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View Full Version : Would you lay this down?


08-06-2005, 08:17 AM
I'm playing at pokerrroom, .50 BB PL Omaha (full ring game)

I have K-J-9-x in my hand, and 7-8 people see the flop (no raise pre-flop)
Flop comes:
KK9

I decide to bet out with my kings full (perhaps a c/r would have been better though), and only one guy calls, so I figure he prob. has a king.

The turn is the Q, which scared me bit, cause he easily could have had a hand like AKQT or something, but I decided that I was going to play the hand even if I checked and he bet, so I decided to go ahead and put the rest of my money in the pot.

Of course, the guy had AKQ8, and i lost a big pot to kings full of queens.

I don't have too much experience playing OH, so I'm wondering if you guys think there's any way you could get away from this hand.

Solami17
08-06-2005, 11:12 AM
Switching from holdem to omaha can be very tricky when it comes to laying a hand down. In a holdem game holding K9 with the board KK9Q, I will push it all in almost everytime. In an PLO game with 8 people to a flop in a lower limit environment, I am going to fold it most times depending on the other players I am up against.

joewatch
08-06-2005, 01:15 PM
On the turn, this is a check-fold, or make a 1/2 pot bet, fold to a raise. A lot of your gains from Omaha will come from not losing money when you get drawn out.

Dan Rutter
08-06-2005, 02:02 PM
How big were the chip stack sizes?

Huskiez
08-06-2005, 07:41 PM
[ QUOTE ]
How big were the chip stack sizes?

[/ QUOTE ]

The way it appears, Hero is saying he had less than a pot bet on the turn.

I think you played it fine.

Lafortezza
08-06-2005, 09:24 PM
No way I'd lay that down, the only hand that beats you on the turn is KQxx, if he has it he has it. With stacks that shallow I'd get my money in every time. Change the game/stacks/players and I might think about it.

Acesover8s
08-07-2005, 03:21 AM
[ QUOTE ]
On the turn, this is a check-fold, or make a 1/2 pot bet, fold to a raise. A lot of your gains from Omaha will come from not losing money when you get drawn out.


[/ QUOTE ]

Joe, please stop posting in this forum, your advice is consistently awful. I cannot imagine you are a winning player at this game since you want to fold so damn much.

08-07-2005, 03:39 AM
Yeah, on the turn I had barely more than a pot-sized bet.

If we both had very deep stacks, perhaps I would have had a chance to get away from my hand..

joewatch
08-07-2005, 10:48 AM
[ QUOTE ]
Joe, please stop posting in this forum, your advice is consistently awful. I cannot imagine you are a winning player at this game since you want to fold so damn much.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well you're wrong about my not being a winning player, but I have no problem with keeping my poker ideas to myself. This forum gets relatively little action anyway. /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

adam74
08-07-2005, 01:18 PM
[ QUOTE ]
Joe, please stop posting in this forum, your advice is consistently awful. I cannot imagine you are a winning player at this game since you want to fold so damn much.

[/ QUOTE ]

Harsh. It's posts like that that we need less of.

FeliciaLee
08-07-2005, 01:46 PM
You're right. Everyone has an opinion, that is why these forums exist. I'm trying to learn OH, and expect to get many different opinions on hands I post, without getting ridiculed in the process.

This can be a great forum, and that is what we are all going to work on.

Felicia /images/graemlins/smile.gif

Acesover8s
08-07-2005, 03:20 PM
[ QUOTE ]
Quote:
Joe, please stop posting in this forum, your advice is consistently awful. I cannot imagine you are a winning player at this game since you want to fold so damn much.



Harsh. It's posts like that that we need less of.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ah well. I'm not a friendly guy. I post in this forum to return a bit of profitable advice that was given to me by posters like Fossilman when I was just starting out in this game. I reckon I have returned the favor over the last few years.

The problem with an internet message board is that all voices carry the same weight. The level of weak-tightness that has entered this forum through posters like Joewatch, Porschenguns, and others is near impossible to combat with good strong posters like Dogsballs, LA Price, Dave D, Pete Fabrizio posting less and less.

90% of the posts on this forum are laughable now. I flopped the nuts and got drawn out on the turn by the case card, should I have folded? I got all in preflop with AAxx, should I have folded? By all means, keep folding people, keep folding. . .

FeliciaLee
08-07-2005, 03:42 PM
I'm not exactly officer friendly either, but I can disagree with someone without flaming them.

As far as weak/tight, are we talking the Malmuth definition as someone who is very tight pre-flop, but takes his losing post-flop hand too far? Or are we talking tight/passive, as in, someone who is tight altogether, and passively folds easily? I think you mean tight/passive?

I think that in the case of this hand, I'm gonna take the weak/tight position and lose my stack. If he turns the overfull, well, then he does. But I'm new to the game, so that is that. Would a more experiened PLO player be tight/passive and able to fold this hand? What would he do? You seem to be saying that he would lose more on this hand, but you aren't making it clear by just blowing us off and saying, "this forum has become weak-tight."

So if you are the one giving good advice, along with other strong players like Dogs, Dave and LA, give us your advice on the hand.

Felicia /images/graemlins/smile.gif

nicky g
08-07-2005, 05:49 PM
"90% of the posts on this forum are laughable now. I flopped the nuts and got drawn out on the turn by the case card, should I have folded? I got all in preflop with AAxx, should I have folded? By all means, keep folding people, keep folding. . . "

About a year ago there was a spate of incidents where the majority consensus was advising people to fold the nut trips on draw heavy flops and the like. Maybe it comes in waves.

beset7
08-07-2005, 05:51 PM
I think the main point is this, and we should address this in the sticky:

Q: Can you multi-table, peddle the nuts and fold in all marginal spots and still turn a profit playing PLO?

A: Probably.

Q: When responding to posts on the PLO forum should I assume either (a) that everyone is nut peddling (b) people are looking to maximize the EV in each situation?
A: B.

Q: If I find myself wanting to say "fold preflop" or "fold the turn you don't have the nuts," What should I do?

A: Consider posting less or if you want to enhance your game, think about the situation from the perspective of a dynamic, aggressive player who isn't nut-farming and wants to apply more dyamic concepts to the particular situation then "fold preflop" or "fold you don't have nuts."

Q: What are more worthwhile considerations then "fold preflop" and "Fold the turn you aren't drawing to the nuts"?

A: blahblahblah.

joewatch
08-07-2005, 07:07 PM
[ QUOTE ]
90% of the posts on this forum are laughable now. I flopped the nuts and got drawn out on the turn by the case card, should I have folded? I got all in preflop with AAxx, should I have folded? By all means, keep folding people, keep folding. . .

[/ QUOTE ]

You know, I think people should just stop posting here. Just go back and read anything written by acesover8s and you will be a pro PLO player before you know it. Do you really think it's possible to ask anything original??? /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

liquid
08-07-2005, 10:27 PM
[ QUOTE ]
Q: When responding to posts on the PLO forum should I assume either (a) that everyone is nut peddling (b) people are looking to maximize the EV in each situation?
A: B.

[/ QUOTE ]

Great wording. I still find myself trending towards multi-table nut peddling, but when I'm reviewing and discussing hands, I want to hear about (B) so that I can internalize those max EV decisions and make them a part of my game too.

That said, I like hearing from joe (and aces, and folks in between) since it helps me understand where different players are coming from. And if there are occasional arguments about good/bad advice, that's cool too. I like hearing how different people define PLO fish/donks/maniacs/idiots. Sometimes I have trouble telling the genius plays from the moronic ones in this game. These discussions help me out a lot and I'd hate to see posts dry up around here.