bush's desk.

[BCPVP]

[ QUOTE ]
He should visit the area, but not when he will get in the way of relief efforts.

[/ QUOTE ]
So in this situation when would that be? Relief for this type of devastation will take quite a while so unless you want him to visit as they're sweeping the last of the debris up you should figure out what you want.

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He can be constructively involved without actually physically stepping foot in NO right now.

[/ QUOTE ]
Indeed. Signing of the aid package that went through Congress is where he's best served at the moment. Other than that, he should be letting his subordinates, who exist for this reason, do their jobs.

[BCPVP]

[ QUOTE ]
I recall people wanting him to come off of his vacation and get to work.

[/ QUOTE ]
This is exactly it. What work wasn't being done by Bush that needed to be done by him and him alone?

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If he hadn't visited N.O. until after everyone was rescued, I am completely confident you wouldn't hear much of anything about it from the left.

[/ QUOTE ]
I don't believe this. I believe it would have been somthing along the lines of "See, he waited for weeks before even stepping foot in Mississippi/Louisiana. He doesn't care about their plight."

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I recall people wanting him to come off of his vacation and get to work.

[/ QUOTE ]
This is exactly it. What work wasn't being done by Bush that needed to be done by him and him alone?

[ QUOTE ]
If he hadn't visited N.O. until after everyone was rescued, I am completely confident you wouldn't hear much of anything about it from the left.

[/ QUOTE ]
I don't believe this. I believe it would have been somthing along the lines of "See, he waited for weeks before even stepping foot in Mississippi/Louisiana. He doesn't care about their plight."

[/ QUOTE ]

I understand what you’re saying, but I have moral question for you. Should the president visit NO to escape possible criticism from the press? Or should he stay away and not interrupt relief efforts?

[BCPVP]

[ QUOTE ]
Should the president visit NO to escape possible criticism from the press? Or should he stay away and not interrupt relief efforts?

[/ QUOTE ]
I think any time the President would have chosen to visit would have had an effect on relief efforts. While helicopters flights may have been temporarily suspended, other relief efforts were still being carried out such as the ground efforts by FEMA and the Nat'l Guard. I think the timing Bush chose was within a small window of acceptablness. If he'd arrived earlier, when helicopter flights were a the major part of the relief efforts, then he would been unacceptably hampering vital efforts. Too late and the only sense of loss he'd recieve would be the loss of property and not the human loss connected to it. I guess that's just a judgment call that reasonable people can (and probably will) argue about.

[SheetWise]

[ QUOTE ]
Who has authority over the Secret Service?

[/ QUOTE ]

Grow up. Any person elected to the Presidency has about as much chance of surviving the office unharmed as you would playing a round of Russian roulette. Are you suggesting he not take the advice of his security detail?

[SheetWise]

[ QUOTE ]
He should visit the area, but not when he will get in the way of relief efforts. He waited this long, so wait longer.

[/ QUOTE ]
He arrived during a transition in command, which seems proper to me -- the least disruption and adding focus to the new structure. He left quickly. You're attempting to define a game which cannot be won.

[Myrtle]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I recall people wanting him to come off of his vacation and get to work.

[/ QUOTE ]
This is exactly it. What work wasn't being done by Bush that needed to be done by him and him alone?

[ QUOTE ]
If he hadn't visited N.O. until after everyone was rescued, I am completely confident you wouldn't hear much of anything about it from the left.

[/ QUOTE ]
I don't believe this. I believe it would have been somthing along the lines of "See, he waited for weeks before even stepping foot in Mississippi/Louisiana. He doesn't care about their plight."

[/ QUOTE ]

I understand what you’re saying, but I have moral question for you. Should the president visit NO to escape possible criticism from the press? Or should he stay away and not interrupt relief efforts?

[/ QUOTE ]

....an effective leader would have gotten his staff together at a much earlier time, reviewed all of the options that they had at their disposal, and then put the best option(s) into immediate action.

This can be done from ANY location.

....an effective leader would have then called a press conference (from ANY location) and outlined to his constituency what he was doing, and why he chose his selected course of action.

A president who is more concerned about how he fares in the polls and how he looks in the eyes of his followers and the press, would have pandered to that point of view, and that is exactly what Bush did.

I’d like someone to explain to me what exactly is so important about Bush ‘being there’?

What exactly can he accomplish by being on the scene?

Did you see the broadcasts of his visit?

Was his stammering response/statements anything other than an insult to any discerning observer?

He has consistently shown himself to be a bumbling, pandering opportunist that continues to focus on issues that are divisive to his constituency.

Judging by results, it appears that he has a brilliant set of advisors that keep him ‘on course’ in regards to telling his followers what they want to hear.

However skillful they may be, they still cannot save him from himself when he has to extemporaneously show his mettle, or lack of it.

How anyone who examines the series of events surrounding this latest issue can come to another conclusion is beyond me.

I appreciate the fact that Bush supporters are loyal. Loyalty is not a bad thing.

Blind loyalty in the face of the obvious facts at hand is exactly that......Blind Loyalty.

GWB is our president, and has all the power he needs to advance his agenda. He does not have to worry about being elected; therefore he is now free to wield that power without political consequence.

He is doing so right now, and the maelstrom of a backlash has yet to emerge.

He has all the rope that he needs to show his true colors. Will he hang himself?

Time will tell.