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View Full Version : Hypothetical situation with TT headsup.


krubban
08-27-2005, 07:11 AM
I'm sure i have played a hand like this but i couldn't find it in PT.

Assume you openraise TT UTG+1 and gets threebet by a TAG in CO. Blinds fold and you are headsup.

Flop comes Q73r, what's your line?
Since the 3-bettor is a TAG he should respect our raise from UTG+1 and his 3-betting range will probably be AA,KK,QQ,JJ,TT,AK and maybe AQ depending on how aggressive he is.

Are there enough AK combinations for this to be worth fighting for after the flop or should we just give up?
I imagine we could fold out AK,JJ and TT, by going c/c, c/r on a blank but is it worth it considering the times we are behind?

What if the flop is J73r?

thesharpie
08-27-2005, 07:41 AM
If you're adding AQ to his range, add 99. I would make it AQs and half a possibility of 99.

So, hands we're ahead of (AK and 1/2 99) 19 combos

Hands we're behind (AA, QQ, JJ, AQs) 18 combos

Looks like a check call all the way unless a king falls, or bet the river if he'll call with AK.

A J high flop just made you even more of a slight favorite favorite, but not enough to put in 2 bets on any street IMO.

And as far as folding JJ or TT, there are only 4 combos of that so not worth it.

Edit: Forgot about folding AK with a turn checkraise. I don't mind this line now.

krubban
08-27-2005, 09:07 AM
If we go with the c/c c/r line and he calls this puts us in nasty spot.
After our c/r the pot will be laying him 7.5-1 which makes it correct for him to call with AK if he thinks his outs are good. Although in my experience most TAGs do fold in this spot.
In that case our c/r didn't accomplish anything but putting us in an even worse spot on the river since we don't know if he has us beaten or not.
Seems impossible to make this situation a +EV one :P
How much do you think we are giving up by just c/f on the flop?

krubban
08-27-2005, 09:33 AM
Trying to reason with pot odds a little bit more so feel free to correct me, I'm not used to doing these calculations.
At the flop the pot is 3.5 BB and it will cost us another 2.5 BB to call him down. 2.5/6 ~40% of the times our TT has to be good on the river. But if villain bets the river as well that indicates our hand is not even close to being good 40% of the time since most guys like to check behind their missed AK on the river.
If he on the other hand has AK and check behind we will only win 1.5BB from him.
So about 50% of the time when he has AK we win 5BB and about 50% of the time when he has us beaten we lose 2.5BB.
This seems like pretty close to neutral EV but he's also got the chance to improve on the turn or river in which case we also lose.
This leads me to think we might just as well toss it on the flop without giving up a whole lot but i suspect i got some of my clumsy calculations all wrong so please feel free to correct me.

edit: Just noticed you forgot to include KK in the hands that are ahead of us, that would make this a clear fold right? But in the example with a flop of J73r it's still pretty close i guess since AQ no longer has us beaten.

thesharpie
08-27-2005, 02:09 PM
Ah, so that makes it 24 combos we're behind. We're getting 3.5 plus his 2.5BB to our 2.5BB, effectively 6-2.5, we have about 35% equity against his range including the times AK draws out.