Hangin with Kristy Gazes

[MLG]

Beginning of a WPT Borgata sat on full tilt. Kristy Gazes is at my table, and I just finished telling her about when we played together at the beginning of the WSOP. She says, you play well, so those are our mutual reads.

I limp 22 for 30 UTG, folds to Kristy in LP who min raises. BB minreraises and immediately gets labeled dipshit. I call and kristy calls. Blinds started at 15/30 and we all have 2k when the hand started and there's now 270 in the pot. Flop is 9 /images/graemlins/spade.gif7 /images/graemlins/club.gif5 /images/graemlins/club.gif Dipshit checks and I bet 200. Kristy calls, dipshit folds. Turn is the 9 /images/graemlins/heart.gif.

What are some hand ranges for Kristy and what should my action be. Also, if you have a problem with anything up to this point in the hand feel free to fire away.

[A_PLUS]

My range would be a small to middle pair, or a ATs-KQs type of hand. Looks like she is trying to build a bigger pot with a hand she has the equity edge (and position)in.

Both would be consistent with her call, especially if the high cards are clubs, and/or she knows this flop could have missed you completely and it wont stop you from firing at it.

** Tiger gaming has a step type STT set up for the borgata satelites as well. The structure is pretty slow, and the play at least up the 2xx$ level is pretty weak.

[kyro]

I could be way off, but the only conceivable hands I could see solid pros minraising are midpairs...trying to build a pot in case they set up.

So, either she has a set and is slowplaying you...or I'd say maybe 6s or 8s.

Either way, I don't see you being ahead here very often at all.

[ononimo]

far be it from me to critique someone at your level but here's my $0.02 anyway:

a) i hate limping in EP with those tiny pairs because of the very situation you've presented so i probably would have folded preflop even though the blinds are so low at this stage. that being said

b) i think you've played the flop well. you made a good sized bet to gain information but haven't overcommitted yourself. the problem is kristy's flat call hasn't told you much and you're out of position.

without any further reads, i'd probably put her on a medium pocket pair rather than just 2 big cards ... that's not such a good flop for 2 big cards so I would think she'd make a play on the flop in order to you get you to fold or gain a free card on the turn. on the other hand, that's a pretty good flop for a medium pair -- she either has trips or a straight draw -- so she probably figures she's got the best hand and/or draw and can afford to slowplay against you.

i think you have to shut down on the turn - i wouldn't want to get too invested this early with an underpair.
just my $0.02.

EDIT: p.s. as someone who has spent some time with her, I'd trust your opinion on this: am I wrong to think Kristy is kinda sexy?

[sirio11]

Whats the idea of the flop bet Mike? You think you can take the pot right there, or you plan to take it if a scary card came.
My range for KG is 66 or 88

[woodguy]

If I think she has an overpair, but could be pushed off with a check/raise repping a 9 I probably do that.

I don't lead here, because if she calls, I'm check/folding the river unles a magic 2 comes.

If she has an overpair and you lead she may raise to see where she's at, and I have to fold fhere too (or she may raise w/ air to see if you're for real)

So I really don't like a lead.

I c/r all-in or check fold.

This early I don't like to get too fancy, and as weak as it sounds I don't mind the check/fold, as I believe leading here just bleeds chips, but It will get your probe bets called later, which can be good and bad.

If I check and she checks behind, she's probably calling a river bet unless a /images/graemlins/club.gif comes off, or the board pairs again and you bet a goodly amount, so if the river blanks I probably check/fold or check/call depending on how much she bets and how much I am willing to spend to see her hand.

edit: of course the problem w/ c/r all in is the times she has a set or decides to call with her overpair, which is another reason why check/fold is ok and not too weak.

I hate being out of position.

Regards,
Woodguy

[fnurt]

I agree with woodguy that I'm not putting in any more chips, and I would add that 110% of the reason you limp with 22 at level 1 is to flop a cheap set, and the remaining -10% is the chance for FPS.

[MLG]

I think the chances of her playing an overpair like this preflop and on the flop are approximately 0.

[MLG]

I expected to take the pot down on the flop, or be raised by pretty much any made hand or good draw. I was suprised that I was flat called, and basically planned to give up on almost all turn cards. The 9 in my mind was an excellent card for me though.

[MLG]

[ QUOTE ]
i think you've played the flop well. you made a good sized bet to gain information but haven't overcommitted yourself. the problem is kristy's flat call hasn't told you much and you're out of position

[/ QUOTE ]

I think her flat call tells me quite a bit. Almost all made hands will raise this very draw heavy flop, as well a good deal of strong draws. I think he call tells my quite reliably that she has a very mediocre hand.

[ClaytonN]

I would put her on a speculative drawing hand that does well multiway like JT/QJs or something like 66. I like how you played the flop.

On the turn I would lead for approximately 2/3 the pot and play poker from there.

[Ulysses]

66 or 88 pop to mind. Some hands like 78 or maybe JT spades are also possible. Anyway, you get the idea, that family of hand strength. 89 is one of a small handful of possibilities I'd be worried about. But there are a lot more hands that don't call the turn. So I bet about 500 on the turn and expect a fold.

[Ulysses]

[ QUOTE ]
On the turn I would lead for approximately 2/3 the pot and play poker from there.

[/ QUOTE ]

"LOL"

[Ulysses]

[ QUOTE ]
If she has an overpair and you lead she may raise to see where she's at, and I have to fold fhere too (or she may raise w/ air to see if you're for real)


[/ QUOTE ]

There's not enough money for her to raise the turn to "see where she's at" or "see if he's for real." Not to mention that I don't think an overpair is very likely anyway.

[Seadood228]

[ QUOTE ]
66 or 88 pop to mind. Some hands like 78 or maybe JT spades are also possible. Anyway, you get the idea, that family of hand strength. 89 is one of a small handful of possibilities I'd be worried about. But there are a lot more hands that don't call the turn. So I bet about 500 on the turn and expect a fold.

[/ QUOTE ]

End of thread.. I supposed she could turn up something crazy but IMO El D has hit almost 100% of the hands that she could have. I guess something like J9s could also be in her wheelhouse, but IMO TP might give you a little more action on the flop because it likely hit the board in more ways than just TP.

[A_PLUS]

What do you make of her preflop raise? a few things come to mind.

MLG limps from EP, possible that he reraises with a hand that he was trying to trap with (although a play best used against an unknown donk, not someone you respect)

She knows MLG is aggressive and wants to build a pot that he will feel like coming after with a speculative hand that she could bust him with. 22-99, JTs-KQs, Axs.

Regardless of here hand, with fairly deep stacks she feels that she will have a big edge against MLGs range of limping hands based on her position.

I use plays like this at low level pot limit games with a single limper, especially if they are the type that will lead out small and quickly retreat. A great way to add a few extra big blinds. I am very curious to what good players think of her bet here

[ClaytonN]

[ QUOTE ]
"LOL"

[/ QUOTE ]

/images/graemlins/shocked.gif

[locutus2002]

I think the miniraise is because she doesn't know what to make of your UTG limp. She wants to isolate but doesnt have a hand that can stand a big raise.

I rule out big pairs because she would have rereraised dippy.
I think mid and small pairs are unlikely because she would call for set value.

That leave AK, AQ, AJs, KQs (she may be miniraising to see where she's at, and protect her hand after the flop, and to see if you have a pr that you can't raise with, or something speculative, rather than a premium hand)

She calls the flop bet because she has you on a speculative hand or a pair. And probably figures it will be difficult for you to bet the turn.

I would think she has to have at least the A /images/graemlins/club.gif in her hand, just to know that you didn't limp A /images/graemlins/club.gif-rag.

I think the flush draws look likely. I like AJ-AQ /images/graemlins/club.gif.

[ononimo]

[ QUOTE ]
I think her flat call tells me quite a bit. Almost all made hands will raise this very draw heavy flop, as well a good deal of strong draws. I think he call tells my quite reliably that she has a very mediocre hand.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree that certain made hands would probably raise that flop -- namely overpairs, 88, and 66 -- but if she had 99, 77, or 55 would she really raise here instead of the turn (obviously 99 is unlikely given the as-of-yet unknown turn)? again, i think you can rule out overcards (except maybe JTs) flatcalling that flop but that's about it ... if she has a gutshot straight draw with a pair or two overcards, she might not be raising simply because she doesn't want to get reraised out of the pot, especially since it's still early in the tourney.

so when do we find out what she had?

[archangel]

[ QUOTE ]
without any further reads, i'd probably put her on a medium pocket pair rather than just 2 big cards ... on the other hand, that's a pretty good flop for a medium pair -- she either has trips or a straight draw -- so she probably figures she's got the best hand and/or draw and can afford to slowplay against you.

[/ QUOTE ]

[MLG]

you missed my point. medium strength hands like 88/66/J10 and such will call here to look at the enxt card and hope to freeze me. Generally speaking good made hands, top pairs, overpairs even sets should raise here because the board is so draw heavy. Given that Kristy is a good player I expect her to be raising most made hands, and most of her stronger draws.

As for what she had, you don't get to find it out since she folded when I led the turn for 500.

[MLG]

If thats her flush draw she pushes the flop, most of the time, figuring she has 12-15 outs and that I'll fold a lot. All of which is true.

[kuro]

She probably has a small pair or a suited connector that hit the flop part way or overcards. So she's got a flush draw, a pair with a weak kicker, pair and an inside straight draw, or she completely missed the flop with overcards.


I'd have checked the flop and been looking to throw away my hand. 22 out of position against a pro that knows you're aggressive and capable of folding and also that you don't have a hand that was worth raising preflop utg or raising over a min-raise/min-reraise is a really tough spot. Stacks are deep and pro with position abuses you too often here.

The turn is tough. If you bet, I think villain comes over the top of you a pretty high percentage of the time because it's pretty unlikely you limped with a 9 in your hand utg and stacks are deep enough that you're not going to the mat with a small pair and it's not likely that you'd bet if you had a boat here. So I think you check and see what Kristy does. If she bets out then I think you can probably represent the boat and check-raise her off her hand but it just seems so high risk. If she checks behind and the 3 flush hits or doesn't hit, then you're in limbo as far as if you should bet to get her to fold or check/fold.

[kuro]

So given her fold on the turn, she probably had a pair and an inside straight draw, a straight draw and gave you credit for the nine or a bigger pair?

[Double Eagle]

Well I saw this hand live and pretty much had her on a medium pair and you on air based up on the flop/turn action. I remember thinking that the turn bet was a bit bigger than I would have suspected with a hand that had much showdown value and consequently looked as if it was meant to get her to fold a hand she hoped to freeze the action with after the flop call. I got the feeling she was VERY suspicious but she wasn't about to play heroine on the first hand.

You play goot.

[Che]

She'll push 2000 into a 470 pot?

[jon_1van]

[ QUOTE ]
I could be way off, but the only conceivable hands I could see solid pros minraising are midpairs...trying to build a pot in case they set up.


[/ QUOTE ]


This is exactly what I thought.

[fnurt]

Dunno about pushing, but with a flush draw and 2 overcards on this flop, seems like she would definitely have to raise.

[MLG]

she might not actually push, but any raise here is as committing as a push I would think. If she makes it 600 she only has 1300 behind and the pots already 1000 before my action.

[SossMan]

I'm not sure what she had, but I know that she has to put you on a small/med pair with your calling twice preflop from UTG. Your betting into two preflop minraisers probably reps a set pretty good. She peeled one off w/ her 88/66/87s and whiffed. Pretty good bet there on the turn.

[woodguy]

[ QUOTE ]
I think the chances of her playing an overpair like this preflop and on the flop are approximately 0.

[/ QUOTE ]

Right.

I totally crapped the bed on this one.

I think I was putting monsters under the bed with her min/raise flat call PF, then another flat call on the flop.

I would generally expect most hands, including most draws, to raise the flop except a monster.


Good post.

Regards,
Woodguy

[JC_Saves]

Thanks for this thread. I really enjoyed everyone's analysis and learned a ton.

That being said, I would have folded this hand when it was raised and reraised. 22 UTG is not a hand that you can be playing in raised pot and expect to do well over time.

I definitely would have checked this flop, because of all the overcards and the fact that we are way out of position.

I think that she is playing some kind of suited connectors that she wanted to build a pot with. I think that she has at least one club and was hoping to pair, or hit another club on the turn to give her more outs. The hands that come to mind to me really are AQo, AJ, AT, KQs, KJs I don't see her having 88s, 66s here. I definitely think that it is overcards to the board.