PDA

View Full Version : Hand vs. LPP

baronzeus
08-18-2005, 03:22 PM
I was deciding between pumping the turn and pumping the river in this hand. I knew he would bet all streets if I just called.

A few things I thought about:
1. The board is almost drawless. Only QJ and QT and JT have draws here, and weak at best.
2. I am more likely to get played back at on the turn than the river. A worse two pair (or better two pair) is more likely to 3bet me on the turn than the river.
3. I have a very aggressive, almost LAGgy image. He will likely call me down with a decent piece of the board, regardless of the street that I raise him on.


Given all that, I think I like raising the turn better, especially since he probably has outs if he isn't ahead. Thoughts? What is your standard line?


Party Poker 3/6 Hold'em (6 max, 5 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is MP with A/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 7/images/graemlins/spade.gif.
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, BB calls.

Flop: (4.33 SB) K/images/graemlins/spade.gif, A/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 7/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">BB bets</font>, Hero calls.

Turn: (3.16 BB) T/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">BB bets</font>, Hero calls.

River: (5.16 BB) 9/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">BB bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>
wackjob
08-18-2005, 03:34 PM
I do this occassionaly. I played a hand today where I raised AA utg. All folded to BB who calls. The flop is 44K. BB leads I call, turn is a blank. BB leads, I call. River is a J, BB leads, I raise, he 3-bets, I call. He shows me pocket JJ &amp; I cry.
DMBFan23
08-18-2005, 03:39 PM
I usually raise the flop, but raising the turn is ok too. I would save the wait-till-river line for something like AJ where I wanted bets to go in but not too many (like you said he's less likely to three bet me on the river). here I want to spray.

also your read of his likely betting and your read of LPP arent necessarily reconcileable right away.
Poldi
08-18-2005, 03:42 PM
How do you know he will bet all streets when he is a LPP?
I raise the turn, you might face a 4straight on the river.
Cancuk
08-18-2005, 03:47 PM
raise turn.

cheers
baronzeus
08-18-2005, 03:58 PM
[ QUOTE ]
How do you know he will bet all streets when he is a LPP?

[/ QUOTE ]

This is based on me watching him for several hands. I really pay very close attention to betting patterns. Whether or not you believe me, just assume I'm right.
Poldi
08-18-2005, 04:03 PM
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
How do you know he will bet all streets when he is a LPP?

[/ QUOTE ]

This is based on me watching him for several hands. I really pay very close attention to betting patterns. Whether or not you believe me, just assume I'm right.

[/ QUOTE ]

Alright, I think you have to raise the turn though. I wouldnt feel comfortable raising the river when facing a 4straight or when the K or T pairs and you have to get a raise in somewhere.
baronzeus
08-18-2005, 04:05 PM
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
How do you know he will bet all streets when he is a LPP?

[/ QUOTE ]

This is based on me watching him for several hands. I really pay very close attention to betting patterns. Whether or not you believe me, just assume I'm right.

[/ QUOTE ]

Alright, I think you have to raise the turn though. I wouldnt feel comfortable raising the river when facing a 4straight or when the K or T pairs and you have to get a raise in somewhere.

[/ QUOTE ]


Yeah, I agree with this. I was just wondering what other people do on a regular basis.
ggbman
08-18-2005, 04:08 PM
Sometimes i'll play a hand like this as well, thinking i am getting maximum value by getting him to keep betting. However, if villian is calling down with any decent piece, the turn raise is a must. You get the same amount when he just check calls the river, but when he 3 bets with K-10, you get extra bets.

BTW, if he does 3 bet, i'm not advocating going nuts, but it's a situation where he will value bet a worse hand and your really dont gain anything by putting bets in after that point.
RunDownHouse
08-18-2005, 04:27 PM
Turn raise is my move almost always, especially when the turn is that T.
anatta
08-18-2005, 04:37 PM
Raise the turn. A passive opponent's bet out on the flop with an ace on board probably means an ace. He will call you down, but might not bet the river. He is passive remember.

Also you need to provide cover for your less honest turn raises.