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Zag
02-10-2003, 06:10 PM
The ethics question here is whether or not to raise a stink. I didn't, but I really had to grit my teeth.

Playing $5/10 with a kill at Foxwoods. The hand is killed by drunken idiot to my right. Everyone folds to him and he checks. I have K/forums/images/icons/heart.gif Q/forums/images/icons/heart.gif so I raise to isolate him. Tight player in CO reraises. This is the first preflop reraise I've seen from him in three hours, so I figure AA, KK, or AKs. BB and Drunk call both raises, I call. CO is on the dealer's immediate right, which becomes important later.

Flop is A/forums/images/icons/heart.gif 10/forums/images/icons/heart.gif 6/forums/images/icons/spade.gif, giving me a draw to a straight flush. Drunk bets, I call (considered a raise, here), and CO raises. BB folds, drunk calls, I call.

Turn is a blank: [A/forums/images/icons/heart.gif 10/forums/images/icons/heart.gif 6/forums/images/icons/spade.gif] 4/forums/images/icons/club.gif. Drunk and I both check and, as the CO is trying to bet, dealer burns and turns the very lovely 5/forums/images/icons/heart.gif. Now I do not believe that the CO was angle-shooting, here. He had his bet out and was reaching, the dealer just ignored him, since he was "hiding" in the dealer's blind spot.

The dealer TRIED to just pitch the 5/forums/images/icons/heart.gif into the muck, expecting to get a new river card from the rest of the deck. By calling (calmly) for the floor, I at least got him to shuffle one of my 10 outs back into the deck. This, of course, ruined my chance for a check-raise if a heart did arrive, though I probably wouldn't have tried one anyway. (On the other hand, it enhanced my chances if a jack came.) In any case, neither a heart nor a jack landed on the river, and I lost the biggest pot I had seen in quite a while at that table.

When the floor came, I acknowledged that the CO was not angle-shooting, and I took the whole thing stoicly. However, I suspect that I could have claimed that the player missed his chance to raise, and the river card was there to stay. If I were loud enough (I can be VERY loud.) I think the floor might have been convinced.

Comments?

B.T.W. the CO did, in fact, have AA for the set.

Dynasty
02-10-2003, 07:54 PM
Asking for the 5h to be shuffled back into the deck is not an ethics problem. It's just plain right.

Hooting and hollaring in an attempt to keep the 5h as the river card would be a low-class play.

Al_Capone_Junior
02-10-2003, 11:03 PM
I was going to post a separate post, but Dynasty is correct, so I will agree with him.

it's never incorrect or unethical to insist that the rules are correctly followed. This applies whether it benefits you or not. Pushing for an incorrect ruling just because it benefits you is clearly unethical.

Al