To LAG or not to LAG...

[NYCNative]

You have position and one of those hands that are perfect to hit big and knock out an overpair - a suited connector, like JT or T9. The villain who raised is the type who cannot make a big laydown with big pocket pair.

You're pretty sure you're really behind but you call a standard raise anyway because if you do flop that monster, you feel that villain can't make the laydown so you'll get paid off and if you miss on the flop you can escape with a relatively small hit (in $.50/1.00, you're out $3-5).

Positive or negative EV?

[xorbie]

+EV if you can play well postflop. -EV if you cannot, because these are significantly trickier to play than sets.

[Ghazban]

I agree with xorbie. I'll also say I'd rather have 65s than JTs in these instances-- it should be obvious why that is the case.

[swolfe]

uh...dude, this is called implied odds. standard stuff...use the 5/10 rule.

[Mr. Curious]

+EV if they have a big stack.
-EV if they have a small stack.

All about them implied odds...

[the 9]

s/c are better if your opponent is weak/tight and will lay down overpairs to semibluff raises or if there are a couple of callers in front of you.
HU against an opponent who won't lay down overpairs you're much better off with a PP (to play for a set) not s/c.

[wall_st]

I do this, but I like having a big stack in addition to being in position. Sometimes I think im stupid for doing this, but when it pays off I feel like a genius.

I like this line the best for post flop play:

call pre flop
call post flop continuation bet (this way if he only has AK he has a chance to hit on the turn)
raise the turn when the board does not pair (assuming you have two pair). By this point your opponent should be practically all in (or at least committed) because if your opponent cannot get off of an overpair he is probably constantly betting the pot as well.

[yvesaint]

I play 6-max, so yes, I'm calling this if I'm confident enough that I can stack the Villain if I hit. Implied odds all the way.

[fimbulwinter]

[ QUOTE ]
one of those hands that are perfect to hit big and knock out an overpair - a suited connector, like JT or T9.

[/ QUOTE ]

those are among some of the worst suited connectors to play against a raise.

fim

[dibbs]

IMO one of the first things that need to be considered.

You can't really calculate what your expected value is unless you know how much money is involved.

So when you think about making this call, look at his stack, look at yours, guesstimate the amount it would cost for you to make it assuming you flop the draw, and compare it with how much money you really think you can make from a stubborn opponent.

FWIW, I prefer smaller SC's to T9 and 98 etc. In my experience players freeze up more on higher card flops with possible straights out than small one, cuz what idiot would call a raise with small cards.



Edit:
Personally the 5-10 rule with SC's doesn't really seem too appealing to me with 100 bb stacks, but with PP's it's a give in. Any thoughts?

[Verdi]

It's much simpler to do this with a small/middle pocket pair. With suited connectors you will more often find yourself on a draw and that can be very expensive against someone who can't fold a big pocket pair.

A pocket pair either hits a set or it doesn't. And if you suspect AK you can even try playing back at him if there are no big cards on the flop.

[passion]

In the real world you cannot assume you are up against a PP when someone comes with with a raise (especially shorthanded). To me, the prospect that your oppenent has someting like AK, AQ, ect. makes the suited connector way more valuable than if he had a pocket pair. It is pretty hard (meaning its a big dog pf) for 89s to crack a big pair, but it is only 89s is only a 41 to 59 (or so) dog to AK.

I nearly always call standard raises with these hands and if the flop comes 8T3 (or something like this) I am going to assume that I'm ahead unless my opponent convinces me otherwise.

The hard thing about playing connectors in this mannor is that it takes some skill and experience to figure out when your one pair is the best hand.

Passion

I agree that the smaller suited connectors are good against an overpair. I would much rather hit a straight with small suited conectors than hitting a straight with j-10 vs k-k with board of k-q-9 and him still having outs against your straight.
With high suited connectors he is much more likely to hit his hand when you do. And against someone that can't lay down these big cards you don't want him to have any outs

What is the 5/10 rule by the way?

[bkfizz02]

[ QUOTE ]
What is the 5/10 rule by the way?

[/ QUOTE ]
If the bet is less than 5% of your stack, it's a clear call. If it's more than 10% of your stack, it's a clear fold. If it's in between, you should use your best judgement.
I think this also assumes opponents stack is comparable.

[swolfe]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
What is the 5/10 rule by the way?

[/ QUOTE ]
If the bet is less than 5% of your stack, it's a clear call. If it's more than 10% of your stack, it's a clear fold. If it's in between, you should use your best judgement.
I think this also assumes opponents stack is comparable.

[/ QUOTE ]

yes, the percantage is with regard to the shortest of the two stacks. the 5/10 rule also assumes you have position.