Repeat Sex Offenders

[SuitedSixes]

This (http://www.cnn.com/2005/US/07/02/idaho.children/index.html) is getting to be too common. It seems like every time a kid goes missing, the story end with the phrase "repeat sex offender."

I have no idea what the percentage of success is of rehabilitation for this kind of thing, but kids need to stop getting killed by people who have already been locked up for this thing once. Especially since the fear of going back to jail is what seems to be making them kill.

Is it time that molesters are treated the same as murderers and put away for 20 years to life?

This really bothers me.

[trying2learn]

especially these tier 3 offenders - the ones who law enforcement EXPECTS will offend again. makes me f'n ill. i'd have no problem with a public lynching of this latest guy who - it seems - has done this again, and again, and again.

[Bulldog]

Gotta watch out for those sex offenders, like this guy:

Chicago Sun-Times (http://www.suntimes.com/output/news/cst-nws-molest01.html)

[liquidboss]

It is kinda scary, I typed my zip code into King County's sex offender search (http://www.metrokc.gov/sheriff/services/sex_offender_search/index.aspx) and there are a buttload of them right down the street. I don't have any kids but I don't like having level 2 and 3 dudes who have been convicted of 1st degree rape living 2 blocks away.

[cpitt398]

there is no rehibilitation for sex offenders besides chemical castration. Keep in mind im not talking about people convicted of stagetory rape or drunken date rape senaerios.

There is something wrong with these people. They have no control of their Id ( i think thats what it is called, freshman psychology was a long time ago). They are pretty much the equilivent of a dog.

[MHarris]

This has to be one of the dumbest court rulings ever.

[krazyace5]

[ QUOTE ]
This has to be one of the dumbest court rulings ever.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, I would take that all the way to the top, no way would I settle for that.

As for the sicko in the original post, I hope they have the death penalty. If not I guess he'll get taken care of in prison.

[[censored]]

Didn't read the post or thread but the answer is should be killed.

[Talk2BigSteve]

[ QUOTE ]
This (http://www.cnn.com/2005/US/07/02/idaho.children/index.html) is getting to be too common. It seems like every time a kid goes missing, the story end with the phrase "repeat sex offender."

I have no idea what the percentage of success is of rehabilitation for this kind of thing, but kids need to stop getting killed by people who have already been locked up for this thing once. Especially since the fear of going back to jail is what seems to be making them kill.

Is it time that molesters are treated the same as murderers and put away for 20 years to life?

This really bothers me.

[/ QUOTE ]

If I remember correctly from my Criminal Justice classes, phychologist have said there is no cure, Oregon has put this too work, when an person is arrested for child molestation, they serve their time....

Upon release, they are institutionalized for LIFE because their is no cure for child molestation, it is veiwed as a severe mental illness that is completly incureable.

It has been challenged in court and the ruling has NEVER been over turned in the state of Oregon.

I think this should be the way it is everywhere.

Steve

[stripsqueez]

i hate people bashing peadophiles

truth is you guys know nada about peadophiles - i dont know much either but i have represented several and have also acted on behalf of many victims

i have acted for lots of different crooks and the ones who to my observation exhibited the most genuine and profound remorse were peadophiles

i am always concerned to judge something i have no conception of - its easy to look at a person who has anger management issues and commits violent crime and understand where they are coming from - we have all had the urge to thump someone from time to time - but when was the last time you felt like having sex with a 6 year old ?

no doubt the crimes peadophiles commit are horrible but as a civilised society we would do best to try and understand whats going on rather than revelling in the soft target and promoting extreme views

stripsqueez - chickenhawk

[rusellmj]

[ QUOTE ]
i hate people bashing peadophiles

truth is you guys know nada about peadophiles - i dont know much either but i have represented several and have also acted on behalf of many victims

i have acted for lots of different crooks and the ones who to my observation exhibited the most genuine and profound remorse were peadophiles

i am always concerned to judge something i have no conception of - its easy to look at a person who has anger management issues and commits violent crime and understand where they are coming from - we have all had the urge to thump someone from time to time - but when was the last time you felt like having sex with a 6 year old ?

no doubt the crimes peadophiles commit are horrible but as a civilised society we would do best to try and understand whats going on rather than revelling in the soft target and promoting extreme views

[/ QUOTE ]

Great, let's try to find an understanding. Under lock and key like BigSteve suggests.

[vulturesrow]

[ QUOTE ]
i hate people bashing peadophiles

truth is you guys know nada about peadophiles - i dont know much either but i have represented several and have also acted on behalf of many victims

i have acted for lots of different crooks and the ones who to my observation exhibited the most genuine and profound remorse were peadophiles

i am always concerned to judge something i have no conception of - its easy to look at a person who has anger management issues and commits violent crime and understand where they are coming from - we have all had the urge to thump someone from time to time - but when was the last time you felt like having sex with a 6 year old ?

no doubt the crimes peadophiles commit are horrible but as a civilised society we would do best to try and understand whats going on rather than revelling in the soft target and promoting extreme views

stripsqueez - chickenhawk

[/ QUOTE ]

So then you are aware that pedophiles have very high recidivism rates?

[krazyace5]

[ QUOTE ]
i hate people bashing peadophiles

truth is you guys know nada about peadophiles - i dont know much either but i have represented several and have also acted on behalf of many victims

i have acted for lots of different crooks and the ones who to my observation exhibited the most genuine and profound remorse were peadophiles

i am always concerned to judge something i have no conception of - its easy to look at a person who has anger management issues and commits violent crime and understand where they are coming from - we have all had the urge to thump someone from time to time - but when was the last time you felt like having sex with a 6 year old ?

no doubt the crimes peadophiles commit are horrible but as a civilised society we would do best to try and understand whats going on rather than revelling in the soft target and promoting extreme views

stripsqueez - chickenhawk

[/ QUOTE ]

No one deserves to be bashed more. That genuine and profound remorse is because they got caught. Maybe you are confusing shame with remorse.

We know nada about pedophiles because we don't have a sick urge to have sex with 6 yr olds? This is stupid argument.

I never have had the urge to rape someone, to murder someone , to do many other terrible crimes, does this mean I don't know anything about it? Does this mean I can't judge the perpetrator that has done these crimes?

As a civilized society we should do the best to protect our children, our future, and to hell with pedophiles.

The fact that you have acted on behalf of many of the victims, I am surprised you do not seem to understand the major damage these people do to children, and it is not short term damage, including instant loss of innocenence, these children will struggle with this for the rest of their lives, many never being able to feel normal or safe or trusting, never reaching the potential they have a right to. In that regard they should be treated no better than murderers, imo.

If someone ever touches my kids they better hope the police get to them before I do??

[SuitedSixes]

Strip, I'm just talking about the nature of the escalation and the fact that they just don't quit, they just try to hide the evidence to avoid going back to prison.

BigSteve, I did not know about the State of Oregon. I saw that on an episode of Law & Order, but I didn't know that it was based on any state's laws. Oregon is on to something.

[Emmitt2222]

The Woodsman. Really good movie with Kevin Bacon. It doesn't make him look like a good guy or a bad guy, just a guy really struggling. Interesting stuff.

[SuitedSixes]

[ QUOTE ]
Duncan's arrest record goes back to a 1980 rape conviction in Pierce County, Washington, when he was 16.

His last address was in Fargo, North Dakota, where he was a registered sex offender, but he is listed as "delinquent" on the North Dakota offenders Web page.

"One of his outstanding warrants is failure to register as a sex offender in Washington," Wolfinger said. "The other is an unlawful flight to avoid prosecution out of Minnesota for second-degree sexual offense."

According to the Detroit Lakes, Minnesota, Police Department, Duncan was charged in early March with molesting a 7-year-old boy near a middle school in Becker County in July 2004.

The department issued a warrant for his arrest when he violated the terms of release from an April 5 court appearance.

Wolfinger said Duncan runs a Web site that advocates against prosecuting sex offenders. CNN was unable to locate the site.

In his 1980 conviction in Washington, Duncan pleaded guilty to abducting and raping a 14-year-old boy at gunpoint, burning the victim with a cigarette and firing the gun -- on empty chambers -- causing him to believe he would be killed, according to a description from the North Dakota sex offender registry.

Upon turning 17, Duncan was transferred to adult court where he pleaded guilty and was sentenced to 20 years in prison, according to the city of Fargo.

He was released on parole in 1994 after serving 14 years, but returned to prison for a parole violation in 1997.

[/ QUOTE ]

Brilliant.

[[censored]]

the thing about Oregon is it kicks ass.

[SuitedSixes]

[ QUOTE ]
the thing about Oregon is it kicks ass.

[/ QUOTE ]

but it smells funny. And then you got the whole "Beaver" thing . . . which could go back to it smelling funny.

But their kids are more safe.

[Colonel Kataffy]

It wouldn't be a problem if we just left them in jail. I don't know why this country so gung ho about locking up drug dealers and throwing away the key, but we seem to release and rerelease child molester.

[Bulldog]

Not bad, but then how could you ever convict anyone? The state is mandating that sexual offender=mentally ill, so at worst, offenders must be not guilty by reason of mental defect.

[Talk2BigSteve]

There are plenty of people that are [censored] in the head that have been deemed "Fit to stand trial." I am a liberal as well, but [censored] with a kid and I hope you die in the Pound Me In The Ass Prison System.

Steve

[BigBaitsim (milo)]

There is a subset of sex offenders who are truly sociopathic, and/or feel that their behavior is entirely appropriate. They have no motivation to change and will never be safe unless under constant supervision and/or incarceration. This is not all sex offenders, but these are the most dangerous and do the most damage. There is no treatment that has been demonstrated to work for them. Simply put, this subset of offenders will re-offend if given the chance. It is not if, it is when.

-Dr. Milo (a clinical and forensic psychologist, who has worked in the field, and has a fairly strong grasp of the literature).

[skoal2k4]

just goes to show that you can go to school for years (as a judge would have to) and still turn out to be a complete idiot. These judges are clearly in need of help or the defendants lawyer is completely incompetent

[sexdrugsmoney]

[ QUOTE ]
There is a subset of sex offenders who are truly sociopathic, and/or feel that their behavior is entirely appropriate. They have no motivation to change and will never be safe unless under constant supervision and/or incarceration. This is not all sex offenders, but these are the most dangerous and do the most damage. There is no treatment that has been demonstrated to work for them. Simply put, this subset of offenders will re-offend if given the chance. It is not if, it is when.

-Dr. Milo (a clinical and forensic psychologist, who has worked in the field, and has a fairly strong grasp of the literature).

[/ QUOTE ]

I would tend to agree with Dr Milo, though I am not a doctor and have never studied psychology. (great intro to me speaking my mind huh?) /images/graemlins/wink.gif

But I will say this... (it begins)

I believe people who offend against children are incurable. In Nabokov's novel "Lolita" Humbert was until his dying day aware of his desires, and partly disgusted at times but totally given in to them and rejoiced in them.

I doubt there would be any psychiatric drugs that could help a paedophile, I think the best chance would be the drugs that Tom Cruise calls "masking drugs", heavy anti-psychotics that would numb the patient, though probably wouldn't stop them if they are free to walk the streets.

I however disagree with all prison systems. There is a schaudenfreude (SP?) a "shameful joy" that many "good" citizens of post-modern socieites have of someone who commits an atrocious act and is sent to be subject to rape in prison.

I can't remember if it was Tolstoy of Dostyevsky(SP?) who said something to the effect of "show me a societies prisons and I'll show you that society" (horribly misquoited) and in truth, when we as a post-modern society(ies) look at our prison systems and the way the many "good" citizens feel about the justification of rape for offenders who commit horrible crimes themselves, we honestly can't say we have evolved much from the pre-modern populous of Rome who used to cheer on executions in the Roman Coloseum.(SP?)

I believe in total prison reformation, that every prison should be changed to sustain itself finacially and offer an environment where inmate violence is abolished.

One suggestion is for prisons to be changed to "farmind communities" and inmates made to work the fields. In this system an inmate would spend the rest of his life secluded from society, work a days work, and retire to a cell that resembles a nice "bedsitter apartment" and have better meals and TV etc.

I don't think the current system works. How can you possibly send someone to a place where "survival of the fitest" is the motto and yet expect them to be 'rehabilitated' into a passive society?

But in saying that let me make my point clear that, yes, the crimes of paedophiles are heinous and extremely damaging to the victims who deserve a 'proper childhood', and while I would not judge a victim returning to kill their once predator, I disagree with the prison system.

Cheers,
SDM

[BigBaitsim (milo)]

[ QUOTE ]
Not bad, but then how could you ever convict anyone? The state is mandating that sexual offender=mentally ill, so at worst, offenders must be not guilty by reason of mental defect.

[/ QUOTE ]

Mentally ill people are not necessarily "insane." In fact, the insanity defense is attempted in less than 1% of cases, and succeeds less than 5% of the time it is attempted. It never works for pedophiles.

[Bulldog]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Not bad, but then how could you ever convict anyone? The state is mandating that sexual offender=mentally ill, so at worst, offenders must be not guilty by reason of mental defect.

[/ QUOTE ]

Mentally ill people are not necessarily "insane." In fact, the insanity defense is attempted in less than 1% of cases, and succeeds less than 5% of the time it is attempted. It never works for pedophiles.

[/ QUOTE ]

You are missing my point. I'm replying to BigSteve's comments about Oregon taking sex offenders released from prison and locking them up in mental institutions for the rest of their lives, saying that these offenders have an incurable mental disease. I'm saying that logically, if all sex offenders are mentally ill according to Oregon, than all charged with sexual crimes could plead not guilty by reason of mental defect, and avoid prison in exchange for life in institutions. I'm not arguing the facts of what is going on, just the logical process.

[[censored]]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Not bad, but then how could you ever convict anyone? The state is mandating that sexual offender=mentally ill, so at worst, offenders must be not guilty by reason of mental defect.

[/ QUOTE ]

Mentally ill people are not necessarily "insane." In fact, the insanity defense is attempted in less than 1% of cases, and succeeds less than 5% of the time it is attempted. It never works for pedophiles.

[/ QUOTE ]

You are missing my point. I'm replying to BigSteve's comments about Oregon taking sex offenders released from prison and locking them up in mental institutions for the rest of their lives, saying that these offenders have an incurable mental disease. I'm saying that logically, if all sex offenders are mentally ill according to Oregon, than all charged with sexual crimes could plead not guilty by reason of mental defect, and avoid prison in exchange for life in institutions. I'm not arguing the facts of what is going on, just the logical process.

[/ QUOTE ]

You are assuming that someone with an incurable mental defect cannot be punished first. Oregon apparently does not accept that premise.

However I have looked into this some and I am so far unable to finf anything that validates what BigSteve said about Oregon law. I can tell you that we have a fair share of released sex offenders living amongst us.

[stripsqueez]

[ QUOTE ]
There is a subset of sex offenders who are truly sociopathic, and/or feel that their behavior is entirely appropriate. They have no motivation to change and will never be safe unless under constant supervision and/or incarceration. This is not all sex offenders, but these are the most dangerous and do the most damage. There is no treatment that has been demonstrated to work for them. Simply put, this subset of offenders will re-offend if given the chance. It is not if, it is when

[/ QUOTE ]

i suspect i acted for at least 1 such sex offender - it is scary to know that such people exist

it is of-course completely understandable that what the media feeds us in terms of sex offenders would come predominantly from this class as they would be most likely to commit the most heinous sex offences and therefore sell more news - i strongly suspect however that the sociopaths form a small percentage of the total

stripsqueez - chickenhawk

[stripsqueez]

[ QUOTE ]
The fact that you have acted on behalf of many of the victims, I am surprised you do not seem to understand the major damage these people do to children, and it is not short term damage, including instant loss of innocenence, these children will struggle with this for the rest of their lives, many never being able to feel normal or safe or trusting, never reaching the potential they have a right to. In that regard they should be treated no better than murderers, imo.

[/ QUOTE ]

i understand it enough so that i got to the stage where rather than exhibit that somewhat sick fascination when reading the statements of such victims i would try hard to skim over the detail if i could

i wouldnt want to say anything that trivialises the damage caused by sex offenders - ultimately i think it comes down to whether you believe that the penalty handed out by a civilised society should be the eye for an eye type or something else - i vote for something else

stripsqueez - chickenhawk

[mackthefork]

[ QUOTE ]
I have no idea what the percentage of success is of rehabilitation for this kind of thing,

[/ QUOTE ]

0%

Mack

[KaneKungFu123]

can u give one reason why sex offenders should ever leave prison?

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
There is a subset of sex offenders who are truly sociopathic, and/or feel that their behavior is entirely appropriate. They have no motivation to change and will never be safe unless under constant supervision and/or incarceration. This is not all sex offenders, but these are the most dangerous and do the most damage. There is no treatment that has been demonstrated to work for them. Simply put, this subset of offenders will re-offend if given the chance. It is not if, it is when

[/ QUOTE ]

i suspect i acted for at least 1 such sex offender - it is scary to know that such people exist

it is of-course completely understandable that what the media feeds us in terms of sex offenders would come predominantly from this class as they would be most likely to commit the most heinous sex offences and therefore sell more news - i strongly suspect however that the sociopaths form a small percentage of the total

stripsqueez - chickenhawk

[/ QUOTE ]

[Bulldog]

[ QUOTE ]
can u give one reason why sex offenders should ever leave prison?


[/ QUOTE ]

The Bill of Rights.

[raisethatmofo]

[raisethatmofo]

[BigBaitsim (milo)]

The sex offenders being "committed" for "treatment" under the Oregon law and many other states' Sexually Violent Predator laws are not your garden-variety sex offender. These are people who WILL reoffend. These are people who have no remorse or sense of guilt/wrongdoing. They have committed the most heinous of crimes and are all multiple offenders.

Are these laws Constitutional? The US Supreme Court has ruled that they are, but this assumes that the goal is treatment, and not lifetime incarceration. The former is constitutional, the latter would not be. Here enlies the problem with SVP laws. As far as I know, nobody committed as an SVP has ever been released.

Eventually, the various SVP laws will be challenged as nothing more than thinly veiled attempts to lock up people for future possible crimes. Courts will step in and invoke the Constitution (appropriately so) and many of them will be released. When this happens, some of them will commit further heinous acts of violence. Sadly, there is no easy answer. Locking them up forever is not Constitutional, but releasing them is ill-advised and dangerous (Disclaimer: I am speaking here in general, not about any specific person or persons currently committed.

[eastbay]

[ QUOTE ]

I have no idea what the percentage of success is of rehabilitation for this kind of thing.

[/ QUOTE ]

I've heard professionals in the field say "exactly zero."

eastbay

[krazyace5]

[ QUOTE ]
And if you wish someone dies because they're a sex offender, then F you and you deserve the same [censored] for stealing $10 out of mommy's purse when you were 11. I'm tired of people wishing harm on others.

[/ QUOTE ]

This post and the one before it are two of the most idiotic posts I have ever seen. I don't know why I let stupidity surprise me anymore.

[Talk2BigSteve]

I just did a check for my zip code and there is one not 1/10 of a mile from my house he moved in last month.

Child Molester (http://www.sor.mdps.state.ms.us/So_qryIndivid.asp?search_key=1046)

My nephew lives here and he is 14. This scares me. What do I say to my nephew???

Steve

[krazyace5]

Show him the pic of the guy and tell him to stay away from him, he's 14 he can handle the facts.

[BottlesOf]

Ask the guy if he's aware how much he looks the part.

[[censored]]

[ QUOTE ]
I just did a check for my zip code and there is one not 1/10 of a mile from my house he moved in last month.

Child Molester (http://www.sor.mdps.state.ms.us/So_qryIndivid.asp?search_key=1046)

My nephew lives here and he is 14. This scares me. What do I say to my nephew???

Steve

[/ QUOTE ]

SIIHP.


Sorry.

[BigBaitsim (milo)]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

I have no idea what the percentage of success is of rehabilitation for this kind of thing.

[/ QUOTE ]

I've heard professionals in the field say "exactly zero."

eastbay

[/ QUOTE ]

I've been a professional in the field. At present there are no forms of treatment that have demonstrated significant efficacy in treating that subset of sex offenders who are sexually violent predators. Some sex offenders can learn to control their behavior, but no treatment cures them.

[[censored]]

milo,

did you follow any of the Michael Jackson case? If so what are your opinions on him (as far as the likely hood of him being a/ or potential sex offender) based on what you know?

Do you often encounter sex offenders who claim/believe that what they are doing is just an expression of deep love? How common/uncommon are some of Jackson's other comments in the sex offender community?