Gildwulf - folding QQ preflop at a $22

[pergesu]

I so desperately wanted to fold. Then I remembered gildwulf's post a couple days ago so I decided not to.



***** Hand History for Game 2383620138 *****
NL Texas Hold'em $20 Buy-in + $2 Entry Fee Trny:14041091 Level:1 Blinds(10/15) - Monday, July 18, 08:25:28 EDT 2005
Table Table 13766 (Real Money)
Seat 3 is the button
Total number of players : 10
Seat 3: zarvik ( $755 )
Seat 5: GDonohew ( $1260 )
Seat 9: NeoRJF ( $755 )
Seat 4: lars_vegas ( $865 )
Seat 2: maestra1715 ( $810 )
Seat 6: frozensanka ( $760 )
Seat 7: luckyriverzz ( $705 )
Seat 8: Hawkdoggydog ( $775 )
Seat 1: suited_cards ( $540 )
Seat 10: smooth200 ( $775 )
Trny:14041091 Level:1
Blinds(10/15)
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to frozensanka [ Qd Qc ]
frozensanka raises [60].
luckyriverzz calls [60].
Hawkdoggydog calls [60].
NeoRJF folds.
smooth200 folds.
suited_cards is all-In [540]
maestra1715 folds.
zarvik is all-In [755]
lars_vegas folds.
GDonohew folds.
Your time bank will become active in less than 20 seconds. If you do not want it to be used, please act now.
frozensanka is all-In [700]

[Olback]

I could fold q,q here.

BTW what post?

[pergesu]

[ QUOTE ]
BTW what post?

[/ QUOTE ]
This one (http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=singletable&Number=2890258 &Forum=f22&Words=%2Bstop%20%2Bfolding&Searchpage=0 &Limit=25&Main=2890258&Search=true&where=sub&Name= 34365&daterange=1&newerval=1&newertype=w&olderval= &oldertype=&bodyprev=#Post2890258)

Of course we see that later on he gets wtf_pwned. So maybe I should have just ignored it.

[Olback]

Thanks

/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[durron597]

A raise, two callers, then two allins? This is a spot I would probably fold QQ.

[gumpzilla]

So, you raise, get two callers, two pushes, and still have the callers left to act? I'm folding QQ here probably 90% of the time unless both pushers have already proven themselves to be hardcore donkeys.

[durron597]

[ QUOTE ]
A raise, two callers, then two allins? This is a spot I would probably fold QQ.

[/ QUOTE ]

On second thought... the way the action went it's probably more likely they have each other's outs instead of having me dominated. If it went raise push push it's probably AA or KK but with raise call call push push seeing AA or KK out there is so unlikely with 5 people liking their hand... anyone have thoughts on this logic?

[Karak567]

I call here. Too often you will be shown AK, AQ or JJ or lower. Even with two in front of you.

If you see AA or KK *shrug*.

A lot of players like to gamb00l and "take coinflips" at early levels and will push their low PP and get called by medium PPs and overcards.

[gildwulf]

so what happened;) And 'wtf pwned' is a pretty strong term:)

[gumpzilla]

[ QUOTE ]

On second thought... the way the action went it's probably more likely they have each other's outs instead of having me dominated. If it went raise push push it's probably AA or KK but with raise call call push push seeing AA or KK out there is so unlikely with 5 people liking their hand... anyone have thoughts on this logic?

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, I don't like it. You think that the second pusher is less likely to have AA or KK when you consider that there are three people remaining to act rather than one? While it's possible that the callers have A's or K's, it's also very possible that they have hands like T9s or 66. It's not like there's significantly more dead money in the pot with callers vs. no callers compared to the amount involved in the pushing, either. I expect one of the pushers to be showing me KK+ very frequently here.

[adanthar]

From now on I am gonna respond to every 'fold KK-QQ PF' thread with the buyin listed first and then a one sentence answer. It's quicker and gets my point across.

[ QUOTE ]
NL Texas Hold'em $20 Buy-in + $2 Entry Fee

[/ QUOTE ]

suitedcards's range is 2 cards that are suited or better and the caller's range starts with A9o, call