River bet...

[krishanleong]

Party Poker 10/20 Hold'em (6 max, 5 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with Q/images/graemlins/spade.gif, Q/images/graemlins/diamond.gif.
<font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Button 3-bets</font>, SB calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero caps</font>, Button calls, SB calls.

Flop: (13 SB) 5/images/graemlins/club.gif, 7/images/graemlins/heart.gif, J/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
SB checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, Button calls, <font color="#CC3333">SB raises</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero 3-bets</font>, Button calls, <font color="#CC3333">SB caps</font>, Hero calls, Button calls.

Turn: (12.50 BB) 8/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
SB checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, Button calls, SB calls.

River: (15.50 BB) Q/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
SB checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>

Just a checkup.

Krishan

[Lmn55d]

easy bet.

[krishanleong]

[ QUOTE ]
easy bet.

[/ QUOTE ]

What do you put SB on?

Krishan

[Lmn55d]

yea i know his action is consistant with a flush draw, but the fact is I've seen a lot of other random hands take this line. You now beat two pair and all lower sets (yes odd for him to take this line but still possible). He also could have a random jack that was trigger happy on the flop but was intimidated by the threat of putting in 2 big bets with a weaker hand. There's a good chance button will call but not bet so you don't have to have the best hand as much here. Also, sb might have bet out his flush draw as it does look like he has one.

[JoshuaD]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
easy bet.

[/ QUOTE ]

What do you put SB on?

Krishan

[/ QUOTE ]

He cold-called 3 preflop. You're not going to be able to put him on a hand. This river seems like a value bet to me.

[imported_Robert Andersson]

easy bet on river but what to do if SB raises?

/Robert

[Poldi]

Bet. There are 2 players on the river who probably dont fold this huge pot with a weaker hand so you often win 2 bets by betting.
If you can fold to a raise, the play would be even stronger but I think your hand is too strong and the pot too big.
You probably wont see the showdown for free anyways as button is still to act and might bet if checked to.

[partygirluk]

IMO Button's actions are more consistent with a flush draw than SBs.

[JKDStudent]

It's hard to put SB on a hand. CC 3 pf... if we give him any credit, that would have to be high suited connectors. With a club draw, anything with a Queen or Jack is out. That leaves AKs. A good possibility, given the cap on the flop. Two overs with the nut flush draw.

Button is a little more confusing. Button 3-bet and then just calls everything that comes his way, which also indicates a flush draw. But they can't both have AK of clubs, so I don't know what Button would be 3-betting here that picked up a draw.

It may be weak, but I'm checking this river.

[Willluck]

[ QUOTE ]
IMO Button's actions are more consistent with a flush draw than SBs.

[/ QUOTE ]

[JKDStudent]

While folding some laundry, this hand stuck in my mind. Here's why:

I'll say that one of them is on a flush draw. Not both. Maybe neither, but I'm not counting on that. So let's say we check. If Button checks, free showdown. I'm not convinced we win, as SB could have been attempting a c/r.

But what if Button bets? Either he has the flush, or he thinks that Hero's and SB's hands aren't as good as they were pretending. We can't tell. Then maybe SB checkraises. He could be checkraising the nut flush. Or he could be thinking, "Well I have a good hand. I was only afraid of Hero. But now he checked, and Button is just taking advantage of that." Now we're stuck with it being two back to us, and we MIGHT have the best hand.

Now I'm thinking I like the bet here. It keeps us in control. It's a bad spot to be in, but checking could put us in a worse one. A raise after our bet gives us a much better idea of where we are than a bet after our check.

[krishanleong]

[ QUOTE ]

Now I'm thinking I like the bet here. It keeps us in control. It's a bad spot to be in, but checking could put us in a worse one. A raise after our bet gives us a much better idea of where we are than a bet after our check.


[/ QUOTE ]

Are you advocating a bet-fold?

Krishan

[party36master]

Hero bets, Button raises, SB folds an overplayed Jack, Hero calls, and loses to a flush.

[JKDStudent]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

Now I'm thinking I like the bet here. It keeps us in control. It's a bad spot to be in, but checking could put us in a worse one. A raise after our bet gives us a much better idea of where we are than a bet after our check.


[/ QUOTE ]

Are you advocating a bet-fold?

Krishan

[/ QUOTE ]

I'd like to, but at that point, depending on where the raise comes from, you're getting nearly 20:1. I would really really want to fold (unless I've seen the raiser raise scare cards before), but I don't think I could do it.

Here's my problem: If we check it and it's two back to us, we have less of an idea where we're at, and worse odds to call. If we bet out and get raised, we're pretty sure we're behind, but the odds to call are wonderful. Damned if you do, and damned if you don't.

Of course, a fold to a Button raise and a SB 3-bet is a given.

[MisterKing]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

Now I'm thinking I like the bet here. It keeps us in control. It's a bad spot to be in, but checking could put us in a worse one. A raise after our bet gives us a much better idea of where we are than a bet after our check.


[/ QUOTE ]

Are you advocating a bet-fold?

Krishan

[/ QUOTE ]

Wouldn't this depend heavily on the raiser's aggression factor? I think against any non-LAG, bet fold sounds pretty good. Against anyone with AF at over 2.0, I'm gonna bet-call.