AA in trouble on 4th street

[augie00]

$114 turbo sng on stars
1st level so no reads, everyone has around 1500

blinds 10/20

I pick up black aces in MP1 and raise to 60. LP calls and BB calls.

Flop is Kc 7c 7s

BB checks, I bet out 100, LP calls, BB calls

Turn is 2h for (Kc 7c 7s 2h)

BB checks, I bet out 200, LP calls, BB thinks and raises to 500. I fold without much hesitation.

[durron597]

Raise more preflop. With your small preflop raise it's too likely the BB has a 7.

[Nottom]

[ QUOTE ]
Raise more preflop. With your small preflop raise it's too likely the BB has a 7.

[/ QUOTE ]

meh

[durron597]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Raise more preflop. With your small preflop raise it's too likely the BB has a 7.

[/ QUOTE ]

meh

[/ QUOTE ]

I know that I'm calling with T/images/graemlins/heart.gif 7/images/graemlins/heart.gif in the BB with that action to me.

[Nottom]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Raise more preflop. With your small preflop raise it's too likely the BB has a 7.

[/ QUOTE ]

meh

[/ QUOTE ]

I know that I'm calling with T/images/graemlins/heart.gif 7/images/graemlins/heart.gif in the BB with that action to me.

[/ QUOTE ]

Prolly, but I still have AA and shouldn't be afraid of a little action. I would probably make it 70 here, but if he called 40 he probably calls 50 too.

I don't see much point in raising any more than that.

[durron597]

[ QUOTE ]

Prolly, but I still have AA and shouldn't be afraid of a little action. I would probably make it 70 here, but if he called 40 he probably calls 50 too.

I don't see much point in raising any more than that.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is on Stars, the stacks are much deeper than Party in level 1.

[Nottom]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

Prolly, but I still have AA and shouldn't be afraid of a little action. I would probably make it 70 here, but if he called 40 he probably calls 50 too.

I don't see much point in raising any more than that.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is on Stars, the stacks are much deeper than Party in level 1.

[/ QUOTE ]

Which means I don't feel as bad about folding if the flop action is ugly.

[kuro]

Why not call and re-evaluate the river? I think your hand is just too strong to give villain credit for entering a raised pot with a 7 and lucking out to hit the flop that hard.

When you have aces, you're very seldom going to have the nuts on the flop or turn and if you fold them on this board especially with deep stacks where villains are more likely to make a move on you then you're going to spew a lot of chips. Just because a guy represents trips doesn't mean he has trips and certainly villain realizes that it's very unlikely that you have trips.

[augie00]

[ QUOTE ]
Why not call and re-evaluate the river?

[/ QUOTE ]

Because without one of the two river aces my hand is only going to get worse.

[ QUOTE ]
When you have aces, you're very seldom going to have the nuts on the flop or turn

[/ QUOTE ]

What does that have to do with anything?

[ QUOTE ]
if you fold them on this board especially with deep stacks where villains are more likely to make a move on you then you're going to spew a lot of chips

[/ QUOTE ]

Would you really call a tiny raise into two opponents, one who's shown considerable strength on three (3) rounds of betting already, "making a move?" That is surely just a joke and I missed the punchline.

[ QUOTE ]
Just because a guy represents trips doesn't mean he has trips and certainly villain realizes that it's very unlikely that you have trips.

[/ QUOTE ]

Both of those statements are true. But given the size of villian's raise and the action so far in the hand that the chance that he has a 7 is better than the chance that he doesn't? Furthermore, what kind of hand would villian check-call the flop with and then make a tiny raise on the turn with?

I put him on pocket deuces. Getting the 2 pair on the flop, and completing his boat on the turn.

Or at least one 7. ;-)

[durron597]

[ QUOTE ]

Both of those statements are true. But given the size of villian's raise and the action so far in the hand that the chance that he has a 7 is better than the chance that he doesn't? Furthermore, what kind of hand would villian check-call the flop with and then make a tiny raise on the turn with?

[/ QUOTE ]

A post oak bluff? He *knows* you don't have a 7.

I think I call and check behind/fold to a push the river.

[augie00]

Then how much are you calling on the river?

[Moonsugar]

And this is a bad thing for AA?

[durron597]

I guess 400. But he only has two moves, allin or check, so that question doesn't really matter.

Yuck. I know I don't like the turn fold, and I'm saying yuck because I'm uncertain of folding to a push on the river.

[durron597]

It is when I outflop you.

[kuro]

[ QUOTE ]
But given the size of villian's raise and the action so far in the hand that the chance that he has a 7 is better than the chance that he doesn't? Furthermore, what kind of hand would villian check-call the flop with and then make a tiny raise on the turn with?

[/ QUOTE ]

You bet 100 into a 190 pot on a 2 flush paired flop and then you bet 200 into a 590 pot on the turn. That's not exactly a real show of strength. It looks scared. I don't think villain has to have a huge hand to raise it 300 here when you and mp1 have shown so little strength. He has AK,KQ-KT,QQ-TT, or maybe is even semi-bluffing the flush draw light more often than he has a boat or a set here.

I think you play Aces too timidly early. Bet more on the flop like 2/3 the pot. Bet at least half the pot on the turn. Don't be afraid of going broke here with this hand. That's actually a pretty decent flop for aces.

[durron597]

[ QUOTE ]
He has AK,KQ-KT,QQ-TT, or maybe is even semi-bluffing the flush draw light more often than he has a boat or a set here.

[/ QUOTE ]

That is why I hate the turn fold. But I don't see him pushing any of those hands on the river. Maybe he c/red the turn to win a free showdown?

[augie00]

Ok, well since you're all so very wrong I'll just end this chirade, he and LP went to showdown and he had 67s

[kuro]

If the river is a K or a club I'm check folding to all but the smallest bet. If it's a blank, I'm betting smallish for value and calling a push.

[durron597]

[ QUOTE ]
If the river is a K or a club I'm check folding to all but the smallest bet. If it's a blank, I'm betting smallish for value and calling a push.

[/ QUOTE ]

You are in position.

[durron597]

You know, I just realized that LP is still in the hand. I SHOULD LEARN HOW TO READ.

Yea, this is a clear fold. BB is not going to c/r that small into two opponents without the goods.

Amazing how much the two words "LP calls" changes everything.

And next time raise more preflop.

[augie00]

[ QUOTE ]
If the river is a K or a club I'm check folding to all but the smallest bet. If it's a blank, I'm betting smallish for value and calling a push.

[/ QUOTE ]

Just curious, have you ever folded aces on a reasonable board?

[kuro]

I'll lay aces, but the board has to be a lot scarrier than K772.

[adanthar]

I think this whole hand is totally standard and well played, except I may've raised to 80 or 100 since the stacks are deeper than average or something. Okay, I may've bet 120 on the flop, but who cares.

That turn is a very very good time to bet/fold.