Middle set + OESD on flop

[jhall23]

I'm dealt Q/images/graemlins/heart.gifJ /images/graemlins/heart.gifT /images/graemlins/club.gifT /images/graemlins/diamond.gif UTG+1 with ~30 and make a sweetener min-raise. 5 callers.

Flop (2.95) T /images/graemlins/spade.gifK /images/graemlins/heart.gif4 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif

Check to me, I pot it, fold, MP pot raises to 11.80 (14.15 left behind) folds to me.

MP's first orbit. He won a small pot when he posted and other than the blinds he has only been in one pot in 9 hands, so can't really say what's up with him but he hasn't been crazy loose yet.

What's the plan stan?

[LA_Price]

call and check raise allin on any turn.

[TheRempel]

You are around a 2:1 dog against KK but a huge favorite against a wrap hand like AQJ. Given the range of hand the majority of players are reraising here with at that level, I would be inclined to play it all in on the flop. Just calling will leave you pot committed to call the turn, and a 4 on the turn will leave you with a tough decision. Even a king could be sketchy because he could be moving on you with AKQJ and you may incorrectly fold the turn. I think you have to gamble that he doesn't have KK given the stack sizes.

[jhall23]

[ QUOTE ]
You are around a 2:1 dog against KK but a huge favorite against a wrap hand like AQJ. Given the range of hand the majority of players are reraising here with at that level, I would be inclined to play it all in on the flop. Just calling will leave you pot committed to call the turn, and a 4 on the turn will leave you with a tough decision. Even a king could be sketchy because he could be moving on you with AKQJ and you may incorrectly fold the turn. I think you have to gamble that he doesn't have KK given the stack sizes.

[/ QUOTE ]

Call or raise here on the flop I feel that I am making a committment decision due to the stack sizes. If I call I don't plan on folding. Was wondering whether people like calling our pushing to max EV.

[TheRempel]

Your side cards improve your hand enough that I think you could get it all in everytime and it would be a +EV move in the long run.

[Acesover8s]

[ QUOTE ]
call and check raise allin on any turn.

[/ QUOTE ]

I hate this.

Slowplay in position, never out.

You're going to be a mad duck if you check the turn and he checks AJQ9 behind for the free card. You're also going to be upset if a scare card hits the turn that may cause him to seize up a weaker hand that may have paid you off.

Push the flop.

[benkahuna]

Unless you're against someone that would only make the play with top set (and they are out there in money play), I think you're compelled to push your advantage in the hand. I find slowplaying in PL omaha to always be a mistake. Always. People chase a ton in omaha and I routinely see people at the limit you mention chasing broadway str8s.

Read Bob's book. He says don't slowplay unless you have AT LEAST an upper full boat. I agree.

I routintely see tight preflop players chasing hands like open str8 draws and bottom set at that limit. He could even have a combo hand like bottom set and the str8 draw or something. A lot of people would get overexcited about a hand like that.

You didn't mention what your image would likely be against Mr. MP.

[jhall23]

[ QUOTE ]
Your side cards improve your hand enough that I think you could get it all in everytime and it would be a +EV move in the long run.

[/ QUOTE ]

I definetly agree with this and now am convinced that it is also the move to maximize my EV as well.

In the short time I had to think I knew I was putting all my chips in the pot. Not enough time to go through all the pluses and minuses of pushing vs letting MP take the lead. I figured with my sidecards I wasn't worried too much about draws since I was re-drawing as well, but after having more time and reading replies I definetly feel pushing has more postivies then calling does, especially since I'm out of position.

I think Aces nailed it pretty much. If I just call I obviously would have to check the turn again cause it wouldn't make any sense to stop and go here because if he has a weaker draw he may call with 2 to come but not one more. Then he can take a free card and then fold on the river if he doesn't improve. Most importantly he may not put in another dime if the board pairs and he is drawing.

I think the only positives of calling are that maybe he would fold top two (very few fold bottom set at this level) if I push the flop. Obviously he folds if bluffing as well, but that would be one hell of a bluff for a 25PLO game re-potting with 4 left to act behind, so I doubt this is ever a bluff.

[The Truth]

Yea, of course, reraise the flop. all in. The stack sizes aren't deep enough to worry about any other plays.