Poker and Relationships

[Aequitas58]

I'm crossposting this (Texas Hold'Em caterogy/ Other Other Topics) - I hope this isn't against the 2+2 rules, but I'm looking for as many responses as possible.

Long time reader, not much of a poster. I frequently post to two other HE forums, but I came here in search of a serious answer. I won't link the sites, b/c I don't want to to think I'm spamming. lol...

For the guys who have a wife / girlfriend, etc: How do you guys manage both? This sounds like a silly question, but if you're in a long term relationship, how do you manage having adequate poker-time and adequate "relationship" time?

I graduated law school in May. Studied non-stop for the PA + NJ bar exams. Took the bars in late July. Before starting to study for the bar, I would play regularly, at least an hour and a half/day.

Money hasn't been an issue... it's time. I'm not a degenerate to "gamble the rent money," and she knows this, so she's only concerned w/ the fact that I play so often.

She's a great girl - love her to death - and I hope to get engaged before this Christmas.

OK: If you have a significant "other," how do you handle poker and your relationship? Do you have an agreement worked out? Portion of your winnings to go into the "family," etc?

--
Lou

[diebitter]

Time: Talk abou and stick to specific nights. If you want to make an exception to this, agree it beforehand.

Money: Keep your bankroll entirely separate. If you must dip, make it a special occasion/treat, and not to be done lightly.

Otherwise byebye bankroll. It's a hell of a lot harder to justify putting money into your bankroll than to decide to take some out.
================================================== =========

I've found I only get aggravation if I divert from the time rules. Her indoors doesn't care about the money, as long as it costs us nothing from our 'real' income/accounts.

[Macedon]

I give my wife half of what I make every month. I also don't play on Friday or Saturday nights unless she is busy doing something.

But true be told, it still is a source of tension at times. She just doesn't appreciate not having my help (with the kids, chores, etc) for a couple of hours straight.

In short, I don't think that it is possible to convert your significant other to appreciating/loving your poker playing. They just don't get it.

[Master5hake]

She doesn't have any hobbies she does on her own? If she does, try to match the times you play poker to the times she does whatever she does - the great thing about online poker is that there are always games - games of varying quality, but there are always games -

if she does not have many other hobbies besides being with you, you need to try to help her get some... volunteering, writing, different social groups she could join - and don't feel guilty about trying to get her involved with something, while yes, it could free up some time to play poker for you, it will be an overall positive thing for her, and your relationship -

I've had girlfriends in the past, who have made me their 'life' - and those haven't worked out too well, cause after the 'spark' leaves the relationship, people need other things in their lives, long term relationships I believe serve their best purpose as compliments to already enjoyable and fulfilling lives. While during the first couple years of a relationship, just the other person can be enough to fill ones entire life, that will always fade, and without a backdrop of other individual and seperate lives away from a S.O., resentment will build up as lives start to feel more and more empty -

anyway - that was way too long of a way to say getting her involved with some hobbies is not just a lame excuse to play more poker -

short answer, play poker while she is doing something else she enjoys on her own -

esp. at this point in your lives together, this shouldn't be a large issue - as other posters have commented on, once you start a family etc - thats when this situation can get sticky - but for now, surely you should be able to comfortably have a few hours a week to yourself

[ThisHo]

fyi ... married 7yrs / 10mo old baby ... been playing "a lot" (15+hrs/wk) of poker about a year-and-a-half now.

I play after she goes to bed. Its not bad for me. She goes to bed somewhere around 9pm every night and I play until midnight/1am. I work 8-5, when I get home I take care of the little girl until she (daughter) goes to bed. I cook dinner for us. My wife either helps or just hangs out on her own (she's into scrapbooking). We eat dinner together and hang out for a while. Wife goes to bed and I play cards. Even with this we've had discussions about how much time I spend ("addiction" was used but I think we're past that now). Your GF may never be totally comfortable with it. You just need to make sure she KNOWS without a doubt that she is absolutely more important and that you would choose her over cards. I've got a weekly home game that I go to about 50-75% of the time now. It starts at 7:30, but I don't usually get there until 9:00 because I'm hleping out around the house. Marriage is compromise. She needs to understand that you enjoy this and its what you choose to spend free time doing. You need to make her feel valuable/important.

As for the $$$ : "it depends". If you are playing poker for the income then you need to vigilently protect your bankroll (actually, if you are playing for income then the time thing is a little different too - you need to try and help her understand that you need to put the time in to make the money just like any other job). If your winnings are just mad money/fun money then use good judgement. Treat her to things too (I just got my wife a gift card to Nordstrom's and a card that said I'd watch our daughter on Saturday so she could shop all day with a girlfriend or her mom or whatever -- big bonus points). Don't horde your winnings for yourself. If you are working on building a BR, don't take ANY money out. If you guys share funds, make sure that ALL your transactions are absolutely transparent - don't hide ANYTHING from her. The only time this has been an issue is when I take $$$ out for live play .. its got to come out of "family" money immediately for a run to the card room and then if I lose I backfill with $$$ from the on-line account. I make sure and TELL her "hey, I put the $$$ back in the bank today from Friday."

Honestly, its not hugely different from anything else in our relationship -- open/honest discussion of our feelings, not hiding things, not telling lies (even little ones : someone suggested to me "when discussing winning/losing amounts with your S.O. cut the amounts in half. If you won $200, tell SO "I won $100 tonight." Same if you lost. Makes the amounts more palatable. I think this is HORRIBLE advice because it undercuts the trust and when the SO finds out (as he/she surely will if you are married/together for a LONG time) then all hell will break loose).

good luck with it... make her feel important and you'll be fine.

ThisHo

[Webster]

How do we handle both a wife AND a girlfriend? wrong forum dude!! LOL

OK OK - I had a problem 5 years ago - I was addicted to poker and started to push away family - I just loved winning.

Long story short - I reeled it in and here is how I do it.

My wife and I have an understanding - when I play I play normally at the same times everyday - It's like a 2nd job. She knows when I play and thus understands - AND - I have a wife tax - I ALWAYS make sure she reaps some of the benifits.

Last Feburary we went to St.John USVI fora week - $7000 all on Poker winnings - You can also buy gifts, ear rings, and so forth. Make sure you tell her it's from poker. Sooner or later she wil catch on that you playing is a benifit to her.

So you last paragraph is right on.

ThisHo - that's funny - DJ goes to bed (falls asleep) about 9 so I get 1 hour in after work and 1 1/2, 9 to 10:30 - weekends are 4 or 5 more hours when she is busy! or asleep.

Grinders sometimes entertaining Poker BLOG! (http://www.grinderswarehouse.com)

[imported_metrognome7]

I'm lucky: my fiancee asked me to teach her how to play poker early in our relationship and now she's catching up to me in terms of skill! On top of that, she's VERY adept at pulling off the "silly semi-drunk girl who's never played before" angle against strangers in B&M games - endless comedy.

If your girl has no interest in learning - and I realize I'm a lucky sunuvabitch in that regard - my suggestion would simply be to schedule your playing time against time she spends doing things on her own; for instance, J has a "show she has to watch" every weeknight, so I'll spend that time at the tables. I also let her know about any MTT's I plan on playing at least an hour or so in advance, since if I do well that's a good chunk of time I'll be wrapped up.

Money-wise we each have a seperate "poker budget" that is not tapped for other purpose unless absolutely necessary, and that seems to keep everyone happy.

Hope that helps.
Adam

[newfant]

Would it be possible to combine the two? Like say have her give you a BJ while you play poker (this may not work so well at a B&M)? You could kill two birds with one stone that way.

[Aequitas58]

Thanks for your comments so far, guys. I'm not hot on the idea of taking from the bankroll just to keep things smooth... but I might have to shave some winnings off the top for an extra date or two every month.

My plan is to build a comfortable roll to play mid-limit stakes and mid/high buyin MTTs.

I don't think she cares about poker itself - or the fact that I'm "gambling," I just think she wants to feel like numero uno. I can understand her perspective, considering my free time IS spent reading / writing / playing poker, but it's my hobby. /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

Anyway, keep the replies coming.

Thanks.

[jba]

- as someone else has said, try to coincide her hobbies/second job with your poker playing. In other words, you need to play poker in your free time, not time you usually spend with her.

- try to get them to play. it can be a fun thing to share, and another person to talk to. and it can be nice to hear "it's just variance baby" sometimes.

- whatever you do realize that excessive poker talk will bore them. try to talk about other stuff.

- buy them stuff. take them to vegas and stuff. make sure they're getting some pros with the cons.

[MadMat]

Married 6 years - 2 boys of 5 and 2

Simply put, I plan my play for early evening while the soaps are on TV, my wife loves her Eastenders / coronation street etc and when she runs out of UK ones to watch she hits the satellite TV and watches US crap TV too, Friends/charmed etc - all the rubbish.

I do her a big favour, take the kids upstairs, lark about with them a bit, read a bedtime story, and settle them down, then spend a couple of hours of quality time with my PC, and get thanked by the wife for letting her have her TV time ;-)

and of course handing her some extra spending money now and again helps too!

Mat

[Aequitas58]

As w/ her watching TV: there are shows that she likes, but I think she feels neglected if I play poker online - and she watches TV by herself.

She mumbles something about "not hanging out." (Ie: Not spending time w/ her) LOL. I tell her, "I'm right here!"

[MadMat]

[ QUOTE ]
As w/ her watching TV: there are shows that she likes, but I think she feels neglected if I play poker online - and she watches TV by herself.

She mumbles something about "not hanging out." (Ie: Not spending time w/ her) LOL. I tell her, "I'm right here!"

[/ QUOTE ]

Well I've made it clear right from even before we got married (we lived together for 8 years first) that I do not and will not watch soaps. If she wants my company in front of the TV then all she needs to do is put on a good movie, interesting documentary, even a decent comedy - but I don't watch trash TV!

Mat

[Joe826]

[ QUOTE ]

For the guys who have a wife / girlfriend, etc: How do you guys manage both?

[/ QUOTE ]

"business trips"

[Drew16]

Win enough money to pay off the honeymoon. It worked for me, now she insists I go win more money. Goodluck.

[Bluffoon]

As I see it as long as you are being a good partner and taking care of your relationship then the problem is your girlfriend. So if I were you and I was getting static from the SO I would take a look at my conduct and if felt I needed to make some changes I would do so. If I felt that I was doing fine I would sit down with the SO and have a talk. If after making the necessary changes and/or the talk there were still problems then I would trade my SO in for a less controlling model.

Good Luck I fear you are going to need it.

[lockenvar]

i am VERY lucky in that my wife loves poker as much as i do. and i have only one other friend who has that same fortune. i guess just prioritize family first and don't let it become soemthing you can argue over. if you do, something needs to be changed.

good luck!

[Oilcan]

I'm on my 2nd marriage /images/graemlins/smirk.gif

1st wife hated that she didn't get ALL of my free time for her or her and the children. It did'nt start out that way. However as a few years went by she kept wanting more of the very little time I had alloted for anything.

She liked that I made money and spent it on her and the family. She did'nt like me playing poker.

The new wife is a different breed. She likes poker, she plays poker, she is a slight loser at poker no matter how many fing times I teach her how to play.

Her problem is similar to many women worldwide, she has no control or understanding of how to manage money.

She wants me to play and continue to make money to spend on her and the family.

Many friends have posed the same question you are asking to me, so PAY ATTENTION TO THIS:

Before you buy that ring, and/or marry/live with this or any girl. YOUR AGREEMENT is to make sure she FULLY UNDERSTANDS, what is important to you (ie playing poker "x" hrs per week) or whatever hobby or thing you need to continue to be happy.

If your hobby makes money you will spend a % of profit on the family.

You can also say what you will/may give up if that helps her understand better.

If she doesn't agree or like it then YOU SHOULD FOLD, SHOW HER THE DOOR AND MOVE ON.

I cannot stress this last sentence enough.

good luck

regards

[the_joker]

Very simple... Ask your significant other if she wants to spend time with you before you start playing.

[ QUOTE ]
Her problem is similar to many women worldwide, she has no control or understanding of how to manage money.

[/ QUOTE ]

Oilcan, please don't restrict this statement to women, or make the incorrect conclusion that women are unable to manage money. Many losing players (regardless of gender) have a problem managing money.

In response to the relationships: each of you should have time alotted to doing what you want. It is important to spend time together and also important to spend time apart.

[Oilcan]

[ QUOTE ]
...
Her problem is similar to many women worldwide, she has no control or understanding of how to manage money.


[/ QUOTE ]

My apologies to the women in the world who understand managing their money.

Edited my statement should have said:

"..Her problem is she has no control or understanding of how to manage money."

regards

[Master5hake]

I've left one reply with a more serious nature - but after reading this thread again, its slightly frustrating,

what the hell is wrong with women - a few hours a week for christsakes - CAN'T I GET 3 HOURS A WEEK, THAT ADDS UP TO JUST OVER 20 MINUTES A DAY, CAN I STILL LOVE YOU, WHILE SPENDING AN AVG OF 20 MINS A DAY PLAYING POKER? I SURE AS HELL CAN - CAN YOU LOVE ME WITHOUT TRYING TO MANIPULATE EVERY GODDAMN MINUTE OF MY [censored] EXISTANCE?!! CAN YOU?? thats the real [censored] question -

rant/joke over - love my current GF, but the fact that several men are on here talking about all the [censored] they go thru to just to get some poker time got me a little steamed, and a brought up some deep seeded angst in moving forward with her (moving in, marriage, etc)

[ThisHo]

[ QUOTE ]
Thanks for your comments so far, guys. I'm not hot on the idea of taking from the bankroll just to keep things smooth... but I might have to shave some winnings off the top for an extra date or two every month.



[/ QUOTE ]

If you're building a BR then you shouldn't pull any out. That's cool. But at some point you will have a BR and will have extra $$ .. when you get to that point, drop a little on her every now and then. It does help, plus its just the nice thing to do.

For the last poster that went on a rant : dude, if you're not allowed 3hrs a week then that's not cool (under most scenarios, though there may be some where its not cool of you to spend 3hrs playing).

ThisHo

[BigBaitsim (milo)]

Like everything else in a marriage/relationship, negotiate. Strike a contract, and stick to it. Renegotiate as needed. The wife (also a lawyer) and I often negotiate for time, chores, marital duties, etc. We have agreements about poker, and the only time she's ever begrudged my play are times when I've not held up my end of the bargain (like playing until dawn, when we'd negotiated my leaving at the 3:00 dealer push).

--------------------------------

Now, here's a freebie gleaned from a 17-year marriage and 10 years doing marital therapy. The secret to getting laid after marriage is doing household chores. Men will drive themselves crazy trying to figure out how to get their wives to put out more often, but all they need to do is keep the sink empty and the laundry done (oh, and quit acting like an [censored], they hate that).

-Dr. Milo

First of all your relationship is doomed if the first place you look for advice is the sorry lot of 2+2 posters. That said, I have to agree with a lot of the advice about negotiating, needing "your time", etc. Also, some guys are VERY fortunate to have a wife/girlfriend that likes poker or is tolerant of it. However, unless you want poker to define who you are -- permanently -- do not take the idiot advice (that was hopefully written as a joke) about breaking up with a woman because she won't let you play as much poker as you want. Although it sounds like your priorities are pretty sound (not playing while studying for bar exams, etc.), if you even consider ending a marriage-bound relationship over poker, you should seek some professional counseling -- from someone who doesn't play poker -- before making such a huge decision.

[I am fish]

Buy her a huge rock.

[LearnedfromTV]

[ QUOTE ]
i am VERY lucky in that my wife loves poker as much as i do. and i have only one other friend who has that same fortune. i guess just prioritize family first and don't let it become soemthing you can argue over. if you do, something needs to be changed.

good luck!

[/ QUOTE ]

My girlfriend too... it's a pretty sweet deal. She had never played before I taught her and she really likes it now. So to the OP I say give that a shot, and if it doesn't work, listen to the rest of these guys.

[Bluffoon]

[ QUOTE ]
First of all your relationship is doomed if the first place you look for advice is the sorry lot of 2+2 posters. That said, I have to agree with a lot of the advice about negotiating, needing "your time", etc. Also, some guys are VERY fortunate to have a wife/girlfriend that likes poker or is tolerant of it. However, unless you want poker to define who you are -- permanently -- do not take the idiot advice (that was hopefully written as a joke) about breaking up with a woman because she won't let you play as much poker as you want. Although it sounds like your priorities are pretty sound (not playing while studying for bar exams, etc.), if you even consider ending a marriage-bound relationship over poker, you should seek some professional counseling -- from someone who doesn't play poker -- before making such a huge decision.

[/ QUOTE ]

This has nothing to do with poker.

[1800GAMBLER]

summary, You all need to a argue/make agreements that this is a hobby which you spend less than 15 hours a week on, to do this you need to organise your wife to get some hobbies so only then you can have your hours set by her hobbies, so she isn't around when you play, after which you then have to pay wife tax on your poker winnings, yet it's impossible to get anything back from her hobbies because her newfound hobbies are watching TV shows, yet this may cause problems too as she even may want you to join in on her newfound hobby, of sitting , watching tv.

What happened to the male race.

[Bikeboy]

This has nothing to do with poker.

Ding, ding, ding...we've got a winner.

[jaydub]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
First of all your relationship is doomed if the first place you look for advice is the sorry lot of 2+2 posters. That said, I have to agree with a lot of the advice about negotiating, needing "your time", etc. Also, some guys are VERY fortunate to have a wife/girlfriend that likes poker or is tolerant of it. However, unless you want poker to define who you are -- permanently -- do not take the idiot advice (that was hopefully written as a joke) about breaking up with a woman because she won't let you play as much poker as you want. Although it sounds like your priorities are pretty sound (not playing while studying for bar exams, etc.), if you even consider ending a marriage-bound relationship over poker, you should seek some professional counseling -- from someone who doesn't play poker -- before making such a huge decision.

[/ QUOTE ]

This has nothing to do with poker.

[/ QUOTE ]


Absolutely. This is about control and no poker playing will just be one example of many if you tolerate the control. Allowing her to forbid you from doing the things you enjoy (aside from promiscuous sex with multiple partners) is generally not a good thing.

Now, as we move towards the wife end of the continuum, it becomes a little more situational. Much like poker it is all about the situation with very few cut and dry answers. However, if you view it as a "very fortunate" thing that your wife is "tolerant" of one of your favorite hobbies, I would read that as a problem. At a bare minumum the discussion should be how much time, not if.

As for whether one could end a relationship because she won't let you play poker? Change play poker to play football with your buddies on the weekend and in my view it's the same question. My answer to both is that one not only could but should.

PS, this assumes that the poker player is not blowing the month's mortgage payment at the tables.