KK vs. a solid player

[cold_cash]

The BB here is a very solid player.

Probably a 21/12/2ish type of guy. He's also probably a good hand reader. He might actually be one of you guys. I have a couple hundred hands with him.

He may or may not know that I'm a weak-tight pansy, but I suspect he does. At the very least I'm sure he's aware of my pre-flop raising and capping standards.

What's the best way to proceed with this hand from his flop bet onward?

Party Poker 3/6 Hold'em (10 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with K/images/graemlins/club.gif, K/images/graemlins/spade.gif. CO posts a blind of $3.
<font color="#666666">5 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, CO (poster) folds, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">BB 3-Bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero caps</font>.

Flop: (9.5 SB) 7/images/graemlins/spade.gif, Q/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 3/images/graemlins/diamond.gif <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">BB bets</font>....

[Fat Nicky]

Raise the flop, call down if he shows any more aggression

I think an important thing about the villains play is that he 3-bet out of the BB which usually indicates a bit more strength than usual.

[cold_cash]

[ QUOTE ]
Raise the flop, call down if he shows any more aggression

I think an important thing about the villains play is that he 3-bet out of the BB which usually indicates a bit more strength than usual.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think what might be even more important is that he bet right out on the flop after I capped pre-flop. That's what really got me thinking.

[bigalt]

I want to cap the flop, call down if led to on the turn.

Call down if check-raised at any point.

He's probably got at least 3 outs if behind. Is that low enough to consider yourself way ahead?

[crunchy1]

[ QUOTE ]
I think an important thing about the villains play is that he 3-bet out of the BB which usually indicates a bit more strength than usual.

[/ QUOTE ]
I was thinking exactly the opposite. It would seem to me that if BB was a "solid" player he would recognize that Hero could be open-raising light from late MP with a LP poster next to act. I would think that BB's range is pretty wide here.

[droolie]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Raise the flop, call down if he shows any more aggression

I think an important thing about the villains play is that he 3-bet out of the BB which usually indicates a bit more strength than usual.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think what might be even more important is that he bet right out on the flop after I capped pre-flop. That's what really got me thinking.

[/ QUOTE ]

Have you stolen the blinds much? He might think you're on a semi-steal considering there's a poster in CO. He might be waging a blind stealing battle. I would call the flop, call the turn and raise the river unless an A hit. Bet if checked to obviously.

[cold_cash]

I hadn't been stealing too much, but I'd only been at the table for a few orbits so I hadn't had too many chances.

I think the chances that he thinks I'm raising light are existent, though likely fairly slim. (Especially after my cap.)

[meep_42]

PF hand range - 99-AA, AK, maybe AQs
On the flop he leads into the PF capper, which makes me think he's taking a bet-3bet line, since if he has any decent # of hands with you, he should know you're probably decently aggressive. This makes me think AA-QQ, AQ is much more likely than 99-JJ and AK. There are no draws he's betting.

This being the case, I probably want 1 bet in on every street, unless I improve. You want the unlikey 99-JJ, AK-AQ to keep betting, while not getting murdered by QQ/AA.

So, let's see -
AA (6 combos) - way behind
KK (1 combo) - split
QQ (3 combos) - way behind
JJ (6 combos) - way ahead (discount to 5 because of unlikely bet out on flop)
TT (6 combos) - way ahead (discount to 5 because of unlikely bet out on flop)
99 (6 combos) - way ahead (discount to 5 because of unlikely bet out on flop)
AQs (3 combos) - way ahead
AK (8 combos) - way ahead
--
Way ahead of 26, way behind 9, split 1.

I think you probably lose more than 3 times as much when you're behind as you win when ahead if you raise a street. (unless you raise a scare card on the river and won't be 3-bet often).

So, I call, planning to call the turn.
[edit - upon further review, I think we can add KQ to Villain's pf and flop range, but can add 77 (where we're way behind) and 88 (ahead), as well.]

-d

[Fat Nicky]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Raise the flop, call down if he shows any more aggression

I think an important thing about the villains play is that he 3-bet out of the BB which usually indicates a bit more strength than usual.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think what might be even more important is that he bet right out on the flop after I capped pre-flop. That's what really got me thinking.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think the combination of the 3-bet pre-flop and the flop lead leaves you in an uncertain position. I don't think the range of hands he does this with is too wide (AA, KK, QQ, JJ, AK, maybe AQ (doubtful to me from my experience).

[DMBFan23]

in these situations I usually call-call-riverraise or I call-turnraise.

[Fat Nicky]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I think an important thing about the villains play is that he 3-bet out of the BB which usually indicates a bit more strength than usual.

[/ QUOTE ]
I was thinking exactly the opposite. It would seem to me that if BB was a "solid" player he would recognize that Hero could be open-raising light from late MP with a LP poster next to act. I would think that BB's range is pretty wide here.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is possible, but, I would take this more into consideration if our hero raised from later than MP2.

[cold_cash]

[ QUOTE ]
in these situations I usually call-call-riverraise or I call-turnraise.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't think he would bet the river with a hand I beat very often, and I think he would pay off a river raise even less often.

He can probably narrow my holding down to about 5 hands; perhaps fewer if I've made it to the river.