Collusion and cheating in my own home... HELP!!!

[cyberer]

I posted this to the other forum too, sorry for the repeat...

As the subject line implies, I have a problem in my home games. We usually get the same crowd of about 14 guys around. Well lately I've been realizing that 3 of the guys playing seem to be colluding. Two of the guys are brothers and the other is a mutual friend of mine and theirs. Here is how it seems to be going when they do it. We usually play with 2 preliminary tables which combine to a big final table. So chances are 2 of the 3 wind up at one table and the other is at another table. So the 2 guys at one table go all in against each other so one gets a mountain of chips. Then the guy at the other table plays really tight and gets to the winner's table. Then the brothers are together at the winner's table. They can often be seen whispering and they both play strong and try to get even more chips. Then when the game becomes 3 handed, the collusion begins in earnest.

When it is 3 handed between the brothers and another guy, whenever the other guy folds one of the brothers also folds so that the brothers dont eliminate each other. Therefore they can wait until the other guy goes all in and both call him to ruin his odds. Then they split the money (I know the brothers split it and i assume that the 3rd guy is in). What can I do?! My home game is going to hell. Please help.

Become a paper player.

[cyberer]

a what?

[mdeck]

The next time you catch them cheating hit one of them in the face with a shovel, and kick them out of your house.

Or you know...Don't let them play anymore?

A paper player

[ QUOTE ]
What can I do?! My home game is going to hell. Please help.

[/ QUOTE ]

Um, don't invite them? It's your game.

[poker-penguin]

If this happened more than once you are an idiot. I couldn't imagine how much more blatant they could get.

Definately tell them that they are not welcome at the game any more because they are cheating. Poker is not a team sport.

Then hit them in the face with a shovel.

[ds914]

Get the 11 other guys to collude against them. Let 'em see how it feels.

And, yes, then hit them in the face with shovel.

[benkath1]

Try handling this problem when you think one of the cheaters is your father in law, who also lives next door, who chip dumped to his other son in law after we'd gotten into an arguemant earlier in the night. Things can get a little tense.

I like the shovel idea, but I just wouldn't invite them back, or confront them in front of the whole crowd. I had a problem with one of my guys looking at all the cards people would fold. So before the next tournament, I made an announcement that the dealer is responsible for all the mucked cards and NOBODY was to be looking at them. I didn't single anybody out, just made everyone aware that it hasn't gone unnoticed.

[UATrewqaz]

It's very simple, say you and a few others have noticed very very suspicious and pretty blatent collusion between them and you no longer wish to have them in your game. They'll deny it of course but just say that everyone else would be more comfortable without them, regardless of their innocence/guilt.

Approach them away from the table, and let them know that you know. The diplomatic thing to do is give a warning, but to cheaters, warning them is akin to saying, "Cheat better."

[terrapin314]

You could approach them about it, but I am fond of the shovel idea.

[Cosimo]

I suggest printing out this thread, taking a magic marker to it liberally (to hide the origin, lest these fish learn how to play), then photocopy it and leave it laying about. Take up an informal poll: "If people at this game are colluding, should the rest of us (A) forfeit their entry fee, (B) ban them, (C) take a shovel to their face, (D) all of the above?"

But that still leaves them with the impression that they just need to cheat better. So just go with D yourself.

[Greg J]

I am not, by nature, a violent person, but the shovel idea sounds pretty nice. Seriously, or a good ass whoopin. A couple of broken ribs and a few chipped teeth might make them behave more ethicially in the future.

Oh, and it should go without saying you don't invite them back. What are you thinking having let it go on this long? I still think an ass kicking on general principle is in order, but that is optional. Letting them play with you again is not.

[RiverFenix]

If two people are continually beating 12 other people the players in your home game arent any good. Ignoring the obvious advice 2+2 advice of hitting them in the face with a shovel, why dont you ask for other advice on how to get better at poker.

[PokerCat69]

Don't let them play in your game anymore.

[SheetWise]

Are you guys talking about a little garden shovel, or one of those big suckers they use for coal ovens?

[Greg J]

[ QUOTE ]
Are you guys talking about a little garden shovel, or one of those big suckers they use for coal ovens?

[/ QUOTE ]
I think that all depends on if we are planning to hit the guys in a stabbling motion or give them a good wack. If we are stabbing, the trowel, if we are whacking, the big ass mo fo. (I assumed the latter.)

[poker-penguin]

The combination of hit and face suggests it would be a striking motion with either the flat, or the edge of the implement.

Definately a big grave-digger shovel, preferably outside so you can get a good windup.

[Redd]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Are you guys talking about a little garden shovel, or one of those big suckers they use for coal ovens?

[/ QUOTE ]
I think that all depends on if we are planning to hit the guys in a stabbling motion or give them a good wack. If we are stabbing, the trowel, if we are whacking, the big ass mo fo. (I assumed the latter.)

[/ QUOTE ]

Why not the best of both worlds?

http://akamai.globalsources.com.edgesuite.net/f/593/3445/5d/pdt.static.globalsources.com/IMAGES/PDT/SMALL/110/S1000705110.jpg

[SheetWise]

Allright then. For a while there I thought maybe you guys were just blowin' smoke.

Ball Peen Hammers are good too.

[MicroBob]

[ QUOTE ]

If two people are continually beating 12 other people the players in your home game arent any good.

[/ QUOTE ]


yeah. this is what I thought.
They're both consistently making the final 3?
Huh??


As far as what to do about it....it seems that your recent strategy has been to tolerate it, not tell them, continue to let them get-away with it, etc.
Is it not obvious to you that this strategy hasn't been working?
I think a retarded monkey could figure out that what you have done so far (being NOTHING) will not prevent them from doing it in the future.


The ideas of:
a - tell them to stop
b - stop inviting them to your game

are both pretty freaking obvious. Up to you to decide which one you want to take.

That's truly pathetic on their part. An ass kicking is in order.

[poker-penguin]

MicroBob,

1) You forgot to tell OP to "hit them in the face with a shovel"
2) It's spelt retarted.

Please try harder to fit in or we will be forced to take disciplinary action.

The Gang

[CORed]

[ QUOTE ]
The combination of hit and face suggests it would be a striking motion with either the flat, or the edge of the implement.

Definately a big grave-digger shovel, preferably outside so you can get a good windup.

[/ QUOTE ]

Also, you don't want blood on the carpet.

[Duffman]

Is it really colluding when all they're doing is not betting into each other? I can imagine 2 guys in a casino who don't bet against each other because they're friends.

Or lets say you're at a table with three pros. The pros aren't going to be doing much betting against each other, and the three of them will usually wind up with the money at the end of their sessions.

[SayGN]

*Grunching*

I suggest hitting them in the face with a shovel.

-In all honesty, if these people were really worth being your friends...they wouldnt be cheating in a friendly poker game. Don't let them play anymore.

[Victor]

[ QUOTE ]
s it really colluding when all they're doing is not betting into each other? I can imagine 2 guys in a casino who don't bet against each other because they're friends.

[/ QUOTE ]


its colluding if its a tourney.

hu in a ring game is usually ok.

[Oilcan]

Make a new house rule.

The winner of the last tourney.

MUST DEAL THE NEXT ONE.

We had this at one of my old home games.

[sinfulslick18]

Garden hoses work better for beatings..hurt more and leave one hell of a bruise