Bob T.
04-18-2003, 01:56 AM
I got to play and consume several coronas with Majorkong, and Clarkmeister the other night at Mandalay Bay, in the 4-8 holdem game. I had a lot of fun, and probably couldn't accurately reproduce any hand for discussion, because my memory might have been affected by the beer.
Anyway, Mandalay Bay has a rule, that caused players to take actions that they didn't intend, and we had an extensive discussion of it at the table.
Basically, the rule is that anytime you take chips in front of your cards, you have made a bet. This means that if you check with chips in your hand, and break the plane of your cards, you have in fact made a bet. If a player put a bet out, but they were behind their cards, then the player was ruled to not have acted yet.
The purpose of the rule is so that a player who has chips in their hand, cannot move forward, and then check or bet depending on his opponent's reactions. The effect is that players who have no intention of betting, and are unfamiliar with the rule, are occasionally trapped into making a bet, because they made a technical mistake. This might be an even bigger problem, because at this low limit, there are a fair number of inexperienced players who might make this mistake.
The dealer is responsible for making the decision on whether or not the chips break the plane of the cards, and discussing the rule with several dealers, produced several different interpretations of what constituted a bet or a check. I think that this is tough on the dealers, because it may create an adversarial relationship with some of the players, which might impact their tokes, so it might affect their decisions.
If a bet has already been made, a player could have several bets in his hands, and move them forward, but having additional bets in your hands did not constitute a raise, just a call, even though enough chips for a raise passed the plane of the cards.
Clarkmester said that he had seen many times where this rule trapped innocent players, but that he hadn't seen where the rule prevented angle shooting.
What are people's opinions on this rule, and how could the situation be improved?
Thanks,
Anyway, Mandalay Bay has a rule, that caused players to take actions that they didn't intend, and we had an extensive discussion of it at the table.
Basically, the rule is that anytime you take chips in front of your cards, you have made a bet. This means that if you check with chips in your hand, and break the plane of your cards, you have in fact made a bet. If a player put a bet out, but they were behind their cards, then the player was ruled to not have acted yet.
The purpose of the rule is so that a player who has chips in their hand, cannot move forward, and then check or bet depending on his opponent's reactions. The effect is that players who have no intention of betting, and are unfamiliar with the rule, are occasionally trapped into making a bet, because they made a technical mistake. This might be an even bigger problem, because at this low limit, there are a fair number of inexperienced players who might make this mistake.
The dealer is responsible for making the decision on whether or not the chips break the plane of the cards, and discussing the rule with several dealers, produced several different interpretations of what constituted a bet or a check. I think that this is tough on the dealers, because it may create an adversarial relationship with some of the players, which might impact their tokes, so it might affect their decisions.
If a bet has already been made, a player could have several bets in his hands, and move them forward, but having additional bets in your hands did not constitute a raise, just a call, even though enough chips for a raise passed the plane of the cards.
Clarkmester said that he had seen many times where this rule trapped innocent players, but that he hadn't seen where the rule prevented angle shooting.
What are people's opinions on this rule, and how could the situation be improved?
Thanks,