Cannot chop WCOOP seats anymore...

[Jurollo]

Schwah came by a SNG I was trying to chop and tells me you cant chop WCOOP seats anymore, I told him I did the other day in a DS and waited for support anyway then they confirmed that you cannot chop these anymore. I have to say that this really sucks and came out of nowhere as I have chopped and seen others chop these events, hopefully they change this as the DS structure with 2nd getting $38 and 1st getting $2600 is mighty steep.
~Justin

[TheTimeIsUp]

Wtf? Anyone got their motive behind this?

[Jurollo]

Nope... support just told me the guy who chopped my DS made a BIG mistake.
~Justin

[Jurollo]

Anyone want to start some sort of petition on here to show Lee and PS how much we want chops?
~Justin

[Lloyd]

[ QUOTE ]
Anyone want to start some sort of petition on here to show Lee and PS how much we want chops?
~Justin

[/ QUOTE ]
I sent them an email already. After all, even the WSOP allowed chopping given the crapshoot nature of essentially winner take all single table satellites.

[bugstud]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Anyone want to start some sort of petition on here to show Lee and PS how much we want chops?
~Justin

[/ QUOTE ]
I sent them an email already. After all, even the WSOP allowed chopping given the crapshoot nature of essentially winner take all single table satellites.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think the volume of sats running makes it harder. Also it being for an online tourney makes it easier on their end to just say no.

[schwah]

i'm not TOO upset about this since when i tried to chop heads up in a ds and was told i couldn't, i wound up winning the entire seat. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

BUT yeah, it sucks. i think part of the reason might be because of a failed chop about a week ago when 5 people were trying to chop 3 seats in the 33+R. they discussed it for over 30 minutes and couldn't come to an agreement. it was pretty ridiculous since <$50 was being disputed. the host was pretty obviously fairly annoyed, as were several of the players. i forget how it was resolved but i think they wound up playing it out.

[Jurollo]

Well I won the SNG i was in for $530 W$ and am final 2 in a DS for the main event seat, it would be a nice windfall of $3100 W$ if I can take the DS too.
~Justin

[Cleopatra]

PokerStars obviously wants to have lots of people actually playing the $2600 event, which is why they don't like satellites being chopped.

However, they do allow you to unregister for 2600 W$. Presumably if you trusted everyone else, you could do a "private" deal, then just have the eventual winner unregister and transfer the W$ to the other players by emailing support. It's kind of silly that Stars support won't enforce that kind of deal directly.

I wish they would clearly set out their policy on this (preferably on the WCOOP web page or in the lobby of each qualifier) -- I am going to PM Lee Jones with the URL of this post.

[Lee Jones]

Hi folks -
First, please don't PM me with PokerStars-related questions. If you want to contact me for something PokerStars-related, please send it to:

pokermanager@pokerstars.com

(Also realize that I get 150-200 emails a day - if I don't answer yours instantly, it's not because I don't care).

As regards the specific issue, this rule is on our

WCOOP FAQ (http://www.pokerstars.com/2005wcoop/faq.html)

We chose not to support deals in the WCOOP satellites because as soon as they started, people were getting down to 2-3 players and then saying "Okay - let's chop up the W$." Needless to say, the intent of these satellites is to produce WCOOP seats.

You are correct, of course, that the winner could unregister and sell the W$, and/or make private deals with the other players (assuming he trusts them). And we haven't attempted to stop either of those practices. But when we refuse to facilitate the deals, most of the players say, "Oh - okay. We'll play it out." And then we get a winner and a WCOOP seat.

We just want to maximize participation in WCOOP, and have set up rules that are consistent with that goal.

Best regards,
Lee Jones

PokerStars Poker Room Manager

[baronzeus]

I don't mean this in a mean way, but you have to understand how ridiculous steep payouts are to players. I refuse to play in these satellites simply because of the steep payout---

If you don't get what I mean, check out Paradise Poker's Million Dollar Freeroll. First place gets 1 million, 2nd gets 10000. Considering that HU is very luck intensive, having first place getting 100x more than 2nd place (which is essentially what you're doing) doesn't make any sense.


Just my 2 cents.

[augie00]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't mean this in a mean way, but you have to understand how ridiculous steep payouts are to players.

[/ QUOTE ]

Lee understands. He just doesn't care. If they want players in the WCOOP letting people chop sats is just silly.

[Pat Southern]

Why not do chops where one person has to take the seat? Then they can make a deal based on cash or other $W in their account.

[z32fanatic]

[ QUOTE ]
Why not do chops where one person has to take the seat? Then they can make a deal based on cash or other $W in their account.

[/ QUOTE ]

This seems like the solution. Don't they do this with WSOP seats?

[Lloyd]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Why not do chops where one person has to take the seat? Then they can make a deal based on cash or other $W in their account.

[/ QUOTE ]

This seems like the solution. Don't they do this with WSOP seats?

[/ QUOTE ]
Good suggestion. I have to say that I'm less inclined to play in satellites given the rule. I wonder how many other people feel that way and if that will actually result in fewer people playing in the events. I think that most people who play in satellites are doing so to get an entry into the event. So if they chop, they'll just play in another one until they get enough W$ to buy-in. What am I trying to do? Get W$ and sell for 90 cents on the dollar? Obviously I'm trying to get into events.

[ismisus]

They don't want to donate any part of the 2.5 million thats promised in the main event.

[Jurollo]

[ QUOTE ]
Hi folks -
First, please don't PM me with PokerStars-related questions. If you want to contact me for something PokerStars-related, please send it to:

pokermanager@pokerstars.com

(Also realize that I get 150-200 emails a day - if I don't answer yours instantly, it's not because I don't care).

As regards the specific issue, this rule is on our

WCOOP FAQ (http://www.pokerstars.com/2005wcoop/faq.html)

We chose not to support deals in the WCOOP satellites because as soon as they started, people were getting down to 2-3 players and then saying "Okay - let's chop up the W$." Needless to say, the intent of these satellites is to produce WCOOP seats.

You are correct, of course, that the winner could unregister and sell the W$, and/or make private deals with the other players (assuming he trusts them). And we haven't attempted to stop either of those practices. But when we refuse to facilitate the deals, most of the players say, "Oh - okay. We'll play it out." And then we get a winner and a WCOOP seat.

We just want to maximize participation in WCOOP, and have set up rules that are consistent with that goal.

Best regards,
Lee Jones

PokerStars Poker Room Manager

[/ QUOTE ]

While I completely understand your stance I feel like this rule will actually cut down on WCOOP participation in the long run, the exact opposite effect you are trying to have. For instance, I was playing in a double shootout and was dead even heads up and wanted to chop, I would have taken my $1300 W$ and entered a $1000 NLHE event and taken the $300 extra to invest more in sats, however, I got 2nd for $38 and now will not be playing in any of those sats OR the $1K event. The winner clearly stated he had NO intention of playing the main event and would just use some of his money for WPT sats and others for smaller WCOOP sats. Essentially what I am trying to say is that you are just creating more W$ that will be unused with this policy rather than allowing players to win less than the ME buyin and recycling them through the satellite system.
~Justin

[Apathy]

A bit of a thread Hijack here but do people sell their seats to these events or the $WCOOP (for less the what they are worth) and if so where can I buy them?

I am thinking of just buying into all the events rather then spending time with these sats, but maybe ill play a few for the 1k and 2.5k events.

[MicroBob]

[ QUOTE ]


This seems like the solution. Don't they do this with WSOP seats?

[/ QUOTE ]


Yes they do.

When I won my Stars double-shootout to the WSOP I was offered $2500 cash for the seat (this was when I was trailing in chips heads-up). I counter-offered $3500 in cash and he refused. We played it out, I got lucky. I won the seat.

But this was a common practice.


So if it is Stars intent to give the whole seat to one player (which makes sense I suppose) then it should still be okay for a chop to made where one player offers $1300 cash to let the other player win the $2600 seat. Something like that anyway.

People want to do deals so much that they are willing to trust each other to make the appropriate transfer.
The fact that Stars won't facilitate these deals yet will allow players to rely on each other in such a way strikes me as somewhat hypocritical.


I'm not a big fan of the policy here....but it's really not THAT big a deal to me. I can live with it. I just hope I don't get a whole bunch of 2nd places in the $38 DS's....at THAT point I would be a little less thrilled with the policy.

[bugstud]

[ QUOTE ]
A bit of a thread Hijack here but do people sell their seats to these events or the $WCOOP (for less the what they are worth) and if so where can I buy them?

I am thinking of just buying into all the events rather then spending time with these sats, but maybe ill play a few for the 1k and 2.5k events.

[/ QUOTE ]

you can buy the tourney dollars