TT opinions please

[MrBruno]

Table is loose/passive. UTG2 has been steadily losing chips for the past 80 hands or so and seems to be on tilt from chat dialog in previous hands he's recently lost.


Paradise Poker 0.25/0.50 Hold'em (10 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is SB with T/images/graemlins/club.gif, T/images/graemlins/spade.gif.
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, UTG+1 calls, UTG+2 calls, MP1 calls, <font color="#666666">4 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, UTG+1 calls, UTG+2 calls, MP1 calls.

Flop: (9 SB) Q/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 7/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 5/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, UTG+1 folds, <font color="#CC3333">UTG+2 raises</font>, MP1 folds, <font color="#CC3333">Hero ???</font>

[McGahee]

Call, check/call the rest of the way.
Most of the time I'll either pull a stop &amp; go or C/R a non /images/graemlins/diamond.gif turn, but I'm really not interested in getting bluff raised/3-bet by a tilted player with this hand.

[ViperGTS]

Hard to say without knowing anything about him. If he has any clue what he's doing he has to at least like his hand a little pre-flop (having called relatively early + calling a bet back to him).

I would call, then plan to check/fold the turn UI &amp; facing aggression (assuming he leads on the turn).

Viper GTS

[2+2 Junkie]

Call. I don't give him credit for the Q just yet. He could be on a flush draw. There are two things you can do here:
1. Lead the turn (stop n go) and see if he raises again. If so, I would fold.
2. Check the turn and see if he checks, which for the most part indicates the flush draw. Then bet the river if no /images/graemlins/diamond.gif comes out. If he bets again after you check, I would fold UI.

[Wacken]

Personally i just limp with TT at such tables in these situations.
I'll raise TT against 1 or 2 callers before me, but not against more.
With more people in the pot, it seems to me that the chances of winning unimproved are extremely low, certainly since many will chase you to the river with just overcards. Also does none of them fold to your raise after calling first.
I play TT and lower only for trips usually on these tables with many callers.

Is that wrong ?

[@bsolute_luck]

could someone help me out why we would check/call this down (not saying it is wrong)?

how many times do we have to be up against a flush draw or Q or 7/mid pocket 88/99/bluff to make this profitable? (i hope i asked that right).

[MrWookie47]

TT is the 5th best hand in poker. You have a very large edge against your opponents range of hands. Not raising TT preflop is pretty bad at most tables.

[McGahee]

[ QUOTE ]
could someone help me out why we would check/call this down (not saying it is wrong)?


[/ QUOTE ]

I would never check/call it down vs. an unknown. You're right - there are a lot of draws that can beat us.
Villian is on tilt and people do some crazy stuff on tilt. I really don't want to get pushed off the best hand, and I very well may do that if I lead the turn vs. this player.

[MrBruno]

Is there any merit in raising the flop to try for a "cheap" showdown?

[McGahee]

[ QUOTE ]
Is there any merit in raising the flop to try for a "cheap" showdown?

[/ QUOTE ]

No

[@bsolute_luck]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
could someone help me out why we would check/call this down (not saying it is wrong)?


[/ QUOTE ]

I would never check/call it down vs. an unknown. You're right - there are a lot of draws that can beat us.
Villian is on tilt and people do some crazy stuff on tilt. I really don't want to get pushed off the best hand, and I very well may do that if I lead the turn vs. this player.

[/ QUOTE ]

well i guess that's what i'm asking. maybe he is being goofy with a mid pocket pair (88-99) or maybe A/images/graemlins/diamond.gif6/images/graemlins/diamond.gif (or simply just Axs/images/graemlins/diamond.gif) or just a lone flush draw.

i'm wondering how to start figuring out if he has "x" hand(s) this % of times, how big does the pot have to be for my calling down to be profitable when up against such hands- even if he does have the Q? or is it not possible to figure this out?

[MrBruno]

Would you mind expanding on your answer as to why raising is not optimal? Not saying that it is, I just want to understand why it isn't...thanks!

[McGahee]

It has something to do with this:

[ QUOTE ]

Hero is SB


[/ QUOTE ]

If you feel you have the best hand and this guy's really a donk, then by all means reraise, but do not expect a cheap showdown.

[bozlax]

You're out of position and Villan is on tilt. If you check, he's going to bet...if you bet, he's going to raise. You're not getting a cheaper showdown by raising the flop, in fact, you're costing yourself an extra SB.

[imported_The Vibesman]

My normal play here is to call the raise and lead a non-diamond turn. Your average player is raising here with either a Q or a flush draw, or perhaps a lower pair. The Q will raise the turn as well. The Flush draw and lower pair usually won't unimproved. Then I can safely fold to a raise on the turn.

That said, if this guy's tilting, none of that might apply. I might just call him down, since I have no idea what he's holding, but I don't want to fold the best hand because my opponent is psycho.