Is this just pathetic, or extracting the most? [Archive]

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JihadOnTheRiver

08-19-2005, 01:10 PM

My notes on the villain are "weak passive calling station" but thats only based off of one hand of his where he went into calling mode with AA on a baby flop, never put in a raise and won the hand vs. an unimproved 99.

I've been my normal TAG self at this table for about 100 hands or so. That means that I've been betting all my hands hard for at least 2/3 pot on the flop. My brain is telling me that slowing down here will set off bells since I've been actively following through. But also, I'm greedy. So, how bad? OK?

Comments on all streets appreciated.

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ BB (10 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

SB ($95.90)
BB ($100.50)
UTG ($122.95)
UTG+1 ($110.75)
UTG+2 ($87.50)
MP1 ($144.60)
MP2 ($99)
MP3 ($137.38)
CO ($34.30)
Hero ($102.55)

Preflop: Hero is Button with J/images/graemlins/spade.gif, J/images/graemlins/club.gif. SB posts a blind of $0.50.
UTG calls $1, 6 folds, Hero raises to $4, 2 folds, UTG calls $3.

Flop: ($9.50) J/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 2/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 4/images/graemlins/spade.gif (2 players)
UTG checks, Hero checks.

Turn: ($9.50) 9/images/graemlins/diamond.gif (2 players)
UTG checks, Hero bets $7, UTG raises to $14, Hero raises to $45

xcrack999

08-19-2005, 01:48 PM

I would bet that flop. When an agressive player who has bet every flop when he raised pre-flop fails to bet on a flop that's perfect for a continuation bet, it just screams slowplay.

ryanghall

08-19-2005, 01:53 PM

Bet 2/3 pot on the flop and hope he's an AK cop (or has a hand).

The way you bet it, on the turn now, he's got to assume you have JJJ when you 3bet unless he's an idiot.

Ryan

CaptainNoBeard

08-19-2005, 01:59 PM

i don't mind the flop check too much. just don't make a habit out of it.

i actually put more thought into the turn. since you have position, how about just calling his turn miniraise, and coming over the top hard of his followup river bet? when you check behind the flop, and come over the top of a check-miniraise like that, your hand might as well be face up. just calling his miniraise and raising the river is a better play, in my opinion.

JihadOnTheRiver

08-19-2005, 02:12 PM

[ QUOTE ]
since you have position, how about just calling his turn miniraise, and coming over the top hard of his followup river bet? when you check behind the flop, and come over the top of a check-miniraise like that, your hand might as well be face up.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yup. I played this one poorly, but I don't think the flop check would be too bad if I had just called the turn raise and waited for the river. I would have been willing to give a little to some sort of a draw for the chance at stacking a weak hand/bluff.

orange

08-19-2005, 02:31 PM

I like a 1/2 flop bet and 2/3 pot on the turn. As played out, call the turn and see what he does on the river.

GrunchCan

08-19-2005, 02:42 PM

I would have gone ahead and made the standard bet on the flop anyway. After all, isn't this kind of hand the reason why we make all them bets with nothing? To get paid? The player you descibe will call your bet with anything > zero, but can't be induced to bluff. Value bet, and hope he has his hand of the day.

nuSFwck

08-19-2005, 02:56 PM

I don't think the flop check is all that bad. You noted that he has been weak/passive, so betting a flop that 1. has given you a monster and 2. has not likely improved his hand won't do much to extract any chips.

I agree with the suggestions for the turn and river play, but I don't think checking the flop is necessarily a mistake. In order to get more money out of villian ,I think you need to give him a free turn.

FWIW, I'd bet the flop against other kinds of players (LAGs/TAGs, etc.), but with this guy playing fairly weak I'd want him to see another card before I take his chips.

08-19-2005, 03:58 PM

While I don't want to see another diamond come on the river or a straight possibilty come, a lot of times I call this because of position. If he's trying to push you away, give him another chance.

The other thing I do here is very close to what you did, make it very expensive for him to stay around. I probably wouldn't go so high, but whatever works for you.

A flop check isn't bad, imo, unless you continuation bet almost every time and he's paying close attention. If he's a donk, he'll probably see it a sign of weakness instead of monster. This is one of the reasons I don't always continuation bet, so that I can check my complete misses and monsters.