Interesting Hand For Analysis

[Prime Time]

30K guarantee
40 entrants left (currently in money top 60 pay)
1st Pays 7K

Currently around 10th at this point. Can’t remember exact chip counts. But lets say hero has T12k

Blinds are 200-400 and Hero is UG+1 w/ KK.
I raise to 1K which has been my standard raising amount (2.5XBB) since bubble.

CO calls which is also chip leader.
Plan on leading any flop not containing an A.

Problem Houston!
Flop is AA5

Hero Action?

PGA71

[holman3rd]

How about this:

Against a good player, check call the flop to make it look like you're slowplaying an Ace. Then possibly check-raise the turn, but I'm not sure you have a big enough stack for this move without committing yourself to the pot. Then again, if villian is in fact a good player, he may not fall for this line.

Against a fish, bet out 50%-75% of the pot and be done with the hand if he calls (unless you catch a King on the turn).

Good post. I look forward to what more expert players think.

I bet 1500 on flop and let it go to any sign of resistance

[sdplayerb]

i check call on the flop, but it would depend how much he bets for me to say i'd definitely call.
I would rather the flop have two As instead of one since it is less likely to have hit him.
If he bets again on the turn I am done.
You also didn't say how many chips he has, which is important.

I lead out here, prob around 1750 or so, if he cold calls, you better be real worried! If he raises, he might be testing your hand strength, most intelligent players are waiting for your turn bet to come way over the top here if they do indeed have an ace. You cant put him on a solid ace just because he called the pfr, I know tons of players in his place playing KQs there..., or even a lower pp hoping for a hot flop.
cdl

[Prime Time]

[ QUOTE ]
i check call on the flop, but it would depend how much he bets for me to say i'd definitely call.
I would rather the flop have two As instead of one since it is less likely to have hit him.
If he bets again on the turn I am done.
You also didn't say how many chips he has, which is important.

[/ QUOTE ]

Can't remember exactly what he had but it is safe to assume it was 4 to 5 times my stack (He was chip leader as I mentioned in post).

[Prime Time]

[ QUOTE ]
30K guarantee
40 entrants left (currently in money top 60 pay)
1st Pays 7K

Currently around 10th at this point. Can’t remember exact chip counts. But lets say hero has T12k

Blinds are 200-400 and Hero is UG+1 w/ KK.
I raise to 1K which has been my standard raising amount (2.5XBB) since bubble.

CO calls which is also chip leader.
Plan on leading any flop not containing an A.

Problem Houston!
Flop is AA5

Hero Action?

PGA71

[/ QUOTE ]

I checked the flop w/ the intentions of calling.
Like the flop better w/ two A's, than one and feel my hand is better.

Chip leader also checks.
The problem now is I do not have any more information, and perhaps leading the flop was a better avenue.

Turn is a blank.

Now what should Hero do?

[allenciox]

What more could you want? You got a free card, which allows you to double-up if a king had appeared on the turn. Your check may have scared him more than a bet if he doesn't have an ace. If he does have an ace, he may have checked the flop to extract money from you. Check the turn, and call whatever he bets. On the river, check and use your instincts whether to call or not. Play smallball, you are likely to lose less if he does have the ace, and you will win more from his bluff if he doesn't.

[holman3rd]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
30K guarantee
40 entrants left (currently in money top 60 pay)
1st Pays 7K

Currently around 10th at this point. Can’t remember exact chip counts. But lets say hero has T12k

Blinds are 200-400 and Hero is UG+1 w/ KK.
I raise to 1K which has been my standard raising amount (2.5XBB) since bubble.

CO calls which is also chip leader.
Plan on leading any flop not containing an A.

Problem Houston!
Flop is AA5

Hero Action?

PGA71

[/ QUOTE ]

I checked the flop w/ the intentions of calling.
Like the flop better w/ two A's, than one and feel my hand is better.

Chip leader also checks.
The problem now is I do not have any more information, and perhaps leading the flop was a better avenue.

Turn is a blank.

Now what should Hero do?

[/ QUOTE ]

Bet half the pot or maybe a little less, making it look like your flop check was a slowplay. I think this size bets makes it look like you still want a call.

[SossMan]

WAWB, play it as such.

maybe a small bet on the flop, then checkcalling the rest of the way unless a king or anther ace falls.

[sdplayerb]

i check then.
if he fires big at it a 2nd time i lay it down.

[sdplayerb]

it does depend on my opponent here.
but with little knowledge on him i do bet at it. if he raises he slow played his ace.
otherwise i don't want to give him a free shot to fillup if he has a smaller pair.
and it will be tough for him to bluff-raise here as it appears you slowplayed three aces.

but a check would not be a huge mistake.

[A_PLUS]

[ QUOTE ]
WAWB, play it as such.

maybe a small bet on the flop, then checkcalling the rest of the way unless a king or anther ace falls.

[/ QUOTE ]

The problem with the WAWB here is that calling a few 1/2 pot sized bets will cut your stack in half.

What about check-call flop, bet out on the turn. If any suit has 2+ on board, or if another broadway hits, it looks like you are trying to protect your Ace, if you get raised on the turn, you can be pretty sure you are beat, saving the river bet.

There is always the chance that you just get called on the turn, but then you are really no worse off than you were anyway.

[illegit]

That's a good flop for you. Bet the flop, and beware a cold call.

[reecelights]

I think you must check the flop to represent A. If you bet, he can come over the top without an A assuming you don't have one.

Check/call the flop (fold if it's fishy). Value/Probe bet the turn 1/3-1/2 the pot unless there is some sort of flush draw, then you can bet 3/4, still representing an A that wants to charge a draw.

Tough situation, though. I busted out of a tourney where I had AA and the flop came KKT. I proceeded with caution thought the third club, the Q (straight and flush draw)until the River was another K giving me a boat.

He of course had the case K.

[MLG]

I check again planning on calling a bet and leading the river as a blocking bet.

[Iconoclastic]

Check-call Flop.
Check-raise-Fold Turn.
Blocking bet River.

[MLG]

you can really check call the flop, and then check fold the turn against most opponents.

i think you mayhave been slowplayin thoose ks lookin for a reraise? can you do that with a monster chip stack behind you? /images/graemlins/smirk.gif

[Prime Time]

Is value betting the turn horrible?

[MLG]

I don't like it. You can't know that you're value betting. He would check an A behind you quite often. Also, if he is decent, he would know that you would check an A quite often on the flop and be less likely to pay you off. I think on the whole you make more money by check calling the turn. You lose the same when you're behind, but make more off worse hands when you're ahead. Plus if the turn goes check check, you can always value bet the river.

[Prime Time]

[ QUOTE ]
i think you mayhave been slowplayin thoose ks lookin for a reraise? can you do that with a monster chip stack behind you? /images/graemlins/smirk.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

what slow play?
Raised preflop from EP.
Got smooth called by LP monster stack.

My worst card flops twice.
?

[Prime Time]

Nice analysis.
As it turns out that's what I should have done.

Results on next post.

[Prime Time]

How much do you call, pot size bets?
I am thinking even half pot(which is unlikely), will bleed you from flop to river if WB at least 4-5K.

[MLG]

I will call one pot sized bet, either on the flop or the turn. I will fold the next street if he follows up.

[Pat Southern]

[ QUOTE ]
Is value betting the turn horrible?

[/ QUOTE ]

What hands are you really going to get value from? I dont see many worse hands calling here that wouldn't try to run a bluff against you and net you the same ammount of chips.

[A_PLUS]

[ QUOTE ]
you can really check call the flop, and then check fold the turn against most opponents.

[/ QUOTE ]

Normally i would agree, but it will depend on his chip stack, I find large stacks much more willing to fire the second barrel. If we were even, I take the second bet as 80/20 we are beat at least.

I play low buy ins tourneys (ranging from 10-30$) and the play that I would of probably made would have been a continuation-type bet of a bit more then 1/2 the pot. I dont think many opponents would reraise here without a A (at my level of play). However, upon reading this thread I would tend to agree that check/call then see what happens is a better line to take.

What is WBWA ??? (excuse my newbieness)

[Prime Time]

[ QUOTE ]
I play low buy ins tourneys (ranging from 10-30$) and the play that I would of probably made would have been a continuation-type bet of a bit more then 1/2 the pot. I dont think many opponents would reraise here without a A (at my level of play). However, upon reading this thread I would tend to agree that check/call then see what happens is a better line to take.

What is WBWA ??? (excuse my newbieness)

[/ QUOTE ]

WBWA=Way behind way ahead

[beetyjoose]

I would of bet 400 on the flop.

[JJJ88]

I would check and see what the vilian does.

[JJJ88]

I would check again and call if he bets.

[sdplayerb]

i wouldn't consider it a value bet, i would call it a let's not let the guy get lucky on the river bet so let's end it now.

[Prime Time]

[ QUOTE ]

30K guarantee
40 entrants left (currently in money top 60 pay)
1st Pays 7K

Currently around 10th at this point. Can’t remember exact chip counts. But lets say hero has T12k

Blinds are 200-400 and Hero is UG+1 w/ KK.
I raise to 1K which has been my standard raising amount (2.5XBB) since bubble.

CO calls which is also chip leader.
Plan on leading any flop not containing an A.

Problem Houston!
Flop is AA5

Hero Action?

PGA71


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



I checked the flop w/ the intentions of calling.
Like the flop better w/ two A's, than one and feel my hand is better.

Chip leader also checks.
The problem now is I do not have any more information, and perhaps leading the flop was a better avenue.

Turn is a blank.

[/ QUOTE ]

I led 3/4 of pot.
Vilain pushed.
EZ fold?
This push looks fishy. Would he blow me off a hand if he is so strong?

What do you think?

[JJJ88]

Your 3/4 bet is a little too much.
On one way, it shows you didn't have an A by betting strong.
If he is good and aggressive he may push to bluff you out of the pot.

On the other hand, you bet showed some strength, if he has an A, he may push to look fishy to get you to call him.

Fold if you are not pot committed.

I would bet 1/3 - 1/2 of the pot. Not 3/4 pot.
So it looks like a slowplay with an A or a bluff trying to steal the pot.

[Prime Time]

[ QUOTE ]
Your 3/4 bet is a little too much.
On one way, it shows you didn't have an A by betting strong.
If he is good and aggressive he may push to bluff you out of the pot.

On the other hand, you bet showed some strength, if he has an A, he may push to look fishy to get you to call him.

Fold if you are not pot committed.

I would bet 1/3 - 1/2 of the pot. Not 3/4 pot.
So it looks like a slowplay with an A or a bluff trying to steal the pot.

[/ QUOTE ]

I should have checked.
I am not pot commited.
Anyone like a call?

[SossMan]

instacall.

[MLG]

call tastic.

[Prime Time]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Your 3/4 bet is a little too much.
On one way, it shows you didn't have an A by betting strong.
If he is good and aggressive he may push to bluff you out of the pot.

On the other hand, you bet showed some strength, if he has an A, he may push to look fishy to get you to call him.

Fold if you are not pot committed.

I would bet 1/3 - 1/2 of the pot. Not 3/4 pot.
So it looks like a slowplay with an A or a bluff trying to steal the pot.

[/ QUOTE ]

I should have checked.
I am not pot commited.
Anyone like a call?

[/ QUOTE ]

I called, and sucked out like a good little fish on the rivered K /images/graemlins/smirk.gif

He had Ace rag suited.

Even though I won, Knew I played it terrible and felt like a sucker making that call.

Thanks for the responses.

[SossMan]

he played it worse.

[Prime Time]

[ QUOTE ]
he played it worse.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, he got us to put in all our chips, with the worst of it drawing thin to two outs.
This may have been his plan all along.

[Double Eagle]

I have to laugh at this, because Soss and I were discussing this hand and he said "I call, if he's got an ace I can always suck out."

Pete you've now officially reached Soss's level of Poker Proficiency (not sure whether that was an up or down move, btw...)

[SossMan]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
he played it worse.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, he got us to put in all our chips, with the worst of it drawing thin to two outs.
This may have been his plan all along.

[/ QUOTE ]

umm...i doubt it.

[Prime Time]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
he played it worse.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, he got us to put in all our chips, with the worst of it drawing thin to two outs.
This may have been his plan all along.

[/ QUOTE ]

umm...i doubt it.

[/ QUOTE ]

[Prime Time]

[ QUOTE ]
I have to laugh at this, because Soss and I were discussing this hand and he said "I call, if he's got an ace I can always suck out."

Pete you've now officially reached Soss's level of Poker Proficiency (not sure whether that was an up or down move, btw...)

[/ QUOTE ]

Well he had two outs /images/graemlins/grin.gif