Case Study: Investigating position & starting hand strength (11 hands)

[DawnToDusk]

I'm relatively new to the game of PLO. Only been playing for a week now, but I am a fast learner. From my brief crash course in PLO, I am under the impression that raising in EP is bad. Not only that, but your position is crucial in this game. If you have bad position, your foe will play your hand for you. Right? But I am having a hard time figuring out what the strength of my starting hand is and if I should be limping with it in so and so position, tossing it in so and so position, or raising it in so and so position.

I kind of have some idea of hand strength in PLO, but I have provided many examples. I think it would be beneficial for this whole forum if a discussion was started up talking about position, hand strength, and preflop decisions. The games that I provide examples for are 7-10 handed. They are also the small PLO buy in tables ($25, $50, $100 max). With each hand I post I will provide some logic/reasoning to why I did it. Please help me find out why or why not it was a good limp/raise.

Early Position Limps

I limp in UTG with 6 /images/graemlins/heart.gif 5 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif A /images/graemlins/diamond.gif A /images/graemlins/heart.gif. I figure I can make two flushes, a straight draw, or hit the high set. If the flop hits me even just a little, I have some strong draws, as long as they are to the nuts.

I limp in UTG with 3 /images/graemlins/club.gif A /images/graemlins/club.gif T /images/graemlins/heart.gif A /images/graemlins/spade.gif. I figure I can make the nut straight, nut flush, or hit the high set. If the flop hits me in anyway, I could have some decent draws, although I wouldn't say as strong as the one in the hand above.

I limp in UTG+1 with Q /images/graemlins/club.gif A /images/graemlins/diamond.gif T /images/graemlins/heart.gif J /images/graemlins/spade.gif. Is this a hand that we say can wrap? Still kind of unclear on what wrap means, but it has a lot of possibility to make the nut straight, several ways.

I limp in UTG+1 with K /images/graemlins/diamond.gif K /images/graemlins/club.gif 2 /images/graemlins/heart.gif T /images/graemlins/diamond.gif. Is it worthwhile to limp in early position with just big pocket pairs in hopes of hitting the high set? I also have the possibility to make the second nut flush, if the A /images/graemlins/diamond.gif doesn't come on the flop with two diamonds.

Early Position Raise

I BP UTG+2 with T /images/graemlins/heart.gif J /images/graemlins/heart.gif A /images/graemlins/club.gif Q /images/graemlins/spade.gif. I figure I can make the nut straight a lot of ways if the flop hits me. I will also have a draw to them as well.

Middle Position Limps

I limp in MP2 with 8 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif T /images/graemlins/spade.gif 9 /images/graemlins/spade.gif J /images/graemlins/diamond.gif. A good wrap hand with better position. Hoping to make the nut straight.

I limp in MP with J /images/graemlins/diamond.gif Q /images/graemlins/heart.gif A /images/graemlins/heart.gif 6 /images/graemlins/club.gif. Figure I have better position with the possibility to make nut flush and straight.

I limp in MP2 with 8 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif T /images/graemlins/diamond.gif 9 /images/graemlins/spade.gif 6 /images/graemlins/heart.gif. Good position with the possibility to make a wrap straight? Am I even correct on what the idea of wrap means?

I limp in MP2 with 7 /images/graemlins/heart.gif 8 /images/graemlins/spade.gif 5 /images/graemlins/club.gif 4 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif. A lot of ways I can make a straight here with good position.

Late Position Limps

I limp on button with 9 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif T /images/graemlins/diamond.gif 4 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif 7 /images/graemlins/club.gif. Best position here and able to make some straights.

I limp in LP with 5 /images/graemlins/club.gif 2 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif 4 /images/graemlins/club.gif 5 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif. Can make a set here or a straight and a really weak flush. Good position though.



These are the hands. What do you think? I am really trying to understand what hands I should be playing from what position and why. Which hands are weak? Which ones are strong? Should I be raising in some spots with these hands?

[autobet]

[ QUOTE ]


I limp in MP2 with 8 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif T /images/graemlins/spade.gif 9 /images/graemlins/spade.gif J /images/graemlins/diamond.gif. A good wrap hand with better position. Hoping to make the nut straight.



I limp in MP2 with 8 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif T /images/graemlins/diamond.gif 9 /images/graemlins/spade.gif 6 /images/graemlins/heart.gif. Good position with the possibility to make a wrap straight? Am I even correct on what the idea of wrap means?

I limp in MP2 with 7 /images/graemlins/heart.gif 8 /images/graemlins/spade.gif 5 /images/graemlins/club.gif 4 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif. A lot of ways I can make a straight here with good position.

Should I be raising in some spots with these hands?

[/ QUOTE ]

The above hands are all raising hands from any position. I like to raise with them 1/3 to 2/3 of the time (more from better position, and depending on my mood and the game).

If you mark yourself as only raising with premium high card hands in EP, you will be in trouble against observant opps.

[Burdzthewurd]

I'm always potting JT89ds preflop no matter what position; it's the only hand that's a coinflip or favorite against AAxx. You'll get paid off a lot since most donks think pot-bet = AAxx.

[DawnToDusk]

So we are talking about betting these hands, and thank you for making it more clear that these are stronger hands. But what about in early position? If we raise PF in EP with these hands and miss on the flop, what do we do? We obviously want to see our draws if we get anything close to one. Do we bet? It seems like if we bet, we are opening ourselves to a pot bet from behind us, forcing us to fold.

[DawnToDusk]

A question about AAxx, are you ever raising preflop? What if you just got AAxx, with no additional combos (like flush or straight combos) in your hand?

Is there ever a time to raise preflop? At the low limits it seems so easy to see what people are doing. You can steal the pot right out from under them if they don't hit an ace on the flop.

[autobet]

It depends on how many players see the flop. I will almost always bet against one player. Against three or more I will usually give up.

I will usually bet if an ace flops against up to three players as players tend to fear trip aces.

Yes, anytime you bet with nothing or very little you have to give up if you are raised in PLO.

[DawnToDusk]

Is there ever a time to be raising these hands with just the intent of using the AA KK QQ JJ combo?

It seems like I limp in with them a lot to hit an overfull, but should I just be realistic and avoid limping in for that goal?