$400NL, overplayed ace-high

[AllIn3High]

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ Hero (10 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

CO ($1011.90)
Button ($390.10)
SB ($488.50)
Hero ($893.70)
UTG ($392)
UTG+1 ($535.70)
UTG+2 (Villian) ($409.70)
MP1 ($1390.50)
MP2 ($358.61)
MP3 ($500.70)

Preflop: Hero is BB with A/images/graemlins/club.gif, K/images/graemlins/club.gif. SB posts a blind of $2.
<font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, UTG+2 (Villian) calls $4, <font color="#666666">6 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to $15</font>, UTG+2 (Villian) calls $11.

Flop: ($32) 6/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 5/images/graemlins/club.gif, 9/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets $30</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Villian raises to $60</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to $150</font>, Villian calls $90.

Turn: ($332) 3/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets $250</font>, Villian calls $244.70 (All-In).

Final Pot: $826.70

This is obviously no good. I think I should have either pushed the flop instead of the silly reraise or check/folded the turn. Or something. I'm really lost here. Should i just call his min-raise on the flop, what's the plan on the turn if I don't improve?

He's 30/4.48/2.14 over 72 hands. No specific reads tho.

Any help is appreciated.

[JFB37]

This really got out of control. The flop minraise in this spot -- after you raised out of the bb -- doesn't look like floating to me. You have to give him credit for something. A set of nines maybe, or two pairs, fives and sixes, perhaps. Maybe TT or JJ but would he have limped with those in this game? The only way this is going to work for you is if he was just on clubs. If that really is your read then pushing is the way to go. As it happened, however, I think all you can do is call the minraise and check fold to any decent bet if you don't hit the flush on the turn. I would not assume that an A or a K is an out.

[thabadguy]

What did you think he had? Does he look like a man beaten by Jacks?(or ace high)
Call flop, check turn, minraises are often sets by semi decent players(read average), your pair outs are no good. The flop reraise is bad as it puts u in an awful spot on turn, *if* ur gonna reraise(which i dont advocate), then push.
Check turn, see if he lets u draw for a decent price, and if ur feeling lucky.
If he raises a normal amount then its way more interesting.

[Rococo]

I think you have the right idea. With big draws out of position, you either want to keep the pot small or get all your chips in quickly in order to avoid a tough decision on the turn. I vote for option A, and I think that check-calling the flop is the best way to keep the pot small. The chances of Villain raising with an overpair or a set are too high to make leading the flop a great idea. Besides, a lot of cards could be great for you on the turn. If he has a set or a combo flush/straight draw, you may stack him if you spike a non-pairing club on the turn.

[kagame]

yuck to the check call flop comment

bet or check raise flop, but dont three bet with these stack sizes and that board

[thabadguy]

What i meant by call, was lead-call minraise, i dont like the CR at all with this hand, he might get raised big and then have to muck.
Id lead and call raise, sorry if i wasnt clearer.

[Allinlife]

[ QUOTE ]
yuck to the check call flop comment

bet or check raise flop, but dont three bet with these stack sizes and that board

[/ QUOTE ]
kagame, I agree that 3 betting sucks, but wouldn't check-raise put you in a similar sticky spot on the turn if they just call you on the flop and bet big on the turn?

[AllIn3High]

Thanks for all the quick and good responses. Not that it matters, but he had 8/images/graemlins/diamond.gif7/images/graemlins/diamond.gif and i didn't suck out.

[punter11235]

[ QUOTE ]
Hero raises to $150

[/ QUOTE ]

Why not allin , this raise is completely pointless.
I think your options here are allin or call and fold if he bet enough on the turn.

Best wishes

[Rococo]

[ QUOTE ]
yuck to the check call flop comment

bet or check raise flop, but dont three bet with these stack sizes and that board

[/ QUOTE ]

I really don't like a CR here, because I am going to be a tough spot if Villain 3-bets. I check-call very few flops, but I would still consider it here. If I lead the flop and Villain raises to $125-150, l I have three options, none of them very good -- 1) fold a hand that could potentially take down a very big pot; 2) push when I very well may be behind and have no fold equity; or 3) call and end up in exactly the position that Hero was in here.

Am I missing something?

[kagame]

well, yeah it sucks, but thats only if you miss ;-).

id rather try to take it down on the flop and dont mind folding the turn all that much to a huge bet if i miss, but people usually give decent odds to flush draws when they have the nuts

obvious shitty thing about draws on the turn; most of us like to be all in on the flop with big draws, board texture and stack size allowing, as opposed to having a big draw in a big pot on the turn


my prefered line is bet-call raise. against people who bet with nothing if checked to, a check raise is probably often the best line.