Anyone else fold KK here preflop?

[SirFelixCat]

Playing $1/$2 ($200max) NL live last weekend. Been at the table since it opened in the early evening. Built my stack to @ $750. Villan has @$350. Read on him is he is solid, but has LAG-ish qualities. Will only reraise with made/very solid hands.

I'm UTG and find KK. I raise to $23 (not an over the top raise for the table as most have large stacks compared to the buy-in...avg is $300+...also, we had a "prime number" joke running for raises at the table, hence the $23). Folded to villan in MP who starts talking to me and reraises me $80 more. Folded around to me. I go in the tank for about a minute and look him over. He seems quite relaxed and is talking to me the whole time. Finally, I decide to lay it down and toss him my K's face up. His face drops and asks "How did you get away from K's?" I smiled and said, "Easily when you have Aces" /images/graemlins/cool.gif He flashed black A's to the table and I feel like a million bucks.

Am I making too much of this? Is this "normal" to be able to lay down a big PP preflop?

[xorbie]

Online? Never. Live, if you have a read. Seems like you had a read. Can't see how any of us can help you here.

[PokerCat69]

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Online? Never. Live, if you have a read. Seems like you had a read. Can't see how any of us can help you here.

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Agree 100%

[kingofswing]

Better be a damn good read to fold to just a raise and not a reraise. Good play, although I bet a lot of times it's not AA he shows.

[Godfather80]

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Better be a damn good read to fold to just a raise and not a reraise. Good play, although I bet a lot of times it's not AA he shows.

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100% agree.

[krazyace5]

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Better be a damn good read to fold to just a raise and not a reraise. Good play, although I bet a lot of times it's not AA he shows.

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100% agree.

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But it was a reraise.

[Godfather80]

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Better be a damn good read to fold to just a raise and not a reraise. Good play, although I bet a lot of times it's not AA he shows.

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100% agree.

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But it was a reraise.

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200% agree, then. Huh? I'm dumb.

Although I do agree that laying KK down for just a raise better be a damn good read.

[jhall23]

I'm not sure I really like the idea of showing this laydown to the villian. Even if I am pretty confident in my read, I don't want the table to know that I am capable of making this good of a laydown (unless maybe I was having a fun game with friends). If he is so willing to play your game, as he was in this hand, and show that he did indeed have AA then some simple table banter might have done the trick. I'd prefer to say I was making a great laydown and I can't believe it but don't show.

After making this laydown and showing it, just remember that people will be more likely to take shots at you so this will probably affect the range of hands they are putting pressure on you with.

[SirFelixCat]

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I'm not sure I really like the idea of showing this laydown to the villian. Even if I am pretty confident in my read, I don't want the table to know that I am capable of making this good of a laydown (unless maybe I was having a fun game with friends). If he is so willing to play your game, as he was in this hand, and show that he did indeed have AA then some simple table banter might have done the trick. I'd prefer to say I was making a great laydown and I can't believe it but don't show.

After making this laydown and showing it, just remember that people will be more likely to take shots at you so this will probably affect the range of hands they are putting pressure on you with.

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This makes a lot of sense. But, when I decided to show this, I, maybe wrongly, thought that my play would garner a ton of respect and therefore would allow me to get away with more, ie. bluffs and semi-bluffs.

To be honest, your interpretation never really crossed my mind. One thing that I did find advantageous about showing the laydown was that for the rest of the weekend, I played almost exclusively the $1/$2 NL game and each day there was someone who was at the table when I showed my K's. They told my "story" for me and this did have the effect that I wanted...I was able to steal more, but at the same time, it forced me to slowplay bigger hands due to getting, dare I say, too much respect on my raises.

Thanks for the feedback all. I guess I was just looking for feedback on the hand and whether others would/could do this as well. And yes, it WAS a reraise. To a single raise, I don't know anyone that lays down K's preflop.

[xorbie]

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I'm not sure I really like the idea of showing this laydown to the villian. Even if I am pretty confident in my read, I don't want the table to know that I am capable of making this good of a laydown (unless maybe I was having a fun game with friends). If he is so willing to play your game, as he was in this hand, and show that he did indeed have AA then some simple table banter might have done the trick. I'd prefer to say I was making a great laydown and I can't believe it but don't show.

After making this laydown and showing it, just remember that people will be more likely to take shots at you so this will probably affect the range of hands they are putting pressure on you with.

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Are you kidding? Laying down KK (or maybe other huge laydowns) and showing them can be very +EV at an agressive, tricky table. They will constantly be trying to bluff you out of pots later on, which is goot when you have a strong hand.

[jhall23]

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Are you kidding? Laying down KK (or maybe other huge laydowns) and showing them can be very +EV at an agressive, tricky table. They will constantly be trying to bluff you out of pots later on, which is goot when you have a strong hand.

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I can't remember the last time I was at an "agressive, tricky" table in a live 1/2 game. They have all been major fish tanks from my experience. I'd prefer the fish to play their usual game that I have a very good read on their hand ranges so that I can continue to be aggressive and take down pots. It can suck to have a run of horrible cards when people start taking shots at you. It would just be my personal preference based on my experience in the foxwoods 1/2 game to not show here.


If you do get cards however it is great cause as little as an overpair will be worth backing your stack in some cases.

Either way though, just wanted to point out that showing the laydown may greatly change the way people play against you and you will have to adjust to this.

I've never folded kings preflop live, but I would if I was sure I was beat. I've had kings preflop online 3 times when I felt the other guy had aces. The first two times I said to myself that I just can't fold kings preflop. If he has aces then he has aces. Both times he had aces and I lost my stack. The third time I had that bad feeling in my gut, I just folded preflop. He didn't show, but I was 80-90% sure he had it. I also hate the idea of showing the kings. You just have to live with not knowing if he had it or not. I don't want to have to guess everytime someone comes over the top of me if they're just pushing becasue of "that hand." It puts you in a spot where you have to make more difficult decisions, and who needs that.