Bottom 2 hand. [Archive] - Two Plus Two Older Archives

kongo_totte

08-01-2005, 10:00 PM

I probably botched this.

UTG and UTG+1 are both awful. Bad in pretty much every aspect of the game. No read on UTG+2

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ BB (9 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

MP2 ($16.13)
Hero ($55.35)
CO ($102.25)
Button ($65.65)
SB ($52.55)
BB ($49.50)
UTG ($38)
UTG+1 ($41.15)
MP1 ($49.50)

Preflop: Hero is MP3 with 7/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 8/images/graemlins/spade.gif. SB posts a blind of $0.25.
UTG raises to $1, UTG+1 raises to $1.5, MP1 calls $1.50, 1 fold, Hero calls $1.50, 4 folds, UTG calls $0.50.

Flop: ($6.75) J/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 8/images/graemlins/club.gif, 7/images/graemlins/heart.gif (4 players)
UTG checks, UTG+1 bets $4, MP1 raises to $10, Hero calls $10, UTG folds, UTG+1 calls $6.

Turn: ($36.75) 5/images/graemlins/club.gif (3 players)
UTG+1 bets $5, MP1 raises to $25, Hero calls $43.85 (All-In), UTG+1 folds, MP1 calls $13 (All-In).

River: ($123.60) T/images/graemlins/heart.gif (2 players, 2 all-in)

Final Pot: $123.60

Flame away.

trevor

08-01-2005, 11:08 PM

I think you have to get it all-in on the flop or fold. Calling leaves you no where on the turn. MP1's raise on the flop looks scary. He could be attempting to isolate w/ a weak hand like AJ or he flopped the nuts. A set is low probability for obvious reasons.

theben

08-01-2005, 11:10 PM

how awful are we talking about?

kongo_totte

08-01-2005, 11:10 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I think you have to get it all-in on the flop or fold. Calling leaves you no where on the turn. MP1's raise on the flop looks scary. He could be attempting to isolate w/ a weak hand like AJ or he flopped the nuts. A set is low probability for obvious reasons.

[/ QUOTE ]

My reason for calling the flop is I want to have donks in UTG and UTG+1 to stick around with there hands which I can assume are crap. I mean, the board is relatively safe.

kongo_totte

08-01-2005, 11:13 PM

[ QUOTE ]
how awful are we talking about?

[/ QUOTE ]

UTG is as bad as they come. A note of him says "re-raised $10 pre-flop w/ Q 6s, re-raised missed flop all in $40 LP HU". UTG+1 is maybe not as bad, but pretty bad. Very Loose-agressive pre-flop and over plays TPNK -hands and such constantly.

trevor

08-01-2005, 11:13 PM

But what about MP1? I think he's the one you should be concerned with. You have a good but vunerable hand in a quickly developing large pot that you want to take down right now. If you push and everyone folds would this not be a good thing?

kongo_totte

08-01-2005, 11:19 PM

Well, my hand is really not that vunerable. It's a raised pot and there are not alot of hands in there that could be drawing to more than say 5 outs.

"If you push and everyone folds would this not be a good thing?"

Well it depends. It's not a good thing if I can call, and have UTG or UTG+1 stick around and then push the turn. I figure I am way ahead or way behind MP1.

I think the flop call is fine. It's my turn push I'm unsure about.

theben

08-01-2005, 11:23 PM

i'm not a fan of putting a whole stack at risk with botton 2pair on a board like that. but against 2 players who totally stink, overplay any top pair, and do silly things like that then thats more cause to consider not folding 2pair

kongo_totte

08-02-2005, 09:52 AM

Villian shows 8 8 and MIHING.

Macedon

08-02-2005, 10:28 AM

Kongo,

I was sitting to your right (MP2 with $16, I bought in for $20) when this hand happened. You are right that these players were crazy. This table was just plain awful, but your mistakes IMO was not raising on the flop and your all-in on the turn.

MP1 was a semi-decent player and I don't believe for a second his re-raise on the flop was bluffing. The straight friendly board (on the flop) should have put warning flags up. The big raise on the turn should have been enough information for you to drop your 2-pair.

You also shouldn't have left so soon. The table was ripe for the picking.