fnord_too
08-22-2005, 01:23 PM
Ok, another thread in Mid/High where raptor and DcfrThs had some discussion going on got me thinking. Specifically, El Diablo said:
[ QUOTE ]
I have not really read this thread, but raptor is right about the equalizing element of escalating blinds. I am pretty sure that the best players will make the most in cash games. Mediocre players will quite possibly make more in SNGs.
Holla!
[/ QUOTE ]
Let's take the 55's, for instance. A pretty damn safe bankroll for that is $5500. An obtainable ammount of expectation for the $55's is $100/hour (we'll ignore rakeback for this discussion) if you 8 table.
Now, for $5500, to be equally safe, you probably should not play above 3/6 ring LHE. Maybe 5/10 is ok, we'll go through those numbers in a bit. At 3/6, you need to make ~17BB/hour to get this rate. I don't know what is realistic there, but I'll guess 3BB/100 8 tabling is about the same level of "doability" as a 17ish ROI in the 55's 8 tabling. So, I think they get 50-60 hands/hour/table there. That means you need to 10 table the 3/6 to get there if you can maintain 3BB/100 10 tabling.
5/10 short is harder to multi table. I think you can make 2.5/100 on 5/10 short 4 tabling though at the same level of difficulty as the above two, and you get close to 100/hour, so 4 tabling can about get you to the rate. But that leaves you with only 550BB, which is probably not as safe as 100 buy ins at the 55's. Really, I'd want 10K to enjoy the same level of comfort here.
Any bigger game, you definitely need more bankroll. I'd like to have 30K to play the 15/30 game as it was before the 30/60's came out. (I have not played LHE seriously in a while, but 30K is what I aspired to when I played the 15/30. I was probably only a .75-1.25 BB/100 player when I stopped playing that game, though. I think 2BB/100 4 tabling is on the same level we are talking about, though maybe 1.5BB/100 is a better estimate. The latter works out to ~$100/hour, btw.)
So what's the point of all this babling based on some sketchy assumptions? Well, it's that for a shortish bankroll, the $55's are a great, stable bankroll buiding tool. If you cannot get up to $100/hour on them (and I am not there yet, I don't think, but who knows I haven't even booked my first 1000 yet, and I am still in an active learning phase, but I digress...) as I was saying, if you cannot get to $100/hour 8 tabling them, that does not reduce the argument since you would probably not be able to get to the benchmarks on the other games. That is, I think the $55's, and possibly higher STT's, definitely lower ones, offers the best reward to risk ratio for ~$5k bankroll.
Well, I haven't thought about NL yet, (or several other games that I am not going to think about).
$5500 in NL is probably about as safe at the 1/2 blind levels (max buy in $200) as the other things. I think 5PTBB/100 is the same level of difficulty for 4-6 tables. That translates to $20/100 in the goofy NL PTBB scheme of things. I think that comes out to about 8 full tables or 5-6 short tables. That's closer than LHE, but still not as good IMO. (The BR of 27.5 buy ins may be safer, so maybe 1.5/3, offered only at Pima AFAIK is a better fit, but I don't know the viability of getting into 4 of these games at any given time since I have not tried it.)
So to sum up: it looks to me like STT's are the way to go at least up through the $55's for maximizing your bank roll dollars. Eventually, I think El Diablo is right and ring games will become more profitable, but those require much more working capital, too, so there is a trade off. (Also, personally, I tend to get bored, so I don't know how long I can STT 5 days a week. I play tournies, ring NL games usually on the other 2 days, but I figure I will be over them by the time I hit 3-5K and will really need to do something else.)
[ QUOTE ]
I have not really read this thread, but raptor is right about the equalizing element of escalating blinds. I am pretty sure that the best players will make the most in cash games. Mediocre players will quite possibly make more in SNGs.
Holla!
[/ QUOTE ]
Let's take the 55's, for instance. A pretty damn safe bankroll for that is $5500. An obtainable ammount of expectation for the $55's is $100/hour (we'll ignore rakeback for this discussion) if you 8 table.
Now, for $5500, to be equally safe, you probably should not play above 3/6 ring LHE. Maybe 5/10 is ok, we'll go through those numbers in a bit. At 3/6, you need to make ~17BB/hour to get this rate. I don't know what is realistic there, but I'll guess 3BB/100 8 tabling is about the same level of "doability" as a 17ish ROI in the 55's 8 tabling. So, I think they get 50-60 hands/hour/table there. That means you need to 10 table the 3/6 to get there if you can maintain 3BB/100 10 tabling.
5/10 short is harder to multi table. I think you can make 2.5/100 on 5/10 short 4 tabling though at the same level of difficulty as the above two, and you get close to 100/hour, so 4 tabling can about get you to the rate. But that leaves you with only 550BB, which is probably not as safe as 100 buy ins at the 55's. Really, I'd want 10K to enjoy the same level of comfort here.
Any bigger game, you definitely need more bankroll. I'd like to have 30K to play the 15/30 game as it was before the 30/60's came out. (I have not played LHE seriously in a while, but 30K is what I aspired to when I played the 15/30. I was probably only a .75-1.25 BB/100 player when I stopped playing that game, though. I think 2BB/100 4 tabling is on the same level we are talking about, though maybe 1.5BB/100 is a better estimate. The latter works out to ~$100/hour, btw.)
So what's the point of all this babling based on some sketchy assumptions? Well, it's that for a shortish bankroll, the $55's are a great, stable bankroll buiding tool. If you cannot get up to $100/hour on them (and I am not there yet, I don't think, but who knows I haven't even booked my first 1000 yet, and I am still in an active learning phase, but I digress...) as I was saying, if you cannot get to $100/hour 8 tabling them, that does not reduce the argument since you would probably not be able to get to the benchmarks on the other games. That is, I think the $55's, and possibly higher STT's, definitely lower ones, offers the best reward to risk ratio for ~$5k bankroll.
Well, I haven't thought about NL yet, (or several other games that I am not going to think about).
$5500 in NL is probably about as safe at the 1/2 blind levels (max buy in $200) as the other things. I think 5PTBB/100 is the same level of difficulty for 4-6 tables. That translates to $20/100 in the goofy NL PTBB scheme of things. I think that comes out to about 8 full tables or 5-6 short tables. That's closer than LHE, but still not as good IMO. (The BR of 27.5 buy ins may be safer, so maybe 1.5/3, offered only at Pima AFAIK is a better fit, but I don't know the viability of getting into 4 of these games at any given time since I have not tried it.)
So to sum up: it looks to me like STT's are the way to go at least up through the $55's for maximizing your bank roll dollars. Eventually, I think El Diablo is right and ring games will become more profitable, but those require much more working capital, too, so there is a trade off. (Also, personally, I tend to get bored, so I don't know how long I can STT 5 days a week. I play tournies, ring NL games usually on the other 2 days, but I figure I will be over them by the time I hit 3-5K and will really need to do something else.)